How Would You Improve Wonder Woman's Role In Famous Stories?

[Guy_McNichts]

There's always talk about what stories will or should be adapted for future movies. Especially now, with Gunn/Safran's DCU in the pipeline, a certain famous or iconic titles are getting thrown around for inspiration. And, as we all know, Warner/DC just loves drilling the same well over and over.

Problem is, when it comes to the event/Justice League stories, Wonder Woman's role tends to be less-than inspiring. It's kind of hard to get that excited when, in the vast majority of these League stories and events, Diana's either a non-entity or they actively treat her like garbage.
I don't know about any of you, but whenever someone says they should just adapt, say, Morrison's JLA run for the next movie or follow the DCAU's approach, I always cringe and say, "Yeah...just make sure Diana's written better if you do."

So that got me thinking: how would you improve her role in these stories? If they were to be adapted into movies (again in some cases), what changes would you make so she has a more memorable or relevant part?

- vs. the Hyperclan
- Rock of Ages
- World War 3 (Morrison's JLA version)
- Tower of Babel
- The Death & Return of Superman
- the Cadmus Saga (from the DCAU)
- Justice
- Flashpoint
- Kingdom Come
- any of the Crises
- and any others you can think of

I have some ideas on certain stories, but I'll post them later.

[Gaius]

*cracks knuckles*

Injustice

Instead of the baby's first Lady MacBeth Super Simp given to us by the tag-team of the Neanderthals' at NRS writing room and Tom Taylor, Wonder Woman would be leading her own faction in the game independent of SuperStalin and BatGod based out of Themyscira, it's magical protections meaning it's beyond Superman's abilities to conquer it.

She's the one ultimately responsible for bringing in the heroes of the "regular universe" to their universe as Batman has gone full "metas can't be trusted" and his actively working with war criminals like Ra's Al Ghul and Harley Quinn.

[Guy_McNichts]

vs. the Hyperclan
This was a pretty basic story, but I would like if Diana's capture (if she must get captured) was better than one of the villains zapping her with heat vision and she's down for the count. Further, I'd like it if she managed to escape rather than get rescued by Batman and Martian Manhunter, and finally, offer more of a contribution to the final battle than beating one of the White Martians entirely off panel.

Tower of Babel
The contingency plan for Diana doesn't work because she doesn't have an single, exploitable weakness Batman can use against her. So, she evades capture and regroups with Batman to save the rest of the League (rather than he doing it alone and Talia doing yet another "I'm torn between my father and beloved" turn). Along the way, she catches on these plans against them originated from him and is suitably appalled. The rest of the story can carry on as it did originally.

Death & Return of Superman
If she must be included in this story--as opposed to the original where she wasn't involved at all--I wouild take a page from the DCAU's depiction of the Superman/Doomsday fight. Diana is around and wants to help Clark fight Doomsday, but he insists she focus on evacuating civilians and containing the damage. She reluctantly agrees, but by the time she can join in the battle, it's too late and Superman dies putting Doomsday down. She then feels guilty and torn whether she did the right thing, and it haunts her through the funeral and aftermath.
Later, as Superman is being revived and regain his powers, Diana gets involved again and does something critical to bringing Clark back, thus redeeming (for lack of a better word) herself.

Flashpoint
Barry's jackassed time-fart caused Themyscira to be destroyed, but Diana survived. In the Flashpoint world, she wanders the globe as a mercenary, only interested in fighting and testing her strength and skills. The heroes try to recruit her to save the day, but she's not interested and only cares about herself. But, by the end of the story, she shows up to help, proving that even in this messed up version of the world, she's still Wonder Woman.
I'll admit, I don't know how that can be worked around the rest of the story because the war between the Amazons and Atlantis is such a significant part of it. Or maybe Themyscira wasn't destroyed, but Diana did go missing, and that's what prompts Hippolyta to go to war? But I would seek something--anything--more interesting than Diana & the Amazons as a genocidal man-haters with no arc whatsoever.

Kingdom Come
My changes here would be relatively minor, because Diana does play a relevant part in the story. I would just want to make her arc clearer.
I'd include a scene where Diana is alone and praying to the gods. She expresses her doubts and worries, feeling lost and uncertain, and fearing she really is a failure. It's then revealed the god she's praying to is Ares, who answers her and encourages her to press on with strength and force. Basically, this would be her lowest point by actually turning to Ares for guidance. The next scene would be her putting on the Screaming Chicken Armor.
I'd also have Diana reach the conclusion she's lost her way and on her own rather than Batman lecturing her about the how the Amazons are wrong about everything.

