Question about Alfred Hitchcock's Notorious

[Kieran_Frost]

Well that is an excellent point. Hitchcock was, err, notorious for his methods to get the best out of actors, most especially with women. I'm just not sure he had anything to do with Olivier in this particular case, as I think Hitch actually respected him.

I cannot for the life of me find this darn list. UGHHHH! I'm gonna have to go through each of his films on IMDB to build it myself. FML! But yes, he had a very... distinct... way of working with his actors. BUT, a lot returned, which means it couldn't have been too monstrous, maybe? Unlike James Cameron (where almost no-one returns); and I'm not surprised.

[Jim Kelly]

Grace Kelly was Hitch's favourite actor. When he found her, he found the perfect woman--that ice-blonde that he idealized in his movies. It's ironic that one of his movies took her away from him. She giving up acting after marrying Prince Rainier was a devastating loss to the director. She had promised to do one more movie after her marriage, but never made good on the bargain. Although he used other blondes in his movies, after Grace, they could never live up to her in his mind. That scene in VERTIGO (which you'll know what I mean, without giving away spoilers) cuts close to the bone with Hitchcock. It's one explanation for why he was so cruel to his female actors (especially Tippi Hedren). Had she not left for Monaco and stayed working in Hollywood, I can imagine there would have been a series of several Grace Kelly movies made by Alfred Hitchcock, rather than just the three.

[Kieran_Frost]

Ugh, let's give this a go... I think this is right:

ACTING NOMINATIONS FOR HITCHCOCK DIRECTED FILMS
LEAD
Laurence Olivier for Rebecca (1940)
Joan Fontaine for Rebecca (1940)
Joan Fontaine for Suspicion (1941) - WON [the only person to win an acting Oscar for his films]

SUPPORTING
Judith Anderson for Rebecca (1940)
Alberth Basserman for Foreign Correspondent (1940)
Michael Chekhov for Spellbound (1945)
Claude Rains for Notorious (1946)
Ethel Barrymore for the Paradine Case (1947)
Janet Leigh for Psycho (1960)

BEST PICTURE
Rebecca (1940) - WON
Foreign Correspondent (1940)
Suspicion (1941)
Spellbound (1945)

Grace Kelly was Hitch's favourite actor. When he found her, he found the perfect woman--that ice-blonde that he idealized in his movies. It's ironic that one of his movies took her away from him. She giving up acting after marrying Prince Rainier was a devastating loss to the director. She had promised to do one more movie after her marriage, but never made good on the bargain. Although he used other blondes in his movies, after Grace, they could never live up to her in his mind. That scene in VERTIGO (which you'll know what I mean, without giving away spoilers) cuts close to the bone with Hitchcock. It's one explanation for why he was so cruel to his female actors (especially Tippi Hedren). Had she not left for Monaco and stayed working in Hollywood, I can imagine there would have been a series of several Grace Kelly movies made by Alfred Hitchcock, rather than just the three.

Hitchcock and blondes. I should add to my previous comment: I have heard some stories about how he treated the actresses that was horrendous. And while he got several nominated, it wasn't as many as I thought. Quite a few of directors who have been around that long, have as many acting nominations to their films. So his methods didn't justify the means, in the end.

[Castle]

Well that is an excellent point. Hitchcock was, err, notorious for his methods to get the best out of actors, most especially with women. I'm just not sure he had anything to do with Olivier in this particular case, as I think Hitch actually respected him.

Hitchcock and performances...oh we need a new thread for that on its own.

Joan Fontane performance in Suspicion is apparently the only acting in his movies to win an Oscar for performance in comparison to I think William Wyler who directed 13 actors to oscar wins.

I would say one of the criticism of Hitchcock is that, some if not many of his characters never showcased deep humanity or felt like real- real human beings, they were like in another dimension of a human universe if you know what I mean, but I dont even see that as a true decisive flaw because I am sure that Hitchcock wanted that on purpose.

he did (bless him) refer to actors as cattle and he also said that his movies are more about the audience reacting than the actors doing things. Hitchcock said he puts the fear and suspense more in the audience than the actors, that was his style and it shows when you compare his films to other directors.

https://quoteinvestigator.com/2013/0...20are%20cattle.

''All Actors Are Cattle''
Alfred Hitchcock? Apocryphal?

[C_Miller]

I actually just watched Notorious for the first time this weekend. I would say I liked it overall, but it's not perfect and I'm not quite sure that it deserves the accolades I've seen it receive over the years. I've even heard the hot take that it's Hitch's greatest B&W film, which feels like it's pointed at Psycho though for me, it's much less concrete.

It was fine, however it didn't really get going until the party. I think overall, I didn't buy the romance between Grant and Bergman, which makes up a good portion of the first half of the film. I did find the end pretty entertaining as it kind of mirrored the end of North By Northwest where Cary Grant has to sneak into a mansion and rescue his love interest, a film that is already so inspired by a previous Hitchcock film, The 39 Steps. Everyone steals from the greats, but when you're Hitchcock, I guess that means you can steal from yourself.

One thing about Hitchcock and the Oscars that I find so interesting, especially when it comes to performance is that the film that I think is the best written, directed, acted in his catalogue was almost entirely shut out of the Oscars. That film is Vertigo. Stewart is brilliant playing into and against type and Kim Novak is given so much more to work with than the average Hitchcock love interest. I haven't seen Separate Tables, so I can't say if David Niven and Wendy Hiller should for sure be knocked off, but there is a reason we talk about Vertigo today and Separate Tables has been more or less forgotten. Also, not a fan of Gigi at all, so I definitely would not be upset to take away its wins and given them to Vertigo.

