Clea - Sorcerer Supreme of the Dark Dimension - Appreciation 2022

[Albert1981]

Well, so far what I've deduced is that magic in the MCU seems to universally be the ability to draw power from other dimensions and weave it into spells. It's technically energy manipulation all things considered (in my view). In that first Strange movie it was explained that sorcerers draw energy from other dimensions to make weapons, shields, portals etc. That's okay. If the Ancient One acquired energy from the Dark Dimension to make weapons, shields, portals etc is that okay? Or is it only bad if she did it to prolong her life? Kaecilius was mad at the Ancient One for prolonging her life by drawing power from the Dark Dimension, but then he sorta did the same thing afterwards after he drew power from it himself. Does that mean the Dark Dimension's energy has some sort of corrupting influence? Because Dormammu runs the joint and is a bad dude? And are the dimensions in Strange 2 akin to parallel universes? Or are the dimensions WITHIN the main timeline/universe? The Ancient One CLEARLY stated in Strange 1 that the slings could clearly travel throughout the multiverse. So why would America Chavez's powers be any different than theirs (or does that depend on the definition of "multiverse"). Since the MCU's diving into this multiversal craziness, I have to ask this question. Do sorcerers in the MCU, when casting more powerful spells, require special items like the Eye of Agamotto, to take the burden off of the casters (because casting spells "hurts" the casters)? And finally, since Clea is from the Dark Dimension, are her magical powers innate? Does that mean she was corrupted from birth due to the "evil energy" of the Dark Dimension? Because sorcerers like the Ancient One, Strange, Wong and Mordo have no natural magic within them, they have to get it elsewhere. Does Clea draw magic from other dimensions as well being born with it? I know that's a TON of questions, but I wanna know more about how magic works in the MCU and the Marvel Comics.

[DigiCom]

Well, so far what I've deduced is that magic in the MCU seems to universally be the ability to draw power from other dimensions and weave it into spells. It's technically energy manipulation all things considered (in my view). In that first Strange movie it was explained that sorcerers draw energy from other dimensions to make weapons, shields, portals etc. That's okay. If the Ancient One acquired energy from the Dark Dimension to make weapons, shields, portals etc is that okay? Or is it only bad if she did it to prolong her life? Kaecilius was mad at the Ancient One for prolonging her life by drawing power from the Dark Dimension, but then he sorta did the same thing afterwards after he drew power from it himself. Does that mean the Dark Dimension's energy has some sort of corrupting influence? Because Dormammu runs the joint and is a bad dude? And are the dimensions in Strange 2 akin to parallel universes? Or are the dimensions WITHIN the main timeline/universe? The Ancient One CLEARLY stated in Strange 1 that the slings could clearly travel throughout the multiverse. So why would America Chavez's powers be any different than theirs (or does that depend on the definition of "multiverse"). Since the MCU's diving into this multiversal craziness, I have to ask this question. Do sorcerers in the MCU, when casting more powerful spells, require special items like the Eye of Agamotto, to take the burden off of the casters (because casting spells "hurts" the casters)? And finally, since Clea is from the Dark Dimension, are her magical powers innate? Does that mean she was corrupted from birth due to the "evil energy" of the Dark Dimension? Because sorcerers like the Ancient One, Strange, Wong and Mordo have no natural magic within them, they have to get it elsewhere. Does Clea draw magic from other dimensions as well being born with it? I know that's a TON of questions, but I wanna know more about how magic works in the MCU and the Marvel Comics.

Kinda hard to read, but I'll take a shot at it.

Kaecilius was mad at The Ancient One for saying that certain magicks were forbidden. MORDO was mad for her using them herself. And yes, it looks like drawing energy from Dormammu is a Bad Thing™.

The dimensions in DS1 were indeed parallel universes, NOT divergent timelines. Before the end of Loki, parallel timelines didn't exist, so when TAO was talking about the multiverse, she didn't mean those. You can't sling ring to another timeline.