Injustice
Yeah...don't make her the Lady Macbeth. The better and more logical thing to do with Wonder Woman in a story where Superman and Batman are mortal enemies would be for her to be the one stuck in the middle, either torn between which side to take or, if they're both assholes, the actual reasonable side.


That's what I got so far. I'll post more if/when I think of it.

[bardkeep]

Haven't read all of these but a lot of Elseworld story fix-its could be boiled down to "don't have her pining after Superman." I don't think she always needs to be a good guy, and as I've said elsewhere, I get why they always have her side with Superman - if you put them on opposite sides, it just becomes Superman vs. Wonder Woman no matter who else is involved. But at least come up with a good reason for it.

Great example is Red Son - the animated film actually did exactly what I'd do. Remedied the overt sexism of the GN without seriously impacting the story or Superman's arc at all.

The GN: She allies with Superman because she's smitten by him, loses her powers, becomes heartbroken and embittered because Superman didn't care enough about her when she was hurt, and sends the Amazon army after him only for them to immediately get whooped.

The film: She allies with Superman because she agrees with his ideals on paper, but becomes disillusioned with him when he becomes a tyrant. She tries to talk some sense into him and he attacks her - she doesn't budge but she does give up her last bit of faith in him. She flies off to Themyscira and hides from the world because she's given up on humanity. I also liked that she was a lesbian and Superman was seemingly asexual, immediately establishes "yep we're not going there."

I know some people will disagree with me here, but I can buy an alternate "evil" version of Wonder Woman who becomes overzealous or gives up on the world and goes into exile on Themyscira. What I can't buy is a version who's driven by her obsession with a man, e.g. Injustice.

Flashpoint
Barry's jackassed time-fart caused Themyscira to be destroyed, but Diana survived. In the Flashpoint world, she wanders the globe as a mercenary, only interested in fighting and testing her strength and skills. The heroes try to recruit her to save the day, but she's not interested and only cares about herself. But, by the end of the story, she shows up to help, proving that even in this messed up version of the world, she's still Wonder Woman.
I'll admit, I don't know how that can be worked around the rest of the story because the war between the Amazons and Atlantis is such a significant part of it. Or maybe Themyscira wasn't destroyed, but Diana did go missing, and that's what prompts Hippolyta to go to war? But I would seek something--anything--more interesting than Diana & the Amazons as a genocidal man-haters with no arc whatsoever.

I know how I'd do it. I think you could keep the major plot beats and include the Atlantean/Amazon war in a way that doesn't involve completely assassinating Diana's character.

I'd start with Diana arriving to Man's World and being so pissed by the state of things that she immediately takes out a bunch of corrupt world leaders and their military support. The world turns to her because they don't know what to do next, but she's just one woman who quickly realizes she messed up and acted without thinking, so things get chaotic. She calls in the Amazons to help, but the situation is out of control and they struggle to get things in order. The Atlanteans intervene with their own agenda and try to exploit the power vacuum, which kicks off the Atlantean/Amazon war.

Hippolyta and Philippus wind up getting killed and Diana's paralyzed with guilt and grief, so Penthesilea is crowned queen of the Amazons and becomes a zealot who stokes the flames of the conflict. You could add a lot of depth to the Amazons here as well - some of the Amazons could be loyalists, some could be dissenters, most just fighting for their lives because the Atlanteans won't let up. I'd sideline Diana for a while here while the battle gets out of hand and causes mass destruction, but when things are looking dire she comes to the Amazons' defense for the final battle, which ends as the original story did.

It still makes Diana a villain who does the wrong thing, but it gives her much more depth and her being so incensed by the horrors of Man's World that she acts without thinking feels a lot more in character than the Amazons just deciding to be conquerors.

[John Venus]

Kingdom Come

Ah, the original sin.

I would explore how Diana failed her mission, how she became an exile and how the Amazons felt about her being gone. No doubt Hippolyta would be depressed and some Amazons wouldn't be content with it. I would explore what happened to Steve, Etta, Donna and Cassie in this universe as well as her rogues.

Then I would deal with the KC epilogue. I actually love KC's extended epilogue that Alex Ross. That was some beautiful storytelling. I wouldn't retcon it but I would add to it instead. I would have Diana divorce Clark after a few centuries, go on a journey of self discovery and then develop her own hyper advanced civilization called 'Planet Themyscira' that lasts into the Legion's time.

Injustice

Diana was mind controlled or at some point outright replaced by Circe who is trying to drum up more chaos in the world by encouraging Super Hitler.

[Stanlos]

There's always talk about what stories will or should be adapted for future movies. Especially now, with Gunn/Safran's DCU in the pipeline, a certain famous or iconic titles are getting thrown around for inspiration. And, as we all know, Warner/DC just loves drilling the same well over and over.

