Some random Multiverse-2 (e.g. Original Pre-COIE DC Multiverse) thoughts

[Buried Alien]

Some rambling thoughts on Multiverse-2, the present designation of the original, Pre-COIE DC Multiverse.

1. In COIE back in 1985-1986, we saw the original DC Multiverse disintegrated by the Anti-Monitor's antimatter waves. As of COIE # 11, it was impossible to detect even a trace of the old Multiverse and its worlds.

2. We now see, however, that Multiverse-2 still exists in some sense as a kind of "ghost multiverse," its component worlds now lifeless husks.

3. Barry Allen is presently trapped in Multiverse-2 on a simulated world that looks suspiciously similar to Pre-COIE Earth-One.

4. Pariah is the only being in the Omniverse who appears to be aware of Multiverse-2's continuing existence.

5. Pariah's objective appears to be to restore Multiverse-2, the embodiment of DC's Golden, Silver, and Bronze Ages, as the active, predominant Multiverse, but doing so would require the destruction of the current DC Multiverse that has replaced Multiverse-2.

6. Will this be DC Comics' "kill the past" (e.g. STAR WARS Sequels) moment? Considering how unenthusiastically old STAR WARS fans have taken that approach to the newer STAR WARS films, is this a good idea?

Buried Alien (The Fastest Post Alive!)

[Myskin]

Some rambling thoughts on Multiverse-2, the present designation of the original, Pre-COIE DC Multiverse.

1. In COIE back in 1985-1986, we saw the original DC Multiverse disintegrated by the Anti-Monitor's antimatter waves. As of COIE # 11, it was impossible to detect even a trace of the old Multiverse and its worlds.

2. We now see, however, that Multiverse-2 still exists in some sense as a kind of "ghost multiverse," its component worlds now lifeless husks.

3. Barry Allen is presently trapped in Multiverse-2 on a simulated world that looks suspiciously similar to Pre-COIE Earth-One.

4. Pariah is the only being in the Omniverse who appears to be aware of Multiverse-2's continuing existence.

5. Pariah's objective appears to be to restore Multiverse-2, the embodiment of DC's Golden, Silver, and Bronze Ages, as the active, predominant Multiverse, but doing so would require the destruction of the current DC Multiverse that has replaced Multiverse-2.

6. Will this be DC Comics' "kill the past" (e.g. STAR WARS Sequels) moment? Considering how unenthusiastically old STAR WARS fans have taken that approach to the newer STAR WARS films, is this a good idea?

Buried Alien (The Fastest Post Alive!)

My prediction.
They will restore both Multiverse 1 and Multiverse 2.
One will have the classic versions of characters (Superman, Batman etc) and the other one will have the legacy versions (older - or dead - Kal with Jon, Bruce with Jace/Damian whatever).
Just to be clear I am not saying that I personally like this idea, nor I can understand the reason why they are doing it. But most of what DC has been doing in the latest decade escapes me.

[Factor]

God, I hate the Multiverse-2 name lol. Sounds like it was spawned from Earth-2, yet it's supposed to represent all of the pre-Crisis Multiverse.
Something like Primordial Multiverse might have painted a clearer picture.

In my head-canon the Omniverse is composed of all main multiverses created by the major Crisis and reboots:

Primordial Multiverse: The original multiverse, from pre-COIE.
Unified Multiverse: Post-Crisis Earth, when every Earth seemingly merged together and the rest of the multiverse was "empty" for a time.
New (52) Multiverse: the post-Flashpoint Multiverse with its limited number of 52 Earths, as shown in Multiversity.
Infinite Multiverse: the current, post Death Metal version. The first since the original to house an unlimited number of universes. The current location of the Metaverse.

Ideally each one would preserve the continuities from the time when they were the "main" multiverse and they would actually be used for new stories.
I was hoping for something along these lines when Infinite Frontier was announced, but it wasn't meant to be.

[superduperman]

What happened to Earth 1985? Is that not a thing anymore? Have they just decided to ignore it? Or is this part of the not being able to figure out what counts and what doesn't?

[Buried Alien]

What happened to Earth 1985? Is that not a thing anymore? Have they just decided to ignore it? Or is this part of the not being able to figure out what counts and what doesn't?

That's a good question. If Multiverse-2 represents the ghost of the original Multiverse, then what does Earth-1985 represent?

Buried Alien (The Fastest Post Alive!)

[jaygon]

That's a good question. If Multiverse-2 represents the ghost of the original Multiverse, then what does Earth-1985 represent?

Buried Alien (The Fastest Post Alive!)

I’m also unclear as to why Pariah needs to ‘restore’ Multiverse-2. I was under the impression that the Omniverse already housed a restoration of ‘everything’, past and present.