You may have forgotten this line from the first movie:

"This is a relic. Some magic is too powerful to sustain so we imbue objects with it allowing them to take the strain we cannot. "

We don't KNOW where MCU!Clea is from, or what her nature is, but if her backstory is similar to the comics version, then yes, her heritage would enable her to sustain more powerful magics than an ordinary human.

[Clea]

... And finally, since Clea is from the Dark Dimension, are her magical powers innate? Does that mean she was corrupted from birth due to the "evil energy" of the Dark Dimension? Because sorcerers like the Ancient One, Strange, Wong and Mordo have no natural magic within them, they have to get it elsewhere. Does Clea draw magic from other dimensions as well being born with it? I know that's a TON of questions, but I wanna know more about how magic works in the MCU and the Marvel Comics.

Clea is not 'corrupted' in any way. She is half Faltine. The Faltine are energy beings composed of magical energy so she has innate magical energy that is neither good nor evil. I suggest that you read the comics. Everything is very well explained in the comics themselves.

[John Venus]

Yep, people guessed that this was going to happen way back in the Dr. Strange appreciation thread. He is replaced by the end of the third movie with a Disney+ show to make the switch official.

Not too soon I hope. I still hope to see Benedict in a live action 'Triumph & Torment' movie introducing Dr Doom to the MCU.

[Albert1981]

Kinda hard to read, but I'll take a shot at it.

Kaecilius was mad at The Ancient One for saying that certain magicks were forbidden. MORDO was mad for her using them herself. And yes, it looks like drawing energy from Dormammu is a Bad Thing™.

The dimensions in DS1 were indeed parallel universes, NOT divergent timelines. Before the end of Loki, parallel timelines didn't exist, so when TAO was talking about the multiverse, she didn't mean those. You can't sling ring to another timeline.

You may have forgotten this line from the first movie:

"This is a relic. Some magic is too powerful to sustain so we imbue objects with it allowing them to take the strain we cannot. "

We don't KNOW where MCU!Clea is from, or what her nature is, but if her backstory is similar to the comics version, then yes, her heritage would enable her to sustain more powerful magics than an ordinary human.

Oh wow. I forgot about that quote completely. Thank you for saying it. And thanks for the answers to my questions. I think audiences WILL be a bit confused about what a "multiverse" is. Because they CLEARLY mean different things in Strange 1 and Loki. It has also been said that in Strange 1: "The Ancient One is essentially Boromir in this situation, pleading to use the One Ring’s power to his advantage in the fight against Sauron. The Ancient One is seduced by power, and she actively compromises the safety of (with no hyperbole) the entire universe as we know it by drawing any energy at all from the Dark Dimension. Period! For whatever reason! Let alone to prolong her own life!!! Kaecilius was, theoretically, 100% justified in his disillusionment and outright fury at the Ancient One. Imo."

I have also read some funny quotes (that I agree with) online, which describe the differences between sorcery and witchcraft in the MCU:

"Sorcerers are: "With this discovery that the circumference of a circle is related to its diameter at a constant of about 3.14159 and the more decimals we discover in this sequence the more finely we can predict the exact dimensions of a theoretical circle, we can more acutely describe and then predictably influence realty as it is by the nature of the Vishanti."

Witches are: "If I say that a square circle exists, then it exists and I will force reality to comply! Chthon, back me up on this!"

I was just curious to learn more about Clea's magic. I know it's innate. But from what I understand, sorcerers in the MCU are thus: "With what we know about magic in the MCU, witchcraft is innate. One must be born a witch in order to do it. Sorcery is learned. Theoretically anyone could learn sorcery, though granted it’s easier for some than others. That’s why sorcery has names for their spells while witchcraft is more “I think it and it happens”. Clea, to ME, sounds more like a WITCH than a sorceress!!!

