DC Round Robin 2022

[Frontier]

Jaime should have been an original creation. He had a unique, support cast, powers, origin and villains. Superboy (and the Robins) are popular because of the brands they are a part of. They were created with a built in fanbase because Batman and Superman are popular characters. Rather DC focused on their more unique creations over the doppelgängers

Even still he'd be a "legacy" the same way the Silver Age heroes were to their Golden Age counterparts.

Is it wrong to be popular even an as extension or spinoff of another property? It's not like Conner is purely a teen Superman. Supergirl had a TV show that ran for 6 seasons.

[Menacer]

Not so sure why some people are so down on this.

90s Superboy was one of the coolest creations to come out of the 90s and he's been very much underutilized.

I hope this mini is a huge success and we can get more Miniseries or even an ongoing!! Or at least more appearances in modern DC stories.

This was my Halloween costume from a year ago ! Me as a Super fan clone of Superboy
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[Confuzzled]

Man do I hate DCÂ’s concept of families/legacies. ItÂ’s just the same characters but younger, female, diverseÂ…etc. DC needs to expand their universe from just the same 6 brands over and over again.

I don't get why you are singling out DC for this when the most popular characters Marvel has created in the 21st Century like Miles Morales and Kamala Khan are also legacy characters. Or else they have had previously established diverse like Sam Wilson and Jane Foster characters take on legacy mantles. Even the next gen Young Avengers comprise of legacy characters and children of Avengers.

Jaime should have been an original creation. He had a unique, support cast, powers, origin and villains. Superboy (and the Robins) are popular because of the brands they are a part of. They were created with a built in fanbase because Batman and Superman are popular characters. Rather DC focused on their more unique creations over the doppelgängers

Some legacy characters like the post-Alan GLs, post-Jay Flashes and Carol Danvers on the Marvel side end up eclipsing the original holder of the title. Jaime looks to be joining that rank. I wish Ted was given a new moniker like how Hank Pym kept having alternate identities like Giant-Man, Yellowjacket and Goliath.

[Robanker]

Jaime should have been an original creation. He had a unique, support cast, powers, origin and villains. Superboy (and the Robins) are popular because of the brands they are a part of. They were created with a built in fanbase because Batman and Superman are popular characters. Rather DC focused on their more unique creations over the doppelgängers

Corporate comics are not going to be for you if you plan on dying on that hill. Try independent, creater-owned comics. Hell, try Invincible.

But railing at the Big Two for using established IP to launch new characters is pretty weak. That's their bread and butter and what makes the most business sense, which is part-and-parcel what they're trying to do. It's great when someone like Naomi succeeds, or someone like Primer (I've heard good things despite not reading that book), but that's a significantly bigger risk that has a much higher rate of failure than adding to established sellers.

Moreover, if Jaime didn't have the death of Ted Kord leading into him taking the Scarab as a new Blue Beetle, I don't think his solo series would have lasted as long. He had everything you listed, absolutely, but also the death of Ted, getting introduced in the biggest event of the year from DC, and a lot of push from editorial and he still only got about 26 or so issues. Not having Blue Beetle would have hurt him more than helped. The comic book irrelevance graveyard is rife with good ideas nobody paid for.

Jaime is the most exposed Blue Beetle in greater media and even in comics he's pretty well-loved. The only thing Ted really has over him is JLI and his bromance with Booster. Nobody cares about Ted as a solo hero the way they do Jaime. By all accounts, Blue Beetle has been good for Jaime. Far more than being his own thing like so many stillborn new characters. In ten years, Jaime will likely still be around. I don't know if I can say the same of Ghostmaker, Miracle Molly or Clown Hunter.

[Johnny]

Well if they're unwilling to "take risks" then maybe they should find a new job. These people call themselves "creators" so they should actually try to "create" something for once. Their predecessors worked on corporate comics as well, yet they managed to create new and interesting characters that both gained and sustained an audience, some of which are now featured in many of the most successful movies ever. Constant raceswaps or creating new legacies that hijack older heroes' content can only get you so far imo. Obviously the likes of Jaime and Ted are a little different in that regard since their power set is entirely different, though Jaime indeed would not exist if Ted wasn't killed.

[Confuzzled]

Well if they're unwilling to "take risks" then maybe they should find a new job.

