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  1. #211
    Dark Dimension Clea's Avatar
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    One of my favorite stories about Clea is "At the Bottom of My Garden," in Marvel Comics Presents #20. Clea wears the Flames of Regency and is now Ruler of the Dark Dimension. She is struggling to bring light and freedom to the worlds with the Dark Dimension but fears that eons of tyrannical rule by fear under Dormammu have left the peoples of the Dark Dimension unable to live in peace. The Flames of Regency act similarly to Sauron's Ring: they convey great power but relentlessly tempt Clea to turn to darkness and enforce her will on others. She refuses.


    She takes a break to clear her head and while walking, comes across a portal to a part of the Dark Dimension that she's never seen. She forces the portal to open to her, only to encounter a monstrous being that Dormammu had set as a guard to prevent anyone, including himself, from accessing a treasure that Dormammu wanted to keep locked away from everyone. The monstrous guardian almost defeats her. The Flames of Regency begin to fade but then she remembers a spell to summon the Vishanti's deathless light that Stephen had taught her, and she defeats the creature, only to discover that the awful treasure that Dormammu had locked away. It was a single beautiful flower that radiated power and light. She takes the flower back to the throne with her.


    Was the Dark Dimension once a place of joy and light before Dormammu and Umar arrived and began their reign of terror? Could Clea one day restore the power of Light to the Dark Dimension? It's an interesting thought.
    Last edited by Clea; 05-20-2022 at 02:01 PM.
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  2. #212
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    I haven't read my issues of MCP is ages, but that story sounds familiar.

    Personally, Clea was my main interest in all things Dr. Strange. I wish she had been used more in the Defenders after Stephen stepped down. She did have a pretty big role in the Red Rajah storyline by David Kraft. I think she was used in the Six Fingered Hand story, but am not 100% sure. Very happy to see her in the spotlight these days!

  3. #213
    Dark Dimension Clea's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Reviresco View Post
    Back to the topic of appreciation ....


    I'm pretty happy with the casting for Clea in the MCU, but were there other actress you visualized for the part?
    I still haven't seen the movie but I've seen plenty of pictures. I'm pleased with the selection. Charlize Theron is both beautiful and strong. She has a terrific range as an actor so she'll easily be able to portray whatever version of Clea that the next movie script calls for. I recall Benedict Cumberbatch commenting quite some time ago that he wanted his love interest to be someone authentically close to him in age: no teen/young 20s ingenue types that Hollywood is so fond of casting with older men, even though that is so creepy. So he got his wish there, too. Just going on looks, Amanda Seyfried might have been a good alternate choice. Maybe Annabelle Wallis. If they wanted to cast someone who wasn't a blue eyed blond, that opens up to a whole realm of possibilities. Marvel is quite astute with their casting, so the fact that they chose Theron for the role may indicate that they are going to portray Clea as mature, self assured, and powerful. Sounds like she is introduced into the film as a character who is at minimum Strange's equal, if not already more skilled and powerful, so I take that as a sign that they're going to skip right over all of the 'Clea as pupil' stuff and jump right into her being Strange's matched counterpart. Which is SUCH a huge relief to me.
    Live Faust, Die Jung.

  4. #214
    Astonishing Member Albert1981's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DigiCom View Post
    That's the thing about characters like Stephen & Clea. On the one hand, they can stand toe-to-toe with cosmic horrors like Shuma-Gorath & Satannish... but on the other hand, they can deal with the smaller terrors of ordinary people. Hell, Clea was a member of the Defenders, back in the day.

    I wouldn't get too wrapped up in power levels if I were you.
    I just don't want Strange to become too OP. Because those characters are kinda boring. I think Marvel writers struggle with characters like him in the comics and I'm a bit concerned they will with the MCU version too as time goes on. That being said, so far he's been great in the movies. Cumberbatch brings a LOT to the role. I wasn't a Strange fan until I saw him in the movies.

    The reason why I think it's weird to have Strange and ESPECIALLY Clea hang out with those characters I listed earlier is because she always felt like Dark Dimensional royalty to me. Those other folks are great (Ghost Rider was a childhood favorite of mine), but they are like "street level" magic users to me. Clea's a regal person. It doesn't match!

  5. #215
    Astonishing Member Albert1981's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Doombot View Post
    Vampires, Werewolves, Supernatural Swamp Creatures, Demons & Avatars of Ancient Gods... This sound exactly like the type of thing Dr Strange & Clea should be involved in. Yes, Dr Strange can face Outer Gods of horrifying power, but he's not above taking out a vampire or ghost.
    I guess I can see to a certain extent where you're coming from. But Strange and Clea are more trippy and psychedelic to me. For them to "get Gothic" seems so "strange" to me. But I guess I have to read some Strange and Clea comics to confirm this (which I will grudgingly do because I'm really lazy).