Anybody here remember when Wanda talked to Agatha following her defeat of the latter? The Scarlet Witch stated: 'In a given space, only a witch who cast them (runes) can use her magic." Thanks for the lesson. But I don't need you to tell me who I am.' That was a VERY interesting "rule" to me, and apparently she forgot to all about it in Strange 2. I think it would be great if Clea knew about "rune magic" as well. Don't know if she does in the comic books.

I'm trying to figure out how the hell magic works in the MCU. It seems that the Scarlet Witch can "do magic" by "focusing" or whatever, but Strange has to move his hands and Agatha has to say a bunch of Latin gobbledegook. I still don't WHY she wanted Wanda's power though. I'm ASSUMING she sucks the "magical energy" out of other magic users to prolong her life and look like Kathryn Hahn. But that will probably be covered in Agatha's series. I just find it weird that Agatha has to do the whole "incantation" thing, while Wanda doesn't. So apparently witches aren't created equal in the MCU.

I mean Strange has his own special ways to prevent other magic users from using THEIR magic: "The use of the Mirror dimension is a similar thing, as it restricts magic in a specific space (in this instance, keeping it obscured from the real world). Aside from that in Infinity War, he put a lock on the Eye of Agamotto to stop Ebony Maw from using HIS magic on it." What I'm trying to say is that Wanda's, Agatha's and Stephen's magic can be NON-LETHAL when they use it a lot of the time, correct? What I'm trying to say is that if Strange/Wong/Mordo fought with Agatha/Wanda, Agatha's and Wanda's runes would NEUTRALIZE the magic of Strange/Wong/Mordo, right? I'm just talking about sorcery and witchcraft here. I haven't had the time to research into Asgardian magic as of yet.

[Albert1981]

Clea is not 'corrupted' in any way. She is half Faltine. The Faltine are energy beings composed of magical energy so she has innate magical energy that is neither good nor evil. I suggest that you read the comics. Everything is very well explained in the comics themselves.

Thank you for the answer. I must admit, I'm kinda lazy. So I was hoping to get a CliffNotes explanation of Clea's magic here. Instead of reading a whole bunch of comics. Sorry for wasting your time!

[DigiCom]

I'm trying to figure out how the hell magic works in the MCU. It seems that the Scarlet Witch can "do magic" by "focusing" or whatever, but Strange has to move his hands and Agatha has to say a bunch of Latin gobbledegook. I still don't WHY she wanted Wanda's power though. I'm ASSUMING she sucks the "magical energy" out of other magic users to prolong her life and look like Kathryn Hahn. But that will probably be covered in Agatha's series. I just find it weird that Agatha has to do the whole "incantation" thing, while Wanda doesn't. So apparently witches aren't created equal in the MCU.

I mean Strange has his own special ways to prevent other magic users from using THEIR magic: "The use of the Mirror dimension is a similar thing, as it restricts magic in a specific space (in this instance, keeping it obscured from the real world). Aside from that in Infinity War, he put a lock on the Eye of Agamotto to stop Ebony Maw from using HIS magic on it." What I'm trying to say is that Wanda's, Agatha's and Stephen's magic can be NON-LETHAL when they use it a lot of the time, correct? What I'm trying to say is that if Strange/Wong/Mordo fought with Agatha/Wanda, Agatha's and Wanda's runes would NEUTRALIZE the magic of Strange/Wong/Mordo, right? I'm just talking about sorcery and witchcraft here. I haven't had the time to research into Asgardian magic as of yet.

Part of the problem is, that we don't really have any information. We know (more or less) how Strange's magic works. And apparently, witchcraft uses runes, as Stephen & Wong recognize it as such in MoM. But can a runic barrier prevent a sorcerer from using his magic? What about Asgardian illusions? There's literally no data. And that doesn't even get into things like Egyptian magic (Moon Knight) or whatever it is Clea can do.

There's simply no data. So, until more happens, the best we can do is another quote of the Ancient One:

"The language of the mystic arts is as old as civilization. The sorcerers of antiquity called the use of this language spells. But if that word offends your modern sensibilities you can call it a program, the source code that shapes reality. We harness energy...drawn from other dimensions of the Multiverse...to cast spells...to conjure shields...and weapons...to make magic."

