Mary Jane Watson = Plot Device to Peters Misery

[Kevinroc]

I think he wanted Peter and Gwen to end the regular series as a couple, but that something would happen in the movies and MJ would be the endgame

I said show's universe (and then clarified it would have happened in one of the DTV movies he wanted to do).

[Matt Rat]

I said show's universe (and then clarified it would have happened in one of the DTV movies he wanted to do).

I know, I figured what you meant at the last minute. All's good

[Lukmendes]

How often do you see callbacks and references to Spec in other Spider-Man media? Even the current cartoon for Pre-Schoolers is a reference to Amazing Friends (Spidey and His Amazing Friends).

Weird **** gets callbacks, Herbie is a callback to a shitty F4 cartoon that doesn't have Johnny, and too many don't even know or care about it.

My point is that Spectacular is more popular than Amazing Friends, which is at best is known for "The cartoon that debutted Firestar".

[Kevinroc]

Weird **** gets callbacks, Herbie is a callback to a shitty F4 cartoon that doesn't have Johnny, and too many don't even know or care about it.

My point is that Spectacular is more popular than Amazing Friends, which is at best is known for "The cartoon that debutted Firestar".

I really only hear about Spectacular around here. I've seen no discussions about it going to D+ even with the deal between Marvel and Sony for Spider-Man films. It's certainly still popular among the hardcore, but everyone else has just moved on.

[Lukmendes]

I really only hear about Spectacular around here. I've seen no discussions about it going to D+ even with the deal between Marvel and Sony for Spider-Man films. It's certainly still popular among the hardcore, but everyone else has just moved on.

I know people who don't give a **** about the comics and still speak highly of it, it's not a niche cartoon that only comic nerds have watched.

Meanwhile, aside from people here, I hardly ever find people even aware of Amazing Friends.

[Kevinroc]

I know people who don't give a **** about the comics and still speak highly of it, it's not a niche cartoon that only comic nerds have watched.

Meanwhile, aside from people here, I hardly ever find people even aware of Amazing Friends.

That's what's known as anecdotal evidence.

In its day, Amazing Friends was a huge deal (which is why it is still getting referenced in 2022). A far bigger deal than Spec ever was. If your argument is a 13 year old cartoon is more popular than a 40 year old cartoon because your social circle is more aware of said 13 year old cartoon, that's not quite how such things are measured.

If you want to argue that Spec was the better show, I would agree.

[Lukmendes]

That's what's known as anecdotal evidence.

In its day, Amazing Friends was a huge deal (which is why it is still getting referenced in 2022). A far bigger deal than Spec ever was.

Cool, so was Fantastic Four, time advances and stuff loses relevance.

Disney+ did help in making newer fans aware of it, but again, I hardly see people knowing about it regardless.

If your argument is a 13 year old cartoon is more popular than a 40 year old cartoon because your social circle is more aware of said 13 year old cartoon, that's not quite how such things are measured.

It's not just a friends circle since I hardly see anyone knowing about it lol.

If you want to argue that Spec was the better show, I would agree.

Not talking about quality, 90's Spidey cartoon is quite clearly the most famous one and that's undeniable, as much as I prefer Spectacular, 90's cartoon is significantly above it (And I think 90's cartoon is crap), if I got the impression Amazing Friends was above Spectacular in popularity we wouldn't be having this conversation lol.

[Huntsman Spider]

The New Batman Adventures was replaced by Batman Beyond because the network wanted a teenage Batman. The Batman had a younger than usual Bruce Wayne, then added a teenage Batgirl and later Robin. Batman: The Brave and the Bold was all about the colorful characters and didn't get into Bruce Wayne's life so much. Beware the Batman got buried.

I wouldn't expect a children's Batman animated series made today to focus on Bruce Wayne's adult concerns, but rather the kid appeal of the costume, the vehicles, the gadgets etc.

Batman being an adult is ingrained into the premise of the series. With Spider-Man, the source material offers a choice: he can be a high school kid, a college student or a young adult with a job. Given those choices, and the current trends of American children's television animation, it's incredibly unlikely, bordering on wishful thinking, to expect them to not go with the high school version. That's the reality.