Problem is, when it comes to the event/Justice League stories, Wonder Woman's role tends to be less-than inspiring. It's kind of hard to get that excited when, in the vast majority of these League stories and events, Diana's either a non-entity or they actively treat her like garbage.
I don't know about any of you, but whenever someone says they should just adapt, say, Morrison's JLA run for the next movie or follow the DCAU's approach, I always cringe and say, "Yeah...just make sure Diana's written better if you do."

So that got me thinking: how would you improve her role in these stories? If they were to be adapted into movies (again in some cases), what changes would you make so she has a more memorable or relevant part?

- vs. the Hyperclan
- Rock of Ages
- World War 3 (Morrison's JLA version)
- Tower of Babel
- The Death & Return of Superman
- the Cadmus Saga (from the DCAU)
- Justice
- Flashpoint
- Kingdom Come
- any of the Crises
- and any others you can think of

I have some ideas on certain stories, but I'll post them later.

Infinite Crisis annoys me to no end. After a whole year of stellar build up; and this theme around the Trinity being the pillars of the DCU; and that the fracturing of the Trinity weakens the efficacy and morale of the heroes; Johns and company go into the final issue of the series woth three main objectives or problems to overcome:

• There was the massive prison break on earth where all supervillains escaped at the same time with Psycho bringing along Doomsday,
  
• There was the Brother Eye Satellite which the heroes needed to find and disable.
  
• Finally there was the battle to defeat Superboy Prime, arguably the main event of the finale.

So there were three objectives and three pillars. But what does Johns do? He assigns Batman the task of defeating Brother Eye. The other two objectives are BOTH given to Superman with Doomsday being casually one-shot as they fly off to space.

You know what WW does for the final book? She is in a single panel with Cassie fighting Cheetah. She isn't seen again until after all the objectives are met. She stops Bats from killing Alex.

That is busted and stupid.

Each member of the Trinity should have been assigned one of the objectives to complete with each scenario driving home the thematic throughline about the Trinity.

Geoff Johns can say all the guilded words about WW he wants--when I look at his work it is clear he doesn't like the character. Maybe not on the level of DiDio's dislike but he is not a fan if his work is an indicator.

The Infinite Crisis example was so infuriating because the various writers across the DCU had given STELLAR support with Gail Simone setting up the Doomsday confrontation in the most epic way possible.

Batman created the satellite so it is Justice that he be the one to take it out.
Divvying up the Doomsday & Villains and the Superboy Prime objectives between Supes and Diana is a simple and obvious fix. I say the Doomsday objective should go to WW given that in the setup it is Dr Psycho who leashed him. It also is good from a story standpoint given her guilt for not being there the fist time Doomsday attacked (she was lost in space).

As Superboy Prime is the big bad, obviously the Supermen should deal with that.

[Stanlos]

Flashturd and its follow on New 52 is irredeemable. I would rather the Amazons decide not to send an emmisary at all. That was a GJ fanwank on steroids.

[John Venus]

Wonder Woman: Spirit of Truth

Wonder Woman is attempting peace negotiations between two governments at war.

A girl that Wonder Woman saves tells her that she is not relatable and doesn't understand her situation.

Instead of running off to Superman for advice and getting a secret identity, Diana goes undercover and meets the girl in secret. She begins to understand from a grass roots level, becomes friends with the girl and they learn from each other; where they are similar where they differ. Diana learns how there are things she can relate to with others and things that she will never be able to relate but can empathize with.

I would also set this during Wonder Woman Year Two or Three and have it as part of her learning curve on diplomacy.

[Zagre]

Most of the time they simply fail to give her a role. She doesn't even get to be a deuteragonsit, she has to be supporting player in someone else's stories, so they hal-ass her arcs or simply don't give her any.

[Gaius]

Wonder Woman: Spirit of Truth

Wonder Woman is attempting peace negotiations between two governments at war.

A girl that Wonder Woman saves tells her that she is not relatable and doesn't understand her situation.

Instead of running off to Superman for advice and getting a secret identity, Diana goes undercover and meets the girl in secret. She begins to understand from a grass roots level, becomes friends with the girl and they learn from each other; where they are similar where they differ. Diana learns how there are things she can relate to with others and things that she will never be able to relate but can empathize with.

I would also set this during Wonder Woman Year Two or Three and have it as part of her learning curve on diplomacy.

This actually sounds pretty good, even different enough from the actual SoT where it could get published now.

[Zahina]

Most of the time they simply fail to give her a role. She doesn't even get to be a deuteragonsit, she has to be supporting player in someone else's stories, so they hal-ass her arcs or simply don't give her any.