It's possible that witchcraft is a completely different thing. But it's also possible they use the same basic infrastructure. It's simply that sorcerers use Java, while witches use Python.

[Reviresco]

Well, so far what I've deduced is that magic in the MCU seems to universally be the ability to draw power from other dimensions and weave it into spells. It's technically energy manipulation all things considered (in my view). In that first Strange movie it was explained that sorcerers draw energy from other dimensions to make weapons, shields, portals etc. That's okay. If the Ancient One acquired energy from the Dark Dimension to make weapons, shields, portals etc is that okay? Or is it only bad if she did it to prolong her life? Kaecilius was mad at the Ancient One for prolonging her life by drawing power from the Dark Dimension, but then he sorta did the same thing afterwards after he drew power from it himself. Does that mean the Dark Dimension's energy has some sort of corrupting influence? Because Dormammu runs the joint and is a bad dude? And are the dimensions in Strange 2 akin to parallel universes? Or are the dimensions WITHIN the main timeline/universe? The Ancient One CLEARLY stated in Strange 1 that the slings could clearly travel throughout the multiverse. So why would America Chavez's powers be any different than theirs (or does that depend on the definition of "multiverse"). Since the MCU's diving into this multiversal craziness, I have to ask this question. Do sorcerers in the MCU, when casting more powerful spells, require special items like the Eye of Agamotto, to take the burden off of the casters (because casting spells "hurts" the casters)? And finally, since Clea is from the Dark Dimension, are her magical powers innate? Does that mean she was corrupted from birth due to the "evil energy" of the Dark Dimension? Because sorcerers like the Ancient One, Strange, Wong and Mordo have no natural magic within them, they have to get it elsewhere. Does Clea draw magic from other dimensions as well being born with it? I know that's a TON of questions, but I wanna know more about how magic works in the MCU and the Marvel Comics.

This is all fiction. It works however the writers and directors want it to work at any given time. How does the tech in Wakanda work? These are details that don't really matter. You are wasting your time looking for something that doesn't exist. Unless a movie / show has the exact same writers and directors every single outing, there is no expectation that any of these so called 'rules' are going to be consistent. It's even worse in the comics where you have a multitude of people over decades producing these stories, though at least there is the nod toward continuity and consistency. Heck we can't even get the characterization of major characters consistent most the time.


Are you seriously trying figure out how Clea's powers work in the MCU when there is literally ZERO examples of how her magic works, yet? When neither a writer or director, much less a script has been written? I mean, you don't even want to read her comics, and clearly the MCU doesn't follow the comics as far as magical 'rules', so what makes you think they are suddenly going to do so for Clea?

[Albert1981]

Part of the problem is, that we don't really have any information. We know (more or less) how Strange's magic works. And apparently, witchcraft uses runes, as Stephen & Wong recognize it as such in MoM. But can a runic barrier prevent a sorcerer from using his magic? What about Asgardian illusions? There's literally no data. And that doesn't even get into things like Egyptian magic (Moon Knight) or whatever it is Clea can do.

There's simply no data. So, until more happens, the best we can do is another quote of the Ancient One:

"The language of the mystic arts is as old as civilization. The sorcerers of antiquity called the use of this language spells. But if that word offends your modern sensibilities you can call it a program, the source code that shapes reality. We harness energy...drawn from other dimensions of the Multiverse...to cast spells...to conjure shields...and weapons...to make magic."

It's possible that witchcraft is a completely different thing. But it's also possible they use the same basic infrastructure. It's simply that sorcerers use Java, while witches use Python.

Yeah, magic is really a mystery to me. I've REALLY grown to appreciate how hard it is to actually write for it. Ever since WandaVision, I've come to understand that it IS possible to make magic make "some" sense and that makes the stories involving mysticism so much more interesting. It's all fictional, but I really admire the world-building that is going on. So far, I think the MCU has done a great job with magic. Many fantasy films have failed at the box office, so I'm pleased that Strange's movies are doing great.

