possible signs of sexism, including weisman.

[WonderLight789]

I never got the Superman/Wonder Woman comparisons either. I mean it’s not like Diana is even the strongest or most powerful female character in DC (Powergirl and Supergirl are stronger/ just as strong and Raven/Zatanna/Circe are definitely more powerful)

Wonder Woman has beat both Supergirl and Powergirl and she was never stated to be weaker than either of them. In fact, those 2 characters don't have feats of strength as good as WW. And also we have stuff like this.

WW equal to SM.jpg

WW strongest girl 3.jpg

WW strongest girl 4.jpg

[BiteTheBullet]

Look at her easily blocking Kal El's punches, grabbing him by the throat and throwing him to the ground. She is just as strong as him, and her technique is what gives her the advantage instead of it being a standstill.

Kal barely survives when he is 2 v 1 them. The only moment where he no lonelger gets to turn around his losing streak is when he uses his heat vision (which they can't do yet).

And according to your logic Mystical, the reason why Cheetah is so strong is becauss she can take hits from Wonder Woman and throw her around. So if Faora can do the same vs Superman, we must assume Faora could also do what he does in Justice League, including overpowering all of them and easily dominating Steppenwolf

I disagree with you. She has superior skill. And for a kryptonian, no matter the sex, to be able to grab another by the neck doesn't strain their strength much. It isn't like she is lifting a 200 million pounds instead of just a man.

[Alpha]

I disagree with you. She has superior skill. And for a kryptonian, no matter the sex, to be able to grab another by the neck doesn't strain their strength much. It isn't like she is lifting a 200 million pounds instead of just a man.

Didn't say that, but Kal El didn't escape her grabing him by the neck. And yes she has skill, but she also blocks every punch. Have you ever tried to block a punch from a weightlifter? Hurts like hell.

I've stated all the reasons why she seems just as strong. What reasons do you have to believe she isn't? If it's just the fact that Kal El is fighting both of them, I would once again remind you that when he is fighting both of them he loses quite hard for most of the fight, with only 2 or 3 moments where he briefly makes them lose their balance, and then they go right back to smashing him up with ease.

[BiteTheBullet]

Didn't say that, but Kal El didn't escape her grabing him by the neck. And yes she has skill, but she also blocks every punch. Have you ever tried to block a punch from a weightlifter? Hurts like hell.

I've stated all the reasons why she seems just as strong. What reasons do you have to believe she isn't? If it's just the fact that Kal El is fighting both of them, I would once again remind you that when he is fighting both of them he loses quite hard for most of the fight, with only 2 or 3 moments where he briefly makes them lose their balance, and then they go right back to smashing him up with ease.

I've already stated my reasons. If you don't like them, we can always agree to disagree.

[Alpha]

Superman beat Faora in MOS so she clearly isn't stronger. He put down Zod too. And none of those characters shoed the level of speed and strength SM showed in JL. So no. Faora wasn't his equal. In the comics. WW was already capable of fighting Faora one on one. But the trend of usually beingg helpless against Superman continued. I wonder why........

When does Superman beat Faora?

[DochaDocha]

Didn't say that, but Kal El didn't escape her grabing him by the neck. And yes she has skill, but she also blocks every punch. Have you ever tried to block a punch from a weightlifter? Hurts like hell.

Hollywood fights tend to be scripted pretty stupidly. Superman didn't escape her grabbing him by the neck. She pulled a WWE grandstanding move by choke slamming Kal-El and then throwing him a quarter mile down the street into a bank vault door. TV and movies like to show guys get tossed around when the more strategic move would be to ground and pound.

As for blocking punches, that's just another Hollywood trope. Young Justice has that scene with Black Canary casually blocking and dodging Superboy's punches, which I thought was ridiculous. You're right, parrying punches is really hard to do, nearly impossible if the aggressor has any sort of skill, but TV and movies like to make it so that all you need is kung fu and you're unhittable.

My take is Kal-El was more powerful than Faora, though that's certainly up for debate. The only time it was really a fair fight power-wise was when Zod shed his armor and fought on Superman's level, but somehow Superman still won. I like the movie, but that part never really sat well with me. Zod had a massive skill advantage, and the power gap was nil, yet Superman still won? Not saying it's impossible, but not framed well.

