Mary Jane Watson = Plot Device to Peters Misery

[phonogram12]

[Matt Rat]

I did say the first issues were alright.

And being "too nice" is only part of the problem, I only care about Peter and MJ being together if they're being interesting while they're together, if that's not happening I'm not gonna care about 'em, and they became boring at some point in RYV (Well, RYV as a whole became boring), so I dropped the comic.

Fair enough. The book seemed to do well for a few years, sales weren't hot, but I think it only truly got cancelled because Spencer brought Peter and MJ back together in 616. I'd have liked it to have continued but I think they've told their story with it. RYV Peter and MJ raised Annie into a literal god, it's hard for any other series, even post-OMD Peter, to live up to something like that.

[PCN24454]

Does anyone feel that the Amazing Spider-Man comic thrives on how random the title character stories, adventures and dynamic is soley based on how much something can make Peter suffer or emotionally destroy his chances at stability, then whats the point of putting MJ with Peter, Mary Jane is Peter's most valued supporting character so if she is used to see what Peter does next to screw up something he currently is making progress with as a relationshio aka marriage or couple, why do fans expect that everything will be non grimdark? MJ is a bigger threat to his happiness more than any villian, and Im a Peter x MJ fan. Its something i noticed. Theres renew your vows and theres the comic strip, but i still feel Peter and Mary Jane is meant to be Grimdark fuel.

That describes most characters in Spider-Man comics, even Peter.

[Lukmendes]

Fair enough. The book seemed to do well for a few years, sales weren't hot, but I think it only truly got cancelled because Spencer brought Peter and MJ back together in 616. I'd have liked it to have continued but I think they've told their story with it.

Huh, didn't even notice that RYV's last issues were happening as Spencer's run started, thought it had ended around the time of Slott's run was near its end.

Peter and MJ getting back together might be part of the reason RYV got cancelled, but the comic also had a drop of quality a bit before Annie got aged up, that probably didn't help too.

RYV Peter and MJ raised Annie into a literal god, it's hard for any other series, even post-OMD Peter, to live up to something like that.

Power-wise, I guess, I don't exactly remember what the hell she gets as a "Patternmaker" (Spider-Geddon is really forgettable to me), but I remember that's something that was something the Morluns wanted to keep a secret, so it must've been a big deal.

But being powerful is kinda whatever, as a character, Annie was at her best as a kid, when she grew up she felt more generic, though, she's not as bad as that Benji guy from Adjectiveless Spider-Man, at least lol.

[Frontier]

Huh, didn't even notice that RYV's last issues were happening as Spencer's run started, thought it had ended around the time of Slott's run was near its end.

Peter and MJ getting back together might be part of the reason RYV got cancelled, but the comic also had a drop of quality a bit before Annie got aged up, that probably didn't help too.

Power-wise, I guess, I don't exactly remember what the hell she gets as a "Patternmaker" (Spider-Geddon is really forgettable to me), but I remember that's something that was something the Morluns wanted to keep a secret, so it must've been a big deal.

But being powerful is kinda whatever, as a character, Annie was at her best as a kid, when she grew up she felt more generic, though, she's not as bad as that Benji guy from Adjectiveless Spider-Man, at least lol.

I don't think she was more generic even though she did fall a little more into "bratty teenage daughter" mode...but at least her costume was nice.

[Lukmendes]

I don't think she was more generic even though she did fall a little more into "bratty teenage daughter" mode...

That description does her little favors in sounding less generic lol.

but at least her costume was nice.

Not a fan of her mask, but yeah, the colors were nice.

[Knightsilver]

*Looks at thread title* I thought that was Aunt May?

[PCN24454]

*Looks at thread title* I thought that was Aunt May?

It’s everybody.

[WebLurker]

RYV is my favorite Spider-Man story of the past decade. What makes zero sense is why Marvel would even let Slott write it if they are so pro OMD?

As I recall, Slott said in interviews that he wanted to write a married story (due to the 616 status quo not making that doable) and used the alternate reality nature of Secret Wars 2015 to successfully pitch the original mini, since OMD wouldn't be a factor. So far as why Marvel eventually continued it as an ongoing and has done other stuff since either depicting Peter and MJ married or in a committed relationship, my guess is that the brass in charge doesn't have a problem with the marriage being a piece of the franchise in and of itself, but that they "just" don't want it to be the 616 status quo. (And let's be frank, outside of Fantastic Four, even among superhero characters like Spider-Man who have a codified "one true love," the relationship is always reset somewhere down the line to allow writers to change things up and bring them back as they wish. Heck, Peter and MJ were the oddity in that it lasted unbroken as long as it did.)