[Albert1981]

This is all fiction. It works however the writers and directors want it to work at any given time. How does the tech in Wakanda work? These are details that don't really matter. You are wasting your time looking for something that doesn't exist. Unless a movie / show has the exact same writers and directors every single outing, there is no expectation that any of these so called 'rules' are going to be consistent. It's even worse in the comics where you have a multitude of people over decades producing these stories, though at least there is the nod toward continuity and consistency. Heck we can't even get the characterization of major characters consistent most the time.


Are you seriously trying figure out how Clea's powers work in the MCU when there is literally ZERO examples of how her magic works, yet? When neither a writer or director, much less a script has been written? I mean, you don't even want to read her comics, and clearly the MCU doesn't follow the comics as far as magical 'rules', so what makes you think they are suddenly going to do so for Clea?

I just appreciate the world-building aspect of it. I think it's incredible that writers can create truly immersive worlds where they can take fictional concepts like "magic" and tell stories that are interesting without making them seem too fantastical. Make them relatable. So I have a lot of respect for creators who do that. The reason why I'm into "rules" is because if you don't have them, fantasy fiction often becomes sorta unsatisfying. People pulling spells out of their asses which they had never performed before to solve problems ruins fiction for me. I admire it greatly when writers create stories that actually feel like you can understand why the characters do the things that they do (magically). Instead of the wizard does this! And the sorceress does that! Just because they CAN with NO explanation. I think it's hard for comic book creators to make sure things are consistent over many decades, but without some sort of consistency, won't Strange, Wong and Clea regularly be "de-powered" and then "re-powered" in the comics? Isn't that something that annoys the Strange "franchise" greatly? Besides, I think it's hilarious that Stephen had to go on the worst magical diet in the world to use his powers. I got no problem with making magic humorous.

I just wanted to know a little bit about Clea's mystical background before she makes her apparent debut in an MCU property. There is too much stuff going on in decades of comics to follow for me, so I just want the CliffNotes version of it. Where does she get her powers, what can she do with her powers, and what makes her different from other magic users in Marvel. Wikipedia and YouTube help to a certain extent, but I would like to know what long-time fans of her think (because apparently you guys know more about her than Marvel Comics does sometimes)!

Plus the Strange and Clea threads are more quiet than they should be so I wanna start conversations about Marvel magic.

[DigiCom]

Are you seriously trying figure out how Clea's powers work in the MCU when there is literally ZERO examples of how her magic works, yet? When neither a writer or director, much less a script has been written? I mean, you don't even want to read her comics, and clearly the MCU doesn't follow the comics as far as magical 'rules', so what makes you think they are suddenly going to do so for Clea?

Technically, there's ONE example of how her magic works.

I just wanted to know a little bit about Clea's mystical background before she makes her apparent debut in an MCU property. There is too much stuff going on in decades of comics to follow for me, so I just want the CliffNotes version of it. Where does she get her powers, what can she do with her powers, and what makes her different from other magic users in Marvel.

Plus the Strange and Clea threads are more quiet than they should be so I wanna start conversations about Marvel magic.

Your first problem is that the way magic works in the comics != the way it works in the MCU. So any examples we can find in the comics may or may not apply to the MCU.

That being said, in the comics she uses the same style of magic as Stephen. If you recall the three types I posted elsewhere, her primary advantage is that her half-Faltine nature gives her a larger pool of personal energy to draw from (she can also fly under her own power for some reason, but that's not a serious powerup ) and a certain amount of enhanced strength/durability. But Stephen had more experience, so he had things to teach her.

[Iron Maiden]

Not too soon I hope. I still hope to see Benedict in a live action 'Triumph & Torment' movie introducing Dr Doom to the MCU.