  6. #216
    Old-School Otaku DigiCom's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Albert1981 View Post
    I just don't want Strange to become too OP. Because those characters are kinda boring. I think Marvel writers struggle with characters like him in the comics and I'm a bit concerned they will with the MCU version too as time goes on. That being said, so far he's been great in the movies. Cumberbatch brings a LOT to the role. I wasn't a Strange fan until I saw him in the movies.

    The reason why I think it's weird to have Strange and ESPECIALLY Clea hang out with those characters I listed earlier is because she always felt like Dark Dimensional royalty to me. Those other folks are great (Ghost Rider was a childhood favorite of mine), but they are like "street level" magic users to me. Clea's a regal person. It doesn't match!
    Well, that's the problem with coming at a character late. Clea first appeared in the comics in 1964. She didn't successfully depose her mother Umar (learning her true heritage in the process) until 1985.

    Anyway, the best way to deal with heroes of massive power is to put them in situations where power isn't the answer. Over the years, Stephen has excelled at these... using his mind and his empathy to resolve a problem more than his sorcerous might. He even won the Tournament of the Vishanti, not by power or skill, but by using his brain.

  7. #217
    Dark Dimension Clea's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DigiCom View Post
    Well, that's the problem with coming at a character late. Clea first appeared in the comics in 1964. She didn't successfully depose her mother Umar (learning her true heritage in the process) until 1985.

    Anyway, the best way to deal with heroes of massive power is to put them in situations where power isn't the answer. Over the years, Stephen has excelled at these... using his mind and his empathy to resolve a problem more than his sorcerous might. He even won the Tournament of the Vishanti, not by power or skill, but by using his brain.
    That's a very good point. To turn it to Clea, right now in the current Strange series, right now Clea is leaning hard on her powers and downplaying her emotions and empathy. If she doesn't, her grief will overwhelm her and she'll be lost, just as Stephen is currently lost. She needs to lean hard on her own powers to control the two very different, clashing dimensional magic systems that she needs to wield right now. She's generally been far more empathetic and gentle in the past, but being soft or vulnerable won't do right now.
    Live Faust, Die Jung.

  8. #218
    Astonishing Member Albert1981's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DigiCom View Post
    Well, that's the problem with coming at a character late. Clea first appeared in the comics in 1964. She didn't successfully depose her mother Umar (learning her true heritage in the process) until 1985.

    Anyway, the best way to deal with heroes of massive power is to put them in situations where power isn't the answer. Over the years, Stephen has excelled at these... using his mind and his empathy to resolve a problem more than his sorcerous might. He even won the Tournament of the Vishanti, not by power or skill, but by using his brain.
    Totally agree with you on putting Strange and other magic users in positions where their intelligence and training come in handy. I thought the first Strange movie and WandaVision did a great job of the magic users finding creative ways to win battles as opposed to using mystical "brute force". So let's see if Strange, Loki and Wanda continuing doing that in the MCU.

    Thank you for explaining the history of Clea's family lineage. I appreciate it, dude! However, Clea was ALWAYS a regal and refined lady from what I understand. A Galadriel in purple. She's a broad...Er, I mean a woman who probably prefers wine over beer. The other dudes and women in the Midnight Sons ENJOY getting their hands (and claws) dirty. To me it would feel tonally off for her and Stephen to hang with them. I think the cosmic stuff suits Strange and ESPECIALLY Clea PERFECTLY. Like didn't she even tangle with Galactus's forces at one point?:

    https://www.looper.com/854509/the-un...-marvels-clea/

  9. #219
    Old-School Otaku DigiCom's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Albert1981 View Post
    Totally agree with you on putting Strange and other magic users in positions where their intelligence and training come in handy. I thought the first Strange movie and WandaVision did a great job of the magic users finding creative ways to win battles as opposed to using mystical "brute force". So let's see if Strange, Loki and Wanda continuing doing that in the MCU.

    Thank you for explaining the history of Clea's family lineage. I appreciate it, dude! However, Clea was ALWAYS a regal and refined lady from what I understand. A Galadriel in purple. She's a broad...Er, I mean a woman who probably prefers wine over beer. The other dudes and women in the Midnight Sons ENJOY getting their hands (and claws) dirty. To me it would feel tonally off for her and Stephen to hang with them. I think the cosmic stuff suits Strange and ESPECIALLY Clea PERFECTLY. Like didn't she even tangle with Galactus's forces at one point?:

    https://www.looper.com/854509/the-un...-marvels-clea/
    She also (possibly, it's complicated) had a fling with Ben Franklin.

    Honestly, in the comics (especially the current series), Clea is more Eowyn than Galadriel. She comes from a realm where treachery and violence are the norm, and once she gained some self-confidence, was able to defeat her mother (a being of power comparable to Dormammu) to gain rulership over it. She may enjoy the finer things of life, but she knows they must be fought for.

    As she said in Strange #1


  10. #220
    Dark Dimension Clea's Avatar
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    Strange #6 cover by Lee Garbett. Garbett will also do the interior pages.