It's strange. It's like they don't know what role Diana should be.

[Guy_McNichts]

The Cadmus Saga
I don't have specific ideas because this was an ongoing story with lots of moving parts. But, at the very least, I would want Diana to be actually engaged with the conflict. Have her question whether the League really is in the right or does the government have good reason to be wary of them. Empathetic to Superman's distrust of Lex Luthor as he gains political power, but also understanding of Batman's growing concerns about the League, and trying to actually be diplomatic. Maybe she can reach out to Amanda Waller and, despite Waller's hatred for metahumans, they reach an understanding as the situation continues to escalate? And then together they can uncover some critical information that helps unravel Luthor's plans?
I don't know. Anything other than standing off to the side and looking sad while Superman and Batman argue.

Infinite Crisis
There's little I would change with Diana herself. Rather, the stuff around her needs to be adjusted. Golden Age Wonder Woman returning to give her a pep talk is fine...but telling her she's not human and needs to learn how wasn't. I would want her to offer something more encouraging. Nothing wrong with convincing Batman not to kill Alexander Luthor is fine...but it should not have come with the implication she was wrong to kill Max, and by god, they should've have Bruce apologize to Diana for how he'd been treating her! Maybe even use his resources to reveal that Max was a bad guy, thus clearing her name without jeopardizing Superman or other heroes? And ditch the secret identity and government agent ending...Diana just goes off to collect herself and find another way to continue her mission.
And I agree, they should've given Diana something more crucial to do in the actual plot, and yeah, leading the charge against the army of villains is appropriate.

Any time mind control or possession comes into play
No particular story in mind, because this is a trope that gets used a lot, but it's kind of a prime example of what I'm getting at with this thread. Considering how many villains in DC rely on mind control and possession, and given Diana's possession and mastery of the Lasso of Truth, she should be the game-changer or trump card any time Starro starts taking over people's minds or Gorilla Grodd telepathically manipulates people or Eclipso possesses people.
Creators, like the guys behind the DCAU, will say the Lasso is too powerful in such scenarios and makes the story too easy, but it doesn't. The Lasso doesn't break a story, it just demands Diana plays a relevant part in it. If she should fall victim to mind control, it should be because the villains managed to get the Lasso away from her.

DC vs. Vampires
I'm hesitant to include this among other stories mentioned ('cause it sucks), but speaking of the Lasso, there is a lot more that could've or should've been done with Diana. She could ambushed and turned into a vampire, but the Lasso should help her retain her free will. Now there's a ticking clock element as she's trying to help save the world from the vampire hordes while resisting her own growing bloodlust (and while we're at it, Damien does not resist his own vampire nature just 'cause). Also, playing with the idea that the Lasso's divine nature can harm vampires, it hurts Diana even as it helps her resist King Dick. So, you'd have a vampiric Wonder Woman fighting against other vampires with a weapon that hurts even her.

[Agent Z]

Interestingly, Warren Ellis did something similar to Diana's "facing an illusion of an implacable opponent she can't beat" idea in JLA: Classified but had Diana beat the illusion.

https://www.reddit.com/r/WonderWoman...l_trap_in_jla/

The plot takes place from issues 10 to 15 of JLA: Classified. It concerns the Justice League being tested by a creature known as Z, with the fate of the planet on the line. All of them face their fears or what Z thinks are their fears.

[Stanlos]

That he did! I have long felt that Warren Ellis eould do a helluva WW run. His missteps involving ultimately the mental abuse of several ladies has cadt a pall over his name. Though I read that he and the ladies came to an agreement, he remains problematic in the public as I learned here on the boards. Should it ever be reformed, and if he maintains or even improves in quality, I hope he gets a shot at Supes and Wondy.

[John Venus]

For The Man Who Has Everything

At the risk of igniting another power level debate, I think the JLU adaptation was better and WW's role was vastly improved over what happened in the comic.

I think for this one, I won't rewrite the story itself but write around it instead.

For instance:

-Mongul decides to invade Themysicra thinking Wonder Woman is weak and that the Amazons are much weaker only to get his ass kicked. Hard. You could also have Diana claim that she had trouble against him in FtMWHE only because she was recovering from a fight with a different villain at the time.

-A role reversal. This time its Diana who is in a dream world thanks to Circe and it's Superman getting his ass kicked by Circe while Batman tries to free WW.

-A story that uses Black Mercy but this time it's Donna Troy whose trapped in the dream world. It's Hyperion or Thia who trapped her and now Dick/Jason/Tim has to free her while Starfire/Artemis are getting their ass kicked.