Rebooting Ultimate Marvel: Should It Be Done?

[LASERlips]

To be on-topic, I don't think Ultimate should have been cancelled in the first place. It was alwasy a fucked up, edgy, dark mirror of 616, and should have remained as such.

To be more specific, I think Miles should have stayed in 1610--randomly bringing him and his family over to 616 because he had a cheeseburger magically hidden in his non-existent pocket was a mistake.


He is a legacy character, and that means having big shoes to fill before growing and coming into your own. By taking him out of his world and dumping him into 616 with a living Peter Parker, that notion becomes moot. He isn't a legacy, he isn't filling shoes, he's a knockoff. And, even worse, there is nobody left who remembers Ultimate Peter to recognize and acknowledge Miles' accomplishments.

[MarvelMaster616]

To be on-topic, I don't think Ultimate should have been cancelled in the first place. It was alwasy a fucked up, edgy, dark mirror of 616, and should have remained as such.

To be more specific, I think Miles should have stayed in 1610--randomly bringing him and his family over to 616 because he had a cheeseburger magically hidden in his non-existent pocket was a mistake.


He is a legacy character, and that means having big shoes to fill before growing and coming into your own. By taking him out of his world and dumping him into 616 with a living Peter Parker, that notion becomes moot. He isn't a legacy, he isn't filling shoes, he's a knockoff. And, even worse, there is nobody left who remembers Ultimate Peter to recognize and acknowledge Miles' accomplishments.

I agree that Ultimate Marvel was always a bit edgier and darker. But there's a fine line between being edgy and just being shocking for the sake of shocking. And by the time Ultimatum came out, that's all Ultimate was. Every issue or story was basically a contest for "How dark, bleak, and disturbing can we make this?" The problem with that is eventually, pretty much everything that people liked about the early Ultimate comics got written out, killed off, or negated. And outside Miles Morales and most of the Ultimate Spider-Man cast, there was nobody in Ultimate that was the least bit likable.

And as much as I like Miles, he alone can't carry the Ultimate line. And there's just not enough in the old Ultimate universe to work with anymore. Pretty much every major character that people liked is dead or replaced with some cheap knock-off. Is anyone really clamoring to read more stories about Tyrone Cash, Ray Connor, Mach Two, Jimmy Hudson, or Derek Morgan? No. And that's why I'm in favor of a full reboot.

[Baron of Faltine]

I agree that Ultimate Marvel was always a bit edgier and darker. But there's a fine line between being edgy and just being shocking for the sake of shocking. And by the time Ultimatum came out, that's all Ultimate was. Every issue or story was basically a contest for "How dark, bleak, and disturbing can we make this?" The problem with that is eventually, pretty much everything that people liked about the early Ultimate comics got written out, killed off, or negated. And outside Miles Morales and most of the Ultimate Spider-Man cast, there was nobody in Ultimate that was the least bit likable.

And as much as I like Miles, he alone can't carry the Ultimate line. And there's just not enough in the old Ultimate universe to work with anymore. Pretty much every major character that people liked is dead or replaced with some cheap knock-off. Is anyone really clamoring to read more stories about Tyrone Cash, Ray Connor, Mach Two, Jimmy Hudson, or Derek Morgan? No. And that's why I'm in favor of a full reboot.

Yeah..possibly trying to avoid the pitfalls of the old Ultimate universe, what with indulging way too much in what I could call "Markmillarites" where everyone act as complete unlikeable piece of human garbage that you love to hate, while at same time acting like they are hip and classy somehow. This of course in addition to questionable humor, gore, and fanservice like rain.
So a cheap copy of a Roger corman movie (even if Roger corman fantastic four was oddly quite decent character wise...)

[ed2962]

The problem with a full reboot is that you get rid of the bad, yes, but also the good. Make a narrative trick to get rid of some things but retain others? It can be done, it is done all the time, there are many tricks around (if it should be done is another question). Create again from scratch stories of the stature of Ultimate Spider-Man or Ultimates 2? Easier said than done.