Relevant to this: https://www.inverse.com/entertainmen...game-interview

Funny enough, Batman Beyond was an example of the creators sticking to the letter of what the network execs wanted while completely (and awesomely) subverting what said execs had in mind. After all, a "teenage Batman" didn't necessarily have to be Bruce Wayne, so the creators just set it about 40 (originally hinted or implied to be 50) years into the future and had a long-retired Bruce mentoring the new Batman as his protege and successor in a much darker, more dangerous high-tech version of Gotham City. No reason Marvel couldn't go in a similar direction with a future Spider-Man adaptation.

[Kevinroc]

Cool, so was Fantastic Four, time advances and stuff loses relevance.

Disney+ did help in making newer fans aware of it, but again, I hardly see people knowing about it regardless.



It's not just a friends circle since I hardly see anyone knowing about it lol.



Not talking about quality, 90's Spidey cartoon is quite clearly the most famous one and that's undeniable, as much as I prefer Spectacular, 90's cartoon is significantly above it (And I think 90's cartoon is crap), if I got the impression Amazing Friends was above Spectacular in popularity we wouldn't be having this conversation lol.

I look at impact and measure from there. Spec has left almost no impact on the overall franchise. The trend of really pushing Peter Parker as a high school student is a relatively recent idea that really started with the Ultimate Spider-Man comics. (The Ultimate Spider-Man comics have left a huge impact on the franchise and not just for the creation of Miles Morales.)

Spec's legacy is that it was a good series that was cancelled too soon. It doesn't get homages or referenced at all. There's been no real talk of a revival. I can't think of it as one of the most popular Spider-Man cartoons for that reason.

[Kevinroc]

Funny enough, Batman Beyond was an example of the creators sticking to the letter of what the network execs wanted while completely (and awesomely) subverting what said execs had in mind. After all, a "teenage Batman" didn't necessarily have to be Bruce Wayne, so the creators just set it about 40 (originally hinted or implied to be 50) years into the future and had a long-retired Bruce mentoring the new Batman as his protege and successor in a much darker, more dangerous high-tech version of Gotham City. No reason Marvel couldn't go in a similar direction with a future Spider-Man adaptation.

Wouldn't mind a Miles Morales series with an older Peter being a terrible mentor. (Such an adaptation really should be a Mayday series, but what'cha gonna do?)

[Huntsman Spider]

Wouldn't mind a Miles Morales series with an older Peter being a terrible mentor. (Such an adaptation really should be a Mayday series, but what'cha gonna do?)

Hmm, yeah. Like Into the Spider-Verse? And yes, we should finally get a Mayday series or adaptation somewhere. Maybe Across the Spider-Verse, Part 1 or 2?

[Kevinroc]

Hmm, yeah. Like Into the Spider-Verse? And yes, we should finally get a Mayday series or adaptation somewhere. Maybe Across the Spider-Verse, Part 1 or 2?

I did a reread of Mayday's Spider-Girl series last year. Peter and MJ hover between being supportive and being terrified, and Peter is a terrible mentor in the times when he is trying to be supportive. But Miles is absolutely a bigger deal.

[Huntsman Spider]

I did a reread of Mayday's Spider-Girl series last year. Peter and MJ hover between being supportive and being terrified, and Peter is a terrible mentor in the times when he is trying to be supportive. But Miles is absolutely a bigger deal.

Hmm, thanks for the reminder.

[Frontier]

I look at impact and measure from there. Spec has left almost no impact on the overall franchise. The trend of really pushing Peter Parker as a high school student is a relatively recent idea that really started with the Ultimate Spider-Man comics. (The Ultimate Spider-Man comics have left a huge impact on the franchise and not just for the creation of Miles Morales.)

Spec's legacy is that it was a good series that was cancelled too soon. It doesn't get homages or referenced at all. There's been no real talk of a revival. I can't think of it as one of the most popular Spider-Man cartoons for that reason.

I think Spec contributed to the character revamping of Gwen Stacy.

It was homaged in Zdarsky's