Eh, easier said than done. Look at how the titles for Animal Man, Ambush Bug, Captain Carrot etc. fared in this contest. At the end of the day, it's a business. If people aren't going to buy titles featuring lesser known characters and IPs, then there's no point for DC or Marvel to put those out over the established brands.

As Robanker said, if you don't like it, then try stuff outside of the Big Two.

[Johnny]

Animal Man once had Grant Morrison and DC did not capitalize on the momentum after the fact, hence decades later he doesn't do well in a contest like this. It can be just as dependent on editorial as it is on the writers and artists.

I do occasionally try stuff outside of the Big Two, doesn't mean I shouldn't question the Big Two's decision making every once in a while.

[Confuzzled]

It's not like everything Morrison touches becomes a hot-seller. Their biggest books are still from the most popular IP's like Batman, Superman and X-Men. Ditto for all of the MCU's success, their most successful books are still Spider-Man and X-Men that are either not part of the MCU or are just a recent addition to the MCU. No successful writer or film has managed to garner substantial interest in a comic book by themselves. An Iron Man book drops in sales soon after a new #1 is launched.

[Vordan]

In recent years the only ones who have managed to elevate the sales of B & C-Listers at DC have been King and Johns. Otherwise no matter who you put on a book it just doesn’t attract much interest unless it’s one of the big brands.

[Robanker]

Well if they're unwilling to "take risks" then maybe they should find a new job. These people call themselves "creators" so they should actually try to "create" something for once. Their predecessors worked on corporate comics as well, yet they managed to create new and interesting characters that both gained and sustained an audience, some of which are now featured in many of the most successful movies ever. Constant raceswaps or creating new legacies that hijack older heroes' content can only get you so far imo. Obviously the likes of Jaime and Ted are a little different in that regard since their power set is entirely different, though Jaime indeed would not exist if Ted wasn't killed.

There are definitely good and bad examples. Jaime, in my mind, is an example of an excellent legacy character.

[skyvolt2000]

Eh, easier said than done. Look at how the titles for Animal Man, Ambush Bug, Captain Carrot etc. fared in this contest. At the end of the day, it's a business. If people aren't going to buy titles featuring lesser known characters and IPs, then there's no point for DC or Marvel to put those out over the established brands.

As Robanker said, if you don't like it, then try stuff outside of the Big Two.

Animal Man and some of those guys held long runs previously without restarts or variant covers to boost sales.

The issue is this.... those lesser knowns seem to have ZERO issue finding audiences once you leave the comic book store.

As Doom Patrol and Peacemaker have shown. As Squirrel Girl and Rocket Raccoon have shown. As Static has shown.

But railing at the Big Two for using established IP to launch new characters is pretty weak.

No it's not because far too many established IPs get screwed over for others.

How many times will Dc toss out a Cyborg book that is man versus machine every single time?

Aquaman made a BILLION and we are still looking for books for him???

While Wonder Woman has so many to pick from after 2 movies?

Do we even need to discuss the mess known as Green Lantern???

Funny Batman has no issue introducing new folks and even giving you a one shot or mini to TRY to flesh them out more.

Yet everywhere else that is an issue.

[Menacer]

Animal Man and some of those guys held long runs previously without restarts or variant covers to boost sales.

The issue is this.... those lesser knowns seem to have ZERO issue finding audiences once you leave the comic book store.

As Doom Patrol and Peacemaker have shown. As Squirrel Girl and Rocket Raccoon have shown. As Static has shown.




No it's not because far too many established IPs get screwed over for others.

How many times will Dc toss out a Cyborg book that is man versus machine every single time?

Aquaman made a BILLION and we are still looking for books for him???

While Wonder Woman has so many to pick from after 2 movies?

Do we even need to discuss the mess known as Green Lantern???

Funny Batman has no issue introducing new folks and even giving you a one shot or mini to TRY to flesh them out more.

Yet everywhere else that is an issue.

Aquaman in film is vastly different then Aquaman in comics...

Zack Snyder casting Jason Momoa was brilliant and very off brand. For whatever reason dc hasn't really capitized on Aquamans reinvention... likely as it would alienate his actual comic book fans and film viewers don't turn into comic book readers... Marvel has a vastly more impressive film box office but they only fair slightly better in sales then DC comics.