Those stories are good, but "dated"? Which would be the problem, as long as they are good? The dated aspects can be easily updated if needed. If the "war on terror" allegory is no longer a thing, then make the Ultimates deal with a chain of left-wing dictatorships in South America under the facade of democracies. I would love to see Ultimate Captain America jumping without parachute in the middle of Venezuela...

Hmm...I wouldn't use the term allegory when discussing the war in terror aspects in those old Ultimates comics, they delt with the issue pretty directly. But more importantly, I don't think that the "war on terror" is dated at all. It's not like ISIS etc have all disappeared.

[the illustrious mr. kenway]

I'd probably get Aaron Diaz to reboot Ultimates. I liked his take on the Justice League. I'm curious what he would do if he got free reign over Marvel.

https://comicsalliance.com/justice-l...gn-aaron-diaz/

I agree that Ultimate Marvel was always a bit edgier and darker. But there's a fine line between being edgy and just being shocking for the sake of shocking. And by the time Ultimatum came out, that's all Ultimate was. Every issue or story was basically a contest for "How dark, bleak, and disturbing can we make this?" The problem with that is eventually, pretty much everything that people liked about the early Ultimate comics got written out, killed off, or negated. And outside Miles Morales and most of the Ultimate Spider-Man cast, there was nobody in Ultimate that was the least bit likable.

And as much as I like Miles, he alone can't carry the Ultimate line. And there's just not enough in the old Ultimate universe to work with anymore. Pretty much every major character that people liked is dead or replaced with some cheap knock-off. Is anyone really clamoring to read more stories about Tyrone Cash, Ray Connor, Mach Two, Jimmy Hudson, or Derek Morgan? No. And that's why I'm in favor of a full reboot.

I'd probably get new legacies Future State style or do what Bruce Timm did with Justice League Gods and Monsters.

[CrimsonEchidna]

Honestly, people gotta let the Ultimate Universe go. It definitely had its time but in retrospect, Mark Millar kind of had way too much influence on the characterization of so many of the characters. FF and X-Men both had rotating writers and IMO never really had much in the way of a stable voice. The whole novelty of the Ultimate Universe was starting over the origins from scratch through a modern lens, but it got so bogged down by continuity it pretty much undermined that point

And I feel like a reboot in general wouldn't really be "the" ultimate universe either, just another AU one.

[Thor-Ul]

Honestly, people gotta let the Ultimate Universe go. It definitely had its time but in retrospect, Mark Millar kind of had way too much influence on the characterization of so many of the characters. FF and X-Men both had rotating writers and IMO never really had much in the way of a stable voice. The whole novelty of the Ultimate Universe was starting over the origins from scratch through a modern lens, but it got so bogged down by continuity it pretty much undermined that point

And I feel like a reboot in general wouldn't really be "the" ultimate universe either, just another AU one.

Yep, the zeitgeist for the Ultimates already has been overcame. Rebooting it would end with a different line with the same name. Same as what happened with the 2099 line. Marvel has tried to redo the 2099 universe with specials than only use the 2099 name and concept but with different characters and in every other appearance, the writers just return to the original 2099 original books.
With an ultimate reboot would happen the same. And you really than you could write an Ultimate Captain America similar to what Millar made with him today? Even in his time, that version of the Cap had many detractors. Specially in France.

[Baron of Faltine]

Yep, the zeitgeist for the Ultimates already has been overcame. Rebooting it would end with a different line with the same name. Same as what happened with the 2099 line. Marvel has tried to redo the 2099 universe with specials than only use the 2099 name and concept but with different characters and in every other appearance, the writers just return to the original 2099 original books.
With an ultimate reboot would happen the same. And you really than you could write an Ultimate Captain America similar to what Millar made with him today? Even in his time, that version of the Cap had many detractors. Specially in France.

Millar dectractors had their good reason, otuside the obvious...But yeah...the moment for ultimate passed...Honestly I will be more intrested in Ultraverse reboot....

