Amazing Spider-Man 93 Spoilers and Reviews

[SpideyClone]

If it were me, I would have given Ben his memories back, and have him and Janine go on the road again, trying to stay one step ahead of Beyond. Sort of like the Lost Years with an updated spin. You could make a mini-series out of it or just put him on the shelf for a few years to bring back again when needed. It's silly that editorial thinks there's no place for Ben as he was; at least they could have reached out to DeMatteis to brainstorm on how to move Ben forward.

As far as Kaine goes, I think he was fairly well established during Yost's Scarlet Spider run, "all the power, none of the responsibility", and thankfully Peter David didn't damage Kaine as much as he did Ben during his dreadful Scarlet Spider run.

I like the idea of Ben and Janine as the Spider-family we'll never get with Peter/MJ, but that seems highly unlikely for the foreseeable future.

[Malachi]

It's funny (in a way) because they have the answer in the 90s Clone Saga. There, they had Peter married with MJ and expecting a child, but they did want a single and younger Spider-man, so they created Ben to be the new one.

Nowadays, they have an unmarried Peter Parker. Why don't let Ben become the married Spider-Man with a child? A Spider-Dad is something you don't have right now in any comic, so that could appeal to a lot of people, not only those who are fans of Ben but also those who still resent OMD. And you can have several minis with Spider-Dad and, at the same time, have him as a secondary character in the Spider books and even use him to make people think Peter is better unmarried, why not? That's a place for Ben in the current Spidey-scape. One that does not destroys Ben. And if this scenary does not work, you can gave him a happy ending at least.

Wonderful. I did not think about in that way. But now that it’s out there I would buy it in a heartbeat. Janine as the mother seems like a nobrainer. What a sweet story for them filled with many stories about overcoming tradegy and trying to create a life and giving your child something you never had.

[Kurolegacy]

It’s sad that you can literally sum up their stupid writing of Ben going after Peter because of Maxine with the following:

[bob.schoonover]

Pav, I am truly glad you found a way to enjoy this, and I respect your opinion, but I just can't see it as a tragedy - I've always felt a proper tragedy had some element of "here's where one or more characters made a choice that led to the poor outcome*" that really seal the tragic nature of the story. We never saw Ben make a choice that led to his memories being expunged (similar with Ashley Kafka). Ben Parker's death was a tragedy for Peter *because* he had let the burglar go earlier. Gwen's death was a tragedy because Peter could have turned Norman in earlier. Harry's (first) death was a tragedy because he chose to follow in his father's footsteps. Ben must have made choices that led to this, but they're only referred to in passing and w/o knowing the circumstances, we can't say if he was being foolish, optimistic, etc.

Beyond, though, just wasn't a story I enjoyed, and the construction of Beyond makes me incredibly weary of Wells (and Lowe) being able to execute Spider-man stories I'll enjoy going forward. Not just that Ben never had a choice to make, but the whole story - Door Z was nothing, Queen Goblin has the same issues as Chasm (it's a thing that happened to Ashley, not a choice she made), Peter's injury and recovery were not given much apparent thought**, characters popped in and out w/no real purpose, and that's ignoring entirely that Beyond lives in some weird corner of continuity that doesn't acknowledge anything that happened in Spencer's run (while this has a reason, that doesn't mean I have to like it).

I'm out.


*I have no idea if this has a name

**It's not that I don't think Peter can be injured by radiation, and the U-Foes (as ordered by Beyond) are a fine enough mechanism to knock Peter out of the book for a bit, but the Otto solution was very easy, Peter's return was very simplistic as far as "Hero returns from certain death to reclaim his mantle" stories go, etc. It just seemed like an echo of any other story where the hero is sidelined.

[Iclifton]

Well, I am sure Ben Reilly fans are not pleased.

My heart goes out to them. Why try to make Ben a villain? Again. they could have easily just given him a happily ever after ending that leaves him in limbo until the next time they want to use him.

I think the Spider editorial team is my least favorite in comics.

[IamnotJudasTraveller]

It's really crazy because if they're no space then they should have kept him dead, or atleast gave him a honorable end in Beyond.Turning him into a new character is the worst idea.

Also we have dozens of Spiders in 616 but Ben is the one you have no space for?