I second that.... but I wonder if Marvel/Disney will ever get around to that tale. I'm guessing they will do Secret Wars first, Hickman style since incursions were mentioned in Doctor Strange/Multiverse of Madness

[Reviresco]

I just appreciate the world-building aspect of it. I think it's incredible that writers can create truly immersive worlds where they can take fictional concepts like "magic" and tell stories that are interesting without making them seem too fantastical. Make them relatable. So I have a lot of respect for creators who do that. The reason why I'm into "rules" is because if you don't have them, fantasy fiction often becomes sorta unsatisfying. People pulling spells out of their asses which they had never performed before to solve problems ruins fiction for me. I admire it greatly when writers create stories that actually feel like you can understand why the characters do the things that they do (magically). Instead of the wizard does this! And the sorceress does that! Just because they CAN with NO explanation. I think it's hard for comic book creators to make sure things are consistent over many decades, but without some sort of consistency, won't Strange, Wong and Clea regularly be "de-powered" and then "re-powered" in the comics? Isn't that something that annoys the Strange "franchise" greatly? Besides, I think it's hilarious that Stephen had to go on the worst magical diet in the world to use his powers. I got no problem with making magic humorous.

LOL! If you read the Strange appreciation thread that was one of the biggest complaint fans have about modern Dr Strange stories. We're tired of Strange being de-powered repeatedly, because modern writers can't seem to write a story with magic. Instead we get ridiculous restrictions like a gross magical diet and human batteries in the basement, that Strange never needed before and was inconsistent with his previous decades of writing -- while getting de-powered.

And that's your opinion about fantasy stories. There's a lot of reasons I read fantasy stories, but them NOT being fantastical is NOT one of them. It isn't the rules of magic that make a story relatable, but relatable characters. TBH, I think you you want the movies and the comics to be a role playing magic guide. Nor do I understand why you are holding MCU magic to higher standard than MCU science. Everything you complain about in magic, occurs in the 'science' of the MCU, which, IMO, has far more a$$ pulls out of nowhere than magic.

I just wanted to know a little bit about Clea's mystical background before she makes her apparent debut in an MCU property. There is too much stuff going on in decades of comics to follow for me, so I just want the CliffNotes version of it. Where does she get her powers, what can she do with her powers, and what makes her different from other magic users in Marvel. Wikipedia and YouTube help to a certain extent, but I would like to know what long-time fans of her think (because apparently you guys know more about her than Marvel Comics does sometimes)!

Plus the Strange and Clea threads are more quiet than they should be so I wanna start conversations about Marvel magic.

Again, my point is that we have no idea what the MCU will use from the comics regarding Clea or her magic. Learning about Clea is great, as she's not gotten the attention she deserves, IMO, until recently. But trying to pre-reconcile her use of magic in comics with your rigid idea of how MCU magic works / will work seems an exercise in futility. As DigiCom said, we just have no data.

Technically, there's ONE example of how her magic works.

Ah, but is it HER magic? Or an artifact / magic item? ;p

Your first problem is that the way magic works in the comics != the way it works in the MCU. So any examples we can find in the comics may or may not apply to the MCU.

That being said, in the comics she uses the same style of magic as Stephen. If you recall the three types I posted elsewhere, her primary advantage is that her half-Faltine nature gives her a larger pool of personal energy to draw from (she can also fly under her own power for some reason, but that's not a serious powerup ) and a certain amount of enhanced strength/durability. But Stephen had more experience, so he had things to teach her.

We don't even know if she's going to be Faltine. Are they even going to keep her familial relationships? One would think so, but we just don't know.

[DigiCom]

Ah, but is it HER magic? Or an artifact / magic item? ;p

We don't even know if she's going to be Faltine. Are they even going to keep her familial relationships? One would think so, but we just don't know.

Well, the plane she opens a portal to LOOKS like the Dark Dimension, and that blade she summons reminds me of the weapons Kaecilius & his cultists used, so parsimony suggests she has a background similar to the comics. But it's only a guess.

