Is Mephisto being positioned to become Spider-Man's arch-nemesis?

[Tabs]

Responsible for the Osborn "curse" and sending Harry spiraling into madness and death. Responsible for putting Norman Osborn in a place where he could be anything other than a pathetic broken man with little money to his name and terrible father. Like headcanon away all this as much as you want but Harry's been pretty much his unknowing stooge for his entire life and Norman would be nothing without him. Undoing Doc Ock's redemption arc. Destroying Spider-man's marriage and unmaking his child. Sending children cloned by Gwen Stacy after Peter. At this point, he's beginning to feel more like the Arch than anyone else.

[Hypestyle]

Responsible for the Osborn "curse" and sending Harry spiraling into madness and death. Responsible for putting Norman Osborn in a place where he could be anything other than a pathetic broken man with little money to his name and terrible father. Like headcanon away all this as much as you want but Harry's been pretty much his unknowing stooge for his entire life and Norman would be nothing without him. Undoing Doc Ock's redemption arc. Destroying Spider-man's marriage and unmaking his child. Sending children cloned by Gwen Stacy after Peter. At this point, he's beginning to feel more like the Arch than anyone else.

who knows? Maybe there has to be a Spider-Man vs. Mephisto limited series. But it would have to be a writer I'd enjoy. I'd see what C. Priest could do with the material, to reverse all the curses and get rid of Mephisto as a major menace.

[PCN24454]

Only because it’s clear that people want OMD to become undone.

[Huntsman Spider]

who knows? Maybe there has to be a Spider-Man vs. Mephisto limited series. But it would have to be a writer I'd enjoy. I'd see what C. Priest could do with the material, to reverse all the curses and get rid of Mephisto as a major menace.

That would be cool. Considering Christopher Priest's Black Panther run had as one of its early stories Black Panther physically beating as well as outwitting Mephisto, I'd like to see him bring that same energy to Spider-Man vs. Mephisto. Insofar as a title, it could be called "Spider-Man's Inferno," or "Spider-Man Goes to Hell," or even "Spider-Man: Web of Damnation [or instead, Hellfire]." Maybe "Spider-Man: [Web of the] Damned."

[Mister Mets]

One More Day was poorly reviewed.

One Moment in Time, the follow-up, was poorly reviewed.

Nick Spencer's last issues, which established the connection between Mephisto and Norman Osborn, were poorly reviewed.

It's probably for the best to ignore Mephisto going forward. The main exception would be some kind of major status quo change, but even then it's best to have as little Mephisto as possible.

[Username taken]

One More Day was poorly reviewed.

One Moment in Time, the follow-up, was poorly reviewed.

Nick Spencer's last issues, which established the connection between Mephisto and Norman Osborn, were poorly reviewed.

It's probably for the best to ignore Mephisto going forward. The main exception would be some kind of major status quo change, but even then it's best to have as little Mephisto as possible.

Quoted for truth.

[Huntsman Spider]

One More Day was poorly reviewed.

One Moment in Time, the follow-up, was poorly reviewed.

Nick Spencer's last issues, which established the connection between Mephisto and Norman Osborn, were poorly reviewed.

It's probably for the best to ignore Mephisto going forward. The main exception would be some kind of major status quo change, but even then it's best to have as little Mephisto as possible.

One More Day was poorly reviewed more because of what it did to Spider-Man as a character, having him betray the moral at the core of his stories by making a literal deal with the Devil to avoid facing his guilt and taking responsibility for the part he played in Aunt May's impending death, as per publicly revealing his identity knowing full well he had enemies that'd gladly go after his (remaining) loved ones out of spite and revenge, then leaving himself and those loved ones without protection from said enemies after abandoning Iron Man's pro-registration faction for his increasingly morally dubious, if not flat-out immoral, actions to win the Civil War against Captain America's anti-registration faction. Not to mention that the whole point of OMD, as admitted by its main mastermind, then-EIC Joe Quesada, was to nullify his marriage to Mary Jane Watson(-Parker) from canon, no matter what methods he felt he had to resort to in order to make that happen, because he just felt like it "ruined the character's youth appeal" or something of that sort for him to be married. Then OMIT --- One Moment in Time --- doubled down by providing the reason that the marriage didn't happen "in canon," not to mention why Peter and Mary Jane broke it off "for good" after Civil War, and both of those were rather ridiculous, so of course it was going to also be poorly reviewed as well. As for Nick Spencer's last issues, those were poorly reviewed because the whole run had been spent building up to the seeming undoing of OMD, and that didn't happen, obviously, so that was poorly reviewed as well because the fans didn't like getting suckered into something that didn't deliver on what it seemed to promise. In the end, a lot of pain and suffering could have been avoided by just letting Peter and Mary Jane remain married and continuing to progress and evolve in that vein.