I know Vertigo is not everyone's cup of tea and I understand there are clashes between film fans and film critics over its place in the pantheon, but it remains my favorite Hitchcock after all these years.

[Jim Kelly]

Stewart and Novak should definitely have been nominated for VERTIGO. Some of the best acting from both of them. I haven't checked--but Edith Head was up for an Oscar every year it seemed and usually won, so it's possible she carried away a few Oscars for her Hitchcock work.

When I went to see VERTIGO for the first time, with all my film friends back in the 1980s, it was a special release. It seems to me that that movie had been pulled from distribution for a couple of decades. So when we saw it, we were seeing a lost gem for the first time. I just sat in my seat for a good long while when it ended, completely wrecked by the ending.

Why it was kept out of circulation I don't recall at this time. It might have been Hitchcock himself who withdrew it. Such a difficult personality--it might be studio politics that kept his pictures from gaining all the accolades they deserved.

[Kieran_Frost]

One thing about Hitchcock and the Oscars that I find so interesting, especially when it comes to performance is that the film that I think is the best written, directed, acted in his catalogue was almost entirely shut out of the Oscars. That film is Vertigo. Stewart is brilliant playing into and against type and Kim Novak is given so much more to work with than the average Hitchcock love interest. I haven't seen Separate Tables, so I can't say if David Niven and Wendy Hiller should for sure be knocked off, but there is a reason we talk about Vertigo today and Separate Tables has been more or less forgotten. Also, not a fan of Gigi at all, so I definitely would not be upset to take away its wins and given them to Vertigo.

I do wonder, if we retroactively gave awards, how Hitchcock films would fair. A lot of the performances have become quite iconic, and I guess there was a bias against Hitchcock (by some, the way some have a bias against sci-fi and fantasy now) that he was commercial and 'popcorn flick'. Despite that though... he got five Oscar nominations for directing. Not bad going. The most anyone's ever had without winning (tied with Clarence Brown).

I know Vertigo is not everyone's cup of tea and I understand there are clashes between film fans and film critics over its place in the pantheon, but it remains my favorite Hitchcock after all these years.

Stewart and Novak should definitely have been nominated for VERTIGO. Some of the best acting from both of them.

Sadly I fall into the 'not a fan' category. I do not understand why it's so beloved. I actually found Jimmy Stewart quite hammy in it. For a long time I thought I didn't like Jimmy Stewart as an actor, because I'd only seen him in Hitchcock films. It was once I started seeing his other work, I realised I just don't like him with Hitchcock. Something about his acting becomes very fake to me in their collaborations.

I haven't checked--but Edith Head was up for an Oscar every year it seemed and usually won, so it's possible she carried away a few Oscars for her Hitchcock work.

[from Wikipedia] Over the course of her long career, she was nominated for 35 Academy Awards, annually from 1949 (the first year that the Oscar for Best Costume Design was awarded) through 1966, and won eight times – receiving more Oscars than any other person.

None of her 8 Oscars were for a Hitchcock movie. Her costumes in To Catch A Thief (1955) were just incredible (and she was nominated for them). I think, scanning over the list, that was her only nomination for a Hitchcock film. I could be wrong, but I didn't recognise any of those other titles as Hitchcock??? (and no, I didn't click on all 35 to check, ha )

[Castle]

Stewart and Novak should definitely have been nominated for VERTIGO. Some of the best acting from both of them. I haven't checked--but Edith Head was up for an Oscar every year it seemed and usually won, so it's possible she carried away a few Oscars for her Hitchcock work.

When I went to see VERTIGO for the first time, with all my film friends back in the 1980s, it was a special release. It seems to me that that movie had been pulled from distribution for a couple of decades. So when we saw it, we were seeing a lost gem for the first time. I just sat in my seat for a good long while when it ended, completely wrecked by the ending.

Why it was kept out of circulation I don't recall at this time. It might have been Hitchcock himself who withdrew it. Such a difficult personality--it might be studio politics that kept his pictures from gaining all the accolades they deserved.

Vertigo is arguably the most unlikable role Jimmy Stewart ever played, I feel that is also why the movie flopped.

[Scott Taylor]

Vertigo is arguably the most unlikable role Jimmy Stewart ever played, I feel that is also why the movie flopped.

Yah, and the movie was so disliked at the time that Bell, Book and Candle, where Stewart instead of Novak is the one who gets played, fared much better. Of course, now that is reversed with Vertigo being on some top-ten best movie lists and BB&C nearly forgotten.

[Castle]

Yah, and the movie was so disliked at the time that Bell, Book and Candle, where Stewart instead of Novak is the one who gets played, fared much better. Of course, now that is reversed with Vertigo being on some top-ten best movie lists and BB&C nearly forgotten.

If it is any consolation to Stewart, Novak was a more convincing ice blond female character than Grace Kelly.

Also is it me or is Vertigo just kind of slow after the opening scene? it is a good movie dont get me wrong, but after the first scene where Scottie nearly falls from the roof, the movie does move a bit slow compared to a film like strangers on train, although in strangers on a train Bruno reveals himself very quickly that he was a psychopath, you just had to start wondering immediately how all of it was going to end.