[Dr. Poison]

That's a good question. If Multiverse-2 represents the ghost of the original Multiverse, then what does Earth-1985 represent?

Buried Alien (The Fastest Post Alive!)

Maybe Earth 1985 is in Multiverse-2? In any case, I'd love to see DC start telling some new stories with the Pre-Crisis JLA, JSA, All-Star Squadron, Freedom Fighters, Squadron of Justice, etc. I like the modern comics but would like some old school characters as well.

[superduperman]

I don't think I'm saying anything controversial when I say that the pre-Crisis universe was the last time DC had a stable continuity.

[ducklord]

I don't think I'm saying anything controversial when I say that the pre-Crisis universe was the last time DC had a stable continuity.

Oh, I don't think that's fair. The post-Crisis DCU was also pretty stable, all things considered. Hawkpeople and Donna Troy aside, of course.

[D.Z]

Earth 1985 isn't part of Multiverse 2.

[HsssH]

Earth 1985 isn't part of Multiverse 2.

So where is it?

[superduperman]

Earth 1985 isn't part of Multiverse 2.

Far as I know, it's never been mentioned outside of DDC.

[ducklord]

What happened to Earth 1985? Is that not a thing anymore? Have they just decided to ignore it? Or is this part of the not being able to figure out what counts and what doesn't?

If I'm understanding my DCU omnicosmic metaphysics correctly (and there's no reason to think I am), Earth-1985 and Multiverse-2 are two sides of the same coin:

Earth-1985 is the pre-Crisis multiverse, living life as though the events of CoIE had never happened. We had a whole silly thread contemplating what it might look like today a couple o' months ago. It has never officially been explored, and it's questionable whether one can even get there from the "regular" DC multiverse.

Multiverse-2 is another name for the Pre-Crisis multiverse, which the Empty Hand lays credit for destroying (even though that was, in the original telling, the doing of the Anti-Monitor). EH and the Gentry have been feeding off its remains for years, and Pariah explicitly claims that it's his fault it got destroyed.

These two claims seem to be contradictory, but I suspect, as with many things in the DCU, both stories are true. In the current DCU, the previous multiverse got destroyed to make way for the new one, generating more grist for the cosmic conflict machine. The tragedy of Multiverse-2 is a real thing, along with its orphaned children (like Power Girl). But it's also true that somewhere way out there in the omniverse, Earth-1985 continues blissfully along its merry way.

[D.Z]

So where is it?

Around where Multiverse 1 is but hard to reach, sames as Earth 52 and the Elseworld. The same as trying to travel to Earth Omega is not as easy. None of those new Earths from DDC show up on the map except Earth 2.

dc-infinite-frontier-0-earth-omega-1-1260030.jpg

[bat39]

If I'm understanding my DCU omnicosmic metaphysics correctly (and there's no reason to think I am), Earth-1985 and Multiverse-2 are two sides of the same coin:

Earth-1985 is the pre-Crisis multiverse, living life as though the events of CoIE had never happened. We had a whole silly thread contemplating what it might look like today a couple o' months ago. It has never officially been explored, and it's questionable whether one can even get there from the "regular" DC multiverse.

Multiverse-2 is another name for the Pre-Crisis multiverse, which the Empty Hand lays credit for destroying (even though that was, in the original telling, the doing of the Anti-Monitor). EH and the Gentry have been feeding off its remains for years, and Pariah explicitly claims that it's his fault it got destroyed.

These two claims seem to be contradictory, but I suspect, as with many things in the DCU, both stories are true. In the current DCU, the previous multiverse got destroyed to make way for the new one, generating more grist for the cosmic conflict machine. The tragedy of Multiverse-2 is a real thing, along with its orphaned children (like Power Girl). But it's also true that somewhere way out there in the omniverse, Earth-1985 continues blissfully along its merry way.

Speaking of Power Girl, what is her deal now on the current Post-Rebirth/Post-Death Metal/Post-Whatever earth. Is she still the 'survivor' from the original Pre-COIE Earth 2? Or is she still the version from the New 52's Earth 2 (who might have memories of the original version because of the post-DM ''everyone remembers their previous lives'' deal)? Or something else entirely?

And if Power Girl is the Pre-COIE version, then is she immune to all the changes to the timeline of Earth 0? And if she is the Pre-COIE version then how is Pariah the 'sole survivor'?

Last, but not least, on a non-PG note...what happened to the other survivors from Convergence who apparently went back in time and changed the outcome of COIE, saving (or rebirthing) the Pre-COIE Multiverse? Superman and Lois ended up becoming the mainstream Earth 0 versions, and I believe Parallax showed up once, but what about the Pre-COIE Barry and Kara? Are they going to tie into this event somehow?