[Mister Mets]

One More Day was poorly reviewed more because of what it did to Spider-Man as a character, having him betray the moral at the core of his stories by making a literal deal with the Devil to avoid facing his guilt and taking responsibility for the part he played in Aunt May's impending death, as per publicly revealing his identity knowing full well he had enemies that'd gladly go after his (remaining) loved ones out of spite and revenge, then leaving himself and those loved ones without protection from said enemies after abandoning Iron Man's pro-registration faction for his increasingly morally dubious, if not flat-out immoral, actions to win the Civil War against Captain America's anti-registration faction. Not to mention that the whole point of OMD, as admitted by its main mastermind, then-EIC Joe Quesada, was to nullify his marriage to Mary Jane Watson(-Parker) from canon, no matter what methods he felt he had to resort to in order to make that happen, because he just felt like it "ruined the character's youth appeal" or something of that sort for him to be married. Then OMIT --- One Moment in Time --- doubled down by providing the reason that the marriage didn't happen "in canon," not to mention why Peter and Mary Jane broke it off "for good" after Civil War, and both of those were rather ridiculous, so of course it was going to also be poorly reviewed as well. As for Nick Spencer's last issues, those were poorly reviewed because the whole run had been spent building up to the seeming undoing of OMD, and that didn't happen, obviously, so that was poorly reviewed as well because the fans didn't like getting suckered into something that didn't deliver on what it seemed to promise. In the end, a lot of pain and suffering could have been avoided by just letting Peter and Mary Jane remain married and continuing to progress and evolve in that vein.

I think it's more complicated than people not liking particular status quo changes. If Spencer's last issues included a reversal of One More Day, the problems with the execution will still be there.

I'll make a sidenote that I suspect the main reason Nick Spencer brought Mephisto for his final issues is that he thinks One More Day may be reversed at some point, and that reversal will now build on his work.

Even if One More Day were reversed, it's probably best to have as little Mephisto as possible, just because his appearances haven't been good. It would be better to have Mephisto defeated in some other comic book (Silver Surfer, the Avengers, some new superteam, etc) to set up Spider-Man and Mary Jane remembering that they were married, so that the focus in the Spider-Man titles is on Spider-Man characters.

[Huntsman Spider]

I think it's more complicated than people not liking particular status quo changes. If Spencer's last issues included a reversal of One More Day, the problems with the execution will still be there.

I'll make a sidenote that I suspect the main reason Nick Spencer brought Mephisto for his final issues is that he thinks One More Day may be reversed at some point, and that reversal will now build on his work.

Even if One More Day were reversed, it's probably best to have as little Mephisto as possible, just because his appearances haven't been good. It would be better to have Mephisto defeated in some other comic book (Silver Surfer, the Avengers, some new superteam, etc) to set up Spider-Man and Mary Jane remembering that they were married, so that the focus in the Spider-Man titles is on Spider-Man characters.

Problems with execution aside, OMD and everything that followed from that was "fruit of a poisoned tree," to borrow legal phraseology for a moment there, based on certain people at Marvel deciding that single Spider-Man/Peter Parker would be better for the brand, then imposing that decision on fans/readers and doubling down despite fan/reader outrage that the poster boy for responsibility would do something so incredibly irresponsible as making a literal bargain with a literal devil to avoid facing up to what his mistake in trusting Tony Stark during Civil War had ultimately cost him. That said, yeah, the only reason I'd want Mephisto involved again in Spider-Man's life or books at all would be for Spider-Man to tell him where he could shove his deal and then righteously pummel the literal and metaphorical hell out of him before sending him running with his proverbial tail between his legs, never to trouble Spidey (or Mary Jane) again.

[Tabs]

As satisfying as Peter giving Mephisto a solo thrashing would someday be, I don't think that would correct his enemies. Perhaps the problem could be alleviated if they assisted Parker with his objective, thus establishing his foes retain personal agency for their actions? Nonetheless, currently, Otto Octavius has a confusing clone situation in addition to his demonic bargain, and Norman is the devil's "legacy made flesh." Aka, a bungling lackey who flung MJ's primary love rival off a bridge, thus paving the road for Mayday's birth, which is apparently the thing Mephisto wanted to avoid. From now on, any feats green goblin accomplishes can be partially accredited to Mephisto, and there's an actual question regarding whether Otto is even Otto. This makes me lose interest in future stories using these antagonists. If Marvel doesn't commit to making the devil a prominent member of Spider-man villains, they'll need to repair the damaged characters. It still amuses me that Spencer re-used the "Howard Stark sold Tony's soul to the devil" plot with the Osborns.

[Matt Rat]

It's probably for the best to ignore Mephisto going forward. The main exception would be some kind of major status quo change, but even then it's best to have as little Mephisto as possible.

It's pretty hard to 'ignore Mephisto' when it's been clearly stated outright his downfall is linked to Peter and MJ's kid, or possibly MJ herself.

And there are fans of Spencer's conclusion. I'm one of them.

[Spiderfan001]

It's pretty hard to 'ignore Mephisto' when it's been clearly stated outright his downfall is linked to Peter and MJ's kid, or possibly MJ herself.

And there are fans of Spencer's conclusion. I'm one of them.

Cosigned

Seems like 900 will be a waste for this, but I hope someone takes it back up right after

[Ultimate Captain America]

[Spiderfan001]

*deep sigh* Amen

[PanicPixieDreamGirl]

I admit it, I would kind of like to see Mephisto vs. Norman, winner takes all.