[Albert1981]

LOL! If you read the Strange appreciation thread that was one of the biggest complaint fans have about modern Dr Strange stories. We're tired of Strange being de-powered repeatedly, because modern writers can't seem to write a story with magic. Instead we get ridiculous restrictions like a gross magical diet and human batteries in the basement, that Strange never needed before and was inconsistent with his previous decades of writing -- while getting de-powered.

And that's your opinion about fantasy stories. There's a lot of reasons I read fantasy stories, but them NOT being fantastical is NOT one of them. It isn't the rules of magic that make a story relatable, but relatable characters. TBH, I think you you want the movies and the comics to be a role playing magic guide. Nor do I understand why you are holding MCU magic to higher standard than MCU science. Everything you complain about in magic, occurs in the 'science' of the MCU, which, IMO, has far more a$$ pulls out of nowhere than magic.





Again, my point is that we have no idea what the MCU will use from the comics regarding Clea or her magic. Learning about Clea is great, as she's not gotten the attention she deserves, IMO, until recently. But trying to pre-reconcile her use of magic in comics with your rigid idea of how MCU magic works / will work seems an exercise in futility. As DigiCom said, we just have no data.





Ah, but is it HER magic? Or an artifact / magic item? ;p






We don't even know if she's going to be Faltine. Are they even going to keep her familial relationships? One would think so, but we just don't know.

Yes, there's a lot we don't about Clea's powers and I'm anxious to see what they are. But admittedly, I'm very lazy and don't have the time unfortunately to read that many comic books these day. That's why I'm busy harassing you, Clea and DigiCom. No, I actually agree with you. Magic should be fantastical and inspire a sense of awe when it's used. I don't wanna have magic turned into science anymore than you do. And I've criticized Marvel "science" plenty of times. I think their multiversal/time travel stories are boring and needlessly complicated. But I appreciate the fact that they are at least consulting physicists to try to get their technobabble right. I think the MCU are actually basing their stories somewhat on quantum mechanics. So yeah, Marvel "science" needs rules just as its magic does. I feel I've been pretty consistent there. To be honest, I actually thought the first Strange movie and WandaVision did a REALLY good job in MY opinion of explaining those rules.

I NEVER have been opposed to removing the mystical out of the mysticism in fantasy. Lord of the Rings, the Chronicles of Narnia, the NeverEnding Story and the Wizard of Earthsea are some of my all-time favorite works of art. And yes, I loved the CHARACTERS in them just as much as anybody. But if you really think about it, magic isn't used THAT much in some of those stories and when it is, BAD **** HAPPENS. Take the Chronicles of Narnia for example. I don't think the children from "our" world ever used magic and something good happened as a result:

"Edmund eats the Turkish Delight, and he is enslaved to the White Witch. Eustace lets greed overtake him, and the enchanted treasure turns him into a dragon. Lucy reads a magic spell, and will regret for the rest of her life. Digory rings a magic bell, and evil enters Narnia. The message is clear in both Narnia and Middle Earth. Magic and humans don’t mix. Whenever humans use magic, something bad happens."

In The Neverending Story by Michael Ende, Bastian can "wish" things to come true, but in turn he loses one of his memories each time that he does – this is the price, and only rule in that story. And that was good enough for me.

I have a different standard for magic users who use their magic early and often to solve "problems" in storylines. Like in superhero television/movies and comic books. Without rules, limitations, costs and boundaries, magic can be largely indistinguishable from Deus Ex Machina. I think people crave understanding, regardless of the genre. Part of what is exceptional about magic is that it solves a great deal of problems, but is in the end a tool in itself. A blast of fire solves the problems of protection and warmth for a spellcaster, but you’ll need to take me on a story to explain how he uses it to catch his dinner or boil water, and -that’s- the interesting part. Stories need conflict, and if I can ‘magic’ any old thing, you’ll have a much harder time providing it. So I wanna understand magic as best I can. Or has been famously stated elsewhere: "An author's ability to solve conflict with magic is directly proportional to how well the reader understands said magic."