[Alpha]

My take is Kal-El was more powerful than Faora, though that's certainly up for debate.

But is that belief based on anything in the movie?

[DochaDocha]

But is that belief based on anything in the movie?

I think the idea was that non-flying Kryptonians haven't fully unleashed their potential. Before meeting with Jor-El, Superman wasn't as strong as he was after he discovered his flying ability. Ditto Zod when he ditched his armor. It may just be that they unlocked the ability to fly while their strength and speed remained the same, but I don't believe that to be the case.

Again, it's my opinion and up to debate, but that's how I interpret it.

EDIT: I just rewatched the scene. The tide turned right after Faora gave her speech about how evolution always wins. I like to think that Supes had a more evolved version of the Kryptonian powers, so he basically gave Faora a taste of evolution. As we know, there was no way he was going to win a standard fist fight against her, so he had to leverage his advantages.

[phonogram12]

When does Superman beat Faora?

She doesn't.

End of discussion.

[WonderLight789]

She doesn't.

End of discussion.

Of course that she doesn't. We already know that she didn't beat him.

[Alpha]

Of course that she doesn't. We already know that she didn't beat him.

Yes she did. She is constantly blocking his powerful punches with ease and throwing him around. The only reason the fight ends is because she gets exposed to earth's atmosphere.

If you want to rewrite Man of Steel, do it on your own time

[BiteTheBullet]

Yes she did. She is constantly blocking his powerful punches with ease and throwing him around. The only reason the fight ends is because she gets exposed to earth's atmosphere.

If you want to rewrite Man of Steel, do it on your own time

Unless he actually gets beat, then I cannot fully say he was beaten. Did he get outclassed, sure, but he wasn't beaten.

[WonderLight789]

Yes she did. She is constantly blocking his powerful punches with ease and throwing him around. The only reason the fight ends is because she gets exposed to earth's atmosphere.

If you want to rewrite Man of Steel, do it on your own time

Due to skill. She ever outright overpowered him. She never KO him. And all of this against a SM that was far less experienced and still developing his power. SM still beat Zod in that movie. And his performance in JL far outclasses his own feats in MOS and of course far outclasses any other DCEU kryptonian including Faora. And why are you trying to get behind DCEU? This debate about sexism goes well beyond that. SM is clearly stronger than Faora in the comics. Just like he is stronger than Supergirl and Powergirl. WW has fought and even beat those 3 girls in the comics. But when it comes to the alpha male Superman, that's a different story. Shazam is not even half as popular or iconic as WW. But he has been given a bigger opportunity to look like an equal fighting SM than WW. Even though they literally share a similar power source. Only difference is one is a man and the other a woman.

[HestiasHearth]

We all know that many SnyderStans will proudly (we are so feminist!) pay lip service to Snyder "making Diana badass"...but only as long as she is the lone woman in a sausagefest JL and definitely only as long as she is not as strong, powerful, or story-centered as the bros. As long as she is thrown around by Superman like a ragdoll and outclassed by the likes of Aquman and Cyborgh, sure, SnyderDiana is a "badass." As much as I love Gal Gadot's embodiment of the character traits that, to me, best scream Diana (loving heart, compassion, selflessness, restorative justice, etc), in my headcanon, the SnyderDiana that we see in the Zzzzzzznydercut is just a WonderWomanInNameOnly concoction that Snyder and his fans worship for being a generic "badass warrior chick with a sword" who will save the decapitated heads of her foes as mementos.

[Agent Z]

We all know that many SnyderStans will proudly (we are so feminist!) pay lip service to Snyder "making Diana badass"...but only as long as she is the lone woman in a sausagefest JL and definitely only as long as she is not as strong, powerful, or story-centered as the bros. As long as she is thrown around by Superman like a ragdoll and outclassed by the likes of Aquman and Cyborgh, sure, SnyderDiana is a "badass." As much as I love Gal Gadot's embodiment of the character traits that, to me, best scream Diana (loving heart, compassion, selflessness, restorative justice, etc), in my headcanon, the SnyderDiana that we see in the Zzzzzzznydercut is just a WonderWomanInNameOnly concoction that Snyder and his fans worship for being a generic "badass warrior chick with a sword" who will save the decapitated heads of her foes as mementos.

And there it is. Even in a thread about sexism regarding another writer, Snyder still lives rent free in people's heads.