    Blurb for the issue says that someone has stolen pieces of Wong's memories. It's up to Wong and Bats to investigate the clues to resolve the theft. Per Lee Garbett's Instagram, the issue touches on the events of Death of Doctor Strange in some way. Seems to be riffing on the title, 'The Big Sleep' so I'm hoping this means we're in for a stylish, noir-inspired mystery.

    Last edited by Clea; 05-23-2022 at 02:49 PM.
    Live Faust, Die Jung.

  11. #221
    Astonishing Member Albert1981's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DigiCom View Post
    She also (possibly, it's complicated) had a fling with Ben Franklin.

    Honestly, in the comics (especially the current series), Clea is more Eowyn than Galadriel. She comes from a realm where treachery and violence are the norm, and once she gained some self-confidence, was able to defeat her mother (a being of power comparable to Dormammu) to gain rulership over it. She may enjoy the finer things of life, but she knows they must be fought for.

    As she said in Strange #1

    Wow. I guess Clea is a "warrior sorceress" who's not afraid to brandish a sword? I like that!

    As I said earlier, I don't think Marvel Studios needs to get too bogged down in magical rules. I DO think that MCU viewers are getting more confused as to what kind of powers the magic users in the MCU have. Like we have time travel with the Pym Particles, but we also had time "rewinding" with an Infinity Stone. We had confusion over whether changing the past could change the future in Endgame, and when it comes to Strange in particular I have read comments about how he can use sling rings to travel throughout the "multiverse". But the first Strange movie meant "dimensions" when it came to multiverses, but in subsequent shows multiverses mean "alternate realities". Things are starting to feel like the comics a bit. It shouldn't really matter if the stories are entertaining, but I don't think Phase Four has delivered on that front (in my opinion). I particularly dislike how Disney is introducing NEW characters into the MCU. It's like they're DELIBERATELY making them uninteresting from my vantage point.

  12. #222
    Astonishing Member Albert1981's Avatar
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    Hey DigiCom,

    I remember you stating that you felt some "fatigue" with these MCU movies and shows last year? Do you still feel that way? I used to think that superhero fatigue would NEVER happen to me because I thought the MCU was so great, but I have to admit, I'm getting bored and tired of it a bit lately. I guess I'm more of a "casual" fan than a "stan". This movie reviewer (a big fan of the MCU) is starting to get bored of it too:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MmHD3iTU2lw

  13. #223
    Astonishing Member Albert1981's Avatar
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    I thought this anime/manga podcast which gave a review of the MoM reflects the opinions of MANY fans of the MCU who are growing weary of how Disney is doing things in Phase Four. One of the critics of Strange 2 complained about "not knowing what Stephen's powers are". But a lot of this stuff was explained in Strange 1, but Marvel Studios has released like a 75 new projects since that movie, so I don't blame him for not being aware of Strange's abilities. I think the MCU is actually becoming more like the comic books and that's hurting its accessibility to the general public:


  14. #224
    Jewish & Proud Feminist Shadowcat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Clea View Post
    One of my favorite stories about Clea is "At the Bottom of My Garden," in Marvel Comics Presents #20. Clea wears the Flames of Regency and is now Ruler of the Dark Dimension. She is struggling to bring light and freedom to the worlds with the Dark Dimension but fears that eons of tyrannical rule by fear under Dormammu have left the peoples of the Dark Dimension unable to live in peace. The Flames of Regency act similarly to Sauron's Ring: they convey great power but relentlessly tempt Clea to turn to darkness and enforce her will on others. She refuses.


    She takes a break to clear her head and while walking, comes across a portal to a part of the Dark Dimension that she's never seen. She forces the portal to open to her, only to encounter a monstrous being that Dormammu had set as a guard to prevent anyone, including himself, from accessing a treasure that Dormammu wanted to keep locked away from everyone. The monstrous guardian almost defeats her. The Flames of Regency begin to fade but then she remembers a spell to summon the Vishanti's deathless light that Stephen had taught her, and she defeats the creature, only to discover that the awful treasure that Dormammu had locked away. It was a single beautiful flower that radiated power and light. She takes the flower back to the throne with her.


    Was the Dark Dimension once a place of joy and light before Dormammu and Umar arrived and began their reign of terror? Could Clea one day restore the power of Light to the Dark Dimension? It's an interesting thought.
    I’m so glad you shared this. I completely forgot about it. I’ll have to dig this up after I’ve completed my move next week.
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  15. #225
    Astonishing Member Albert1981's Avatar
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    The stakes in the MCU are just WAY too low in my opinion. I can't believe I'm starting to agree with Scorsese and his ilk a bit more now. There's absolutely no sense of emotional danger in these MCU movies and shows anymore. And NOTHING is at risk. EVER. I was really angry when Marty made his criticisms severals years back, but it's weird how I've sorta fallen in line to his way of thinking. Which is really sad, because I think the MCU has so MUCH potential and Strange and Clea are such AWESOME characters who audiences should embrace wholeheartedly. These two dudes LOVE Marvel and the MCU, but I agree with their critiques of what Marvel Studios is doing lately:


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