[Somecrazyaussie]

I did not know that.

Quesada said in a interview around 2009 that "Let's just say that I wanted to bring these characters back in a very big way, but the way that the deal was initially structured, it's next to impossible to go back and publish these books. There are rumors out there that it has to do with a certain percentage of sales that has to be doled out to the creative teams. While this is a logistical nightmare because of the way the initial deal was structured, it's not the reason why we have chosen not to go near these characters, there is a bigger one, but I really don't feel like it's my place to make that dirty laundry public."

Some believe it's because royalties have to be paid to the creators who are still alive. Others insist it's because of Scott Rosenberg's "producer" credit. Which he set up so that, although he may not be credited with creating a character, he gets a cut of the profits.

[Thor-Ul]

There is a lot of mystery surrounding the Ultraverse: from the cause of their selling to Marvel (from their coloring departament or the wish from Marvel to conserve their market share) to the reasons behind the negative of Marvel to bring back the characters : Either to keep away an unconfortable person, or because the royalties for the creators, the fact is than Marvel apparentely has no interest into resurrect them.
Maybe it could be something as simple as than Marvel thinks the characters don't deserve the effort to be resurrected. And Marvel already had his share of obscure characters to exploit before the Ultraverse characters.
Or maybe is just a matter of time for Marvel to use them again. Or maybe just in the moment when they are at risk of losing the trademarks or licences. Or it could happen in any moment and Marvel decides to use them. Unless, of course, they didn't because they are not potentially usable in a movie or a series for the Stream channel. The fact is than right now, the Ultraverse is deep down prisioner in Marvel vault and it is more probable a resurrection of the Ultimate Marvel line before the Ultraverse. And I already gave my opinion about bring back the Ultimate universe.

[Somecrazyaussie]

There is a lot of mystery surrounding the Ultraverse: from the cause of their selling to Marvel (from their coloring departament or the wish from Marvel to conserve their market share) to the reasons behind the negative of Marvel to bring back the characters : Either to keep away an unconfortable person, or because the royalties for the creators, the fact is than Marvel apparentely has no interest into resurrect them.
Maybe it could be something as simple as than Marvel thinks the characters don't deserve the effort to be resurrected. And Marvel already had his share of obscure characters to exploit before the Ultraverse characters.
Or maybe is just a matter of time for Marvel to use them again. Or maybe just in the moment when they are at risk of losing the trademarks or licences. Or it could happen in any moment and Marvel decides to use them. Unless, of course, they didn't because they are not potentially usable in a movie or a series for the Stream channel. The fact is than right now, the Ultraverse is deep down prisioner in Marvel vault and it is more probable a resurrection of the Ultimate Marvel line before the Ultraverse. And I already gave my opinion about bring back the Ultimate universe.

That's the thing though. Quesada did have an interest. But they couldn't forge ahead with it and the early to mid 2000's was definitely the time to do it. Sure, a lot of the properties weren't crash hot by the time they folded, but I loved me some Night-man.

[Mutant God]

I can imagine a story when some problem causes Miles to go through space and time and ends back to the day he got his powers in the Ultimate Universe and this time he decides to save Peter from death causing a chain reaction of changing the universe thus rebooting it at a certain point.

[Baron of Faltine]

That's the thing though. Quesada did have an interest. But they couldn't forge ahead with it and the early to mid 2000's was definitely the time to do it. Sure, a lot of the properties weren't crash hot by the time they folded, but I loved me some Night-man.

I would kill for some Rune, or at least a reprint! I am not asking the moon but at least allow us to get the old stuff

[K7P5V]

I would kill for some Rune, or at least a reprint! I am not asking the moon but at least allow us to get the old stuff

Indeed. BWS artwork is quite legendary, and Rune is no exception (IMHO):

[MarvelMaster616]

I apologize for negating this thread. I have been posting new videos in this series for weeks now. I just plain forgot to post them here. Here is the video I did for the Ultimate Fantastic Four.