I do like RYV, too. Wish it would come back.

Slott haters definitely do.

I've been told here once that they got butthurt when Pedro showed up in RYV, even though he was a glorified extra at best, and didn't show up for more that a few panels in the first issue.

I remember that. I also remember them raging about how Slott got a cameo in a crowd scene in the second issue. I personally didn't find what I read of his 616 Spider-Man stuff to be very enjoyable and I disagree with a lot of his interpretation of the franchise, but it was unreal just how much hate he got (esp. when it was him being blamed for OMD, which he wasn't even involved with).

[Matt Rat]

it was unreal just how much hate he got (esp. when it was him being blamed for OMD, which he wasn't even involved with).

A lot of people were involved in developing OMD behind the scenes besides Quesada, Brevoort, Alonzo, and JMS. Even Bendis contributed to the discussions. None of the others get talked about as much because Quesada, Brevoort and JMS made themselves the public faces of the decision.

Slott apparently did have a hand in helping Quesada out with sorting out the continuity issues of One Moment In Time also

[Lukmendes]

As I recall, Slott said in interviews that he wanted to write a married story (due to the 616 status quo not making that doable) and used the alternate reality nature of Secret Wars 2015 to successfully pitch the original mini, since OMD wouldn't be a factor. So far as why Marvel eventually continued it as an ongoing and has done other stuff since either depicting Peter and MJ married or in a committed relationship, my guess is that the brass in charge doesn't have a problem with the marriage being a piece of the franchise in and of itself, but that they "just" don't want it to be the 616 status quo. (And let's be frank, outside of Fantastic Four, even among superhero characters like Spider-Man who have a codified "one true love," the relationship is always reset somewhere down the line to allow writers to change things up and bring them back as they wish. Heck, Peter and MJ were the oddity in that it lasted unbroken as long as it did.)

I do like RYV, too. Wish it would come back.

Even though it lasted for so long, there were plenty of attempts at ending the marriage, like killing off MJ (Which got retconned), and before that, Clone Saga had plans to make her divorce Peter, and the whole nonsense of "Ben was the original".

I remember that. I also remember them raging about how Slott got a cameo in a crowd scene in the second issue. I personally didn't find what I read of his 616 Spider-Man stuff to be very enjoyable and I disagree with a lot of his interpretation of the franchise, but it was unreal just how much hate he got (esp. when it was him being blamed for OMD, which he wasn't even involved with).

Those idiots take their dislike for Slott too far, while I don't really think he's that competent of a writer, he gets really over hated just for existing, it's pathetic really.

A lot of people were involved in developing OMD behind the scenes besides Quesada, Brevoort, Alonzo, and JMS. Even Bendis contributed to the discussions. None of the others get talked about as much because Quesada, Brevoort and JMS made themselves the public faces of the decision.

Slott apparently did have a hand in helping Quesada out with sorting out the continuity issues of One Moment In Time also

I remember hearing that Bendis had a plan in Siege to undo OMD, which Quesada dismissed, though I'm not sure if it's actually true.

Either way, Quesada is generally the big name when it comes to having OMD happen to begin with, and from what I hear, he's also the reason Janet got killed for a while, Jean also got killed a few years before Civil War just so Cyke could end up with Emma, basically Marvel was being really butthurt about marriages for a while, and it's a surprise F4 escaped that nonsense, but thinking of it, I wonder if there were plans for Civil War to cause more permanent damage in Reed's and Sue's relationship.

[Matt Rat]

Peter and MJ getting back together might be part of the reason RYV got cancelled, but the comic also had a drop of quality a bit before Annie got aged up, that probably didn't help too.

Largely in part because Gerry Conway walked off the job as soon as Marvel demanded Mary Jane use the Venom symbiote, leaving Ryan Stegman lumbered with writing duties.

[exile001]

Anybody remember Pedro?

Or more extreme, the time she was running Stark Industries? Lol.

[Matt Rat]

Or more extreme, the time she was running Stark Industries? Lol.

They didn't do a good job of explaining why she fell out with Tony...

...Oh wait, it's Tony.

[Huntsman Spider]

They didn't do a good job of explaining why she fell out with Tony...

...Oh wait, it's Tony.

Yeah, though at least as of more recent Iron Man issues, he's considerably more aware of his personal flaws and how they've made maintaining his relationships --- whether platonic, familial, or romantic --- a lot more difficult than they had to be, which is something a lot of people can honestly relate to, even if they don't take it to the same potentially apocalyptic extremes as you tend to see in a superhero comic.