Given how he was talking about Spider-Men, specificially, with Peter and Miles, it seems like he said Ben has no place as Spider-Man.

But I don't recall anyone making much of a fuss to keep him as Spidey. Most Ben fans seem happy enough with Scarlet Spider.

Honestly, I have no idea where they're hoping to take this. About the only way this could make some semblance of sense is that, unlike Clone Conspiracy, the world isn't out to get Ben - but that he'd have his supporting cast (Janine, Kaine, maybe even Marcus) basically look out after him to get him back where he should be. But we're just witnessing Ben getting dumped out after having a storyline in the mainline Amazing title, now NOT unlike Clone Conspiracy, and with no indication in the slightest that IS what we're getting (also, I know Peter is in recovery and whatnot but are we just not doing CC all over again? Kaine leaves promising to kill Ben if he finds him, and Peter just goes on with business even after there are multiple Vegas sightings of Scarlet Spiders. Why alienate the spin-offs from the core book this much? Not asking for constant cameos and whatnot but you get the point, I hope).

To be quite honest, it's kind of jarring just how disjointed these last months have been. Everyone knows I wasn't head over heels' Spencer's run, but even I think it was done dirty with how they basically shoved it to the side wholesale. Norman's sins was about the bare minimum acknowledgment it could've gotten, and I'm glad at least that much happened. But wouldn't you know it, the same way we had the "Ben is back" reveal in #74 out of nowhere, now we have a glowy person being the next trinket to make you forget the long running storyline you stuck by so we can jump into something else entirely again.

Who's going to be invested in any of this? Throwing storylines with reckless abandon at the reader and then not even allowing their conclusion to breathe properly? Why should anyone believe Wells' run will be given any deference when it wraps and not just be swept under the rug as it were like we've been consistently getting for a while now?

Admittedly, I did think the issue (and Lowe's own remarks) were going to be much worse, but yeah, I think Marvel quite literally is out of touch with the readerbase. I know a particular subset of fans that typically enjoys ad revenue has driven this sentence into the ground but I see no other way to truthfully regard what's going on in the recent months (years?) on Spider-Man.

[Obsidian Spider]

Well, this is comics in the days of the internet so they could be listening to our dissatisfaction and one day undo this too. Look at Wally West.

I guess he's not going to be in Hollywood then?

Oh well. I have hope that one day the right person will get the reigns to the character and do right by him. Heck, maybe they'll keep the JMD throwback comic as an ongoing!

[Kurolegacy]

Honestly Lowe’s letter just feels completely tone deaf especially when fans have already expressed displeasure in them taking Ben in a villainous direction twice now when they tried it. They say a definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. So if it didn’t work the last 2 times, why would they try it a third time? Well whatever their “plans” with Ben are, just as with the first time around with Superior Spider-Man, I refuse to give them any of my money for it. I’m voting with my wallet that I’m against this cynical direction they’ve taken Ben in especially when a number of options existed. Hell, Timeless even gave us one of those only for that to be a total lie. Spider-Man is supposed to be about rising up in spite of the darkness and the odds. This was the exact opposite of that.

[Marvel Man]

2) Ben's getting this memory confused with another: he's the Scarlet Spider, and he's with Mary Jane at the beginning of the Saga. Mary Jane is upset and lashes out at Ben; she's worried that Ben wants to take Peter's life away. Between these memories, we get narration from Ben about how badly he DID want Peter's life, that Mary Jane was right.

I have just look for this scene and it's totally... imprecise? misleading?. It was just the opposite in the comic-books. It could be from Spider-man #57 (the first time they met, with MJ slapping Ben) or from Spectacular Spider-man #232 (the second time they met).

Spider-man 57.jpg
In the first one, MJ shouts Ben than "no one is going to believe you as him. You're not half the hero he is... Not half the man!". Ben then says: "Mrs. Parker, I can't help the way I look and I can't help but try and help you". She didn't say anything about Ben wanting to take Peter's life. They mention it in the second meeting, but there they were not arguing at all.