Ultimately Manga and independent seem to be the current state of comic sales...

Wish more film viewers would explore reading comics but it just doesn't seem to happen.

As far as DC avoiding legacy and exploring lesser characters my guess is you aren't actually making it into the comic shop.

Dc in the Infinite Frontier era has done tons and tons of minis 5, 6 , 8 and 12 issues with non legacy characters... where have you been? Basically anything by King outside Supergirl and Rorschach, booster gold and blue beatle, crush and Lobo, swamp thing, jl Incarnate, infinite Frontier, duo, star girl, static shock, rocket, loads of black label like rogues, fables, sandman, hardware, legends of tomorrow, monkey prince, one star Squadron, Suicide squad, task force z, blood Syndicate, crime Syndicate, namoi, Deathstroke Inc, teen Titans united, teen Titans academy...

Loads of stuff I'm missing...

Honestly people complaining about lack of options in the line are either trolls, ignorant, lazy or not a real regular reader and would rather complain then find a good book to read...

[Restingvoice]

Well if they're unwilling to "take risks" then maybe they should find a new job. These people call themselves "creators" so they should actually try to "create" something for once. Their predecessors worked on corporate comics as well, yet they managed to create new and interesting characters that both gained and sustained an audience, some of which are now featured in many of the most successful movies ever. Constant raceswaps or creating new legacies that hijack older heroes' content can only get you so far imo. Obviously the likes of Jaime and Ted are a little different in that regard since their power set is entirely different, though Jaime indeed would not exist if Ted wasn't killed.

Creators do take risks, but whether it's allowed to get published depend on the higher ups, and the higher ups also change, so different pitch appeal differently to different bosses.

Like right now this contest is one way to allowing other characters to get the chance, when someone at DC want to focus on 90% Batfam

Also you don't know if the switching came because the creator pitch it or because the editorial want to shake things up for sales, or even higher, like WB wanting more PoC LGBT in the movies and order the current batch replaced, or all of them in agreement

[Digifiend]

I don't get why you are singling out DC for this when the most popular characters Marvel has created in the 21st Century like Miles Morales and Kamala Khan are also legacy characters. Or else they have had previously established diverse like Sam Wilson and Jane Foster characters take on legacy mantles. Even the next gen Young Avengers comprise of legacy characters and children of Avengers.

Some legacy characters like the post-Alan GLs, post-Jay Flashes and Carol Danvers on the Marvel side end up eclipsing the original holder of the title. Jaime looks to be joining that rank. I wish Ted was given a new moniker like how Hank Pym kept having alternate identities like Giant-Man, Yellowjacket and Goliath.

Another Marvel example, and their oldest, is Human Torch. As with Flash and Green Lantern, Johnny was a silver age replacement for a golden age character.

The majority of the Young Avengers and the Champions are legacy characters, yeah. Hawkeye, Nova and Wasp share their names with older characters, as does Spider-Man who you already mentioned. Amadeus Cho did too but he changed his name from Hulk to Brawn. Stature/Stinger is a legacy to Ant-Man II, Viv Vision is the Vision's daughter and has the same abilities - Jonas from the YAs was also a version of The Vision. Hulkling is a legacy to Captain Mar-Vell, Wiccan and Speed to Scarlet Witch and Quicksilver. Snowguard is a legacy to Snowbird from Alpha Flight (the -guard in her name comes from another AF member, Guardian). Ms. Marvel is a unique case - Kamala took a codename that had been vacated due to Carol taking over the Captain Marvel mantle - DC's closest example might be Tim Drake, who became Robin after one of the previous ones rebranded to Nightwing and the other died.

[LAWtoyoto 432]

Wish more film viewers would explore reading comics but it just doesn't seem to happen.

When "WandaVision" hits on Disney+ last years, all the trade and graphic novels for Scarlet Witch and Vision has sold out in most of the stores. The same goes for Hawkeye and Moon Knight show too. Even Jed's Moon Knight run is still maintain strong seller after releasing several issue run.

Honestly people complaining about lack of options in the line are either trolls, ignorant, lazy or not a real regular reader and would rather complain then find a good book to read...

I think it either because the fanbase for the Flash and Booster Gold are quite minority as compared to the trinity or batfamily which is totally massive.