Spectacular Spider-man 223.jpg
In the second issue, Ben says "Peter and I were in competition for the same life. That's over. It's taken me a long time... but I've come to terms with who... and what... I am!". MJ then said: "You sound so sincere. I really want to believe you..." to what Ben answers: "I don't blame you for having doubts. It makes perfect sense for me to be jealous of Peter! He's living the ideal live. He has a beautiful wife and family on the way. It's a life I can never have. Clones don't live as long as real people, Mrs. Parker. I came with a degeneration factor. It's only a matter of time before it catches up to me! That's why I'm so eager to help you. At least one of us deservers to live happyly ever after!".

Ben never wanted to take Peter's life away, because he thought he never could have had it. Both issues can be read in The Amazing Spider-man - The Complete Clone Saga Epic Vol. 3.

[IamnotJudasTraveller]

Well, this is comics in the days of the internet so they could be listening to our dissatisfaction and one day undo this too. Look at Wally West.

Ben already had that in Clone Conspiracy - the new costume got so much backlash, PAD rewrote the series to accomodate the classic look, and then you can basically see how the series at large changed gears entirely after the Death two-parter. So if they're doubling down on it, it seems like the usual "bitter medicine" they like to apply so much to things like pop culture and escapism. "You don't like it, but it's good for you".

I mentioned this in another thread, but some of this does seem out of Lowe's hands - for whatever reason, Marvel has some editorial guidelines saying you literally can't have Ben around, has since the '90s as Glenn Greenberg recounted in Life of Reilly. If they want to mess with his powerset, that's one thing, but threading the same "now he's unhinged" ground just leaves me stumped.

Heck, maybe they'll keep the JMD throwback comic as an ongoing!

We hope, but taking a look at how these throwback titles go, it's likely to last a few mini series before being made to conform to current events (like how Symbiote Spider-Man had to deal with King in Black), provided the first series even sold enough for it. It just might, since Jon DeMatteis said Marvel was already talking to him over something he couldn't mention, and they don't typically bring in veterans for the recent day ongoings (and when they do it tends to be just scattered issues here and there, like Nicieza on Juggernaut and X-Men Legends). But it's probably ending soon, since even Symbiote Spider-Man was basically shelved to focus on the New F4 thing with PAD.

[HypnoHustler]

Given how he was talking about Spider-Men, specificially, with Peter and Miles, it seems like he said Ben has no place as Spider-Man.

But I don't recall anyone making much of a fuss to keep him as Spidey. Most Ben fans seem happy enough with Scarlet Spider.

I’m going to say the quiet part out loud; I prefer him as Spidey. I feel like him being Scarlet Spider is something he outgrew in the original saga and it does feel like it’s strictly a cheap sidekick role, kind of symbolic of how Ben feels always being thought of as lesser or secondary to Peter.

But if it’s between him being Scarlet Spider again or him being Chasm… yeeesh! No contest there. Then I’m begging for the hoodie. I just don’t see this Chasm crap lasting. People who like Ben will hate it on principle, and it sure won’t win over anyone who didn’t like Ben in the first place. Plus, like I said earlier it reminds me of Speedball becoming Penance, that kind of edgelord makeover crap I thought we left behind in the 90s and early 00s. I think Ben will be gone for a loooooong time, possibly 5 or more years, and when he does finally reappear the Chasm stuff will get retconned quickly. Because he’ll be brought back by someone who wants to use Ben, not Chasm.

[Frontier]

You know, for all the flack people gave Spencer by the end of this run, I feel like Beyond has really put it in perspective what a bad run of Spider-Man really is.

[Mercwmouth12]

You know, for all the flack people gave Spencer by the end of this run, I feel like Beyond has really put it in perspective what a bad run of Spider-Man really is.

That's basically what BND was

[HypnoHustler]

You know, for all the flack people gave Spencer by the end of this run, I feel like Beyond has really put it in perspective what a bad run of Spider-Man really is.

While Spencer’s run had a lot more high points than Beyond (which had barely any, maybe the first issue and a couple of the Queen Goblin issues, which I enjoyed), I feel the Kindred finale was more botched and illogical than the Beyond finale. I was not a fan of the Beyond finale, but in a vacuum ASM #74 is a worse comic than ASM #93.

[CrimsonEchidna]

Anyone can wear the mask.*

*Except for Ben Reilly, we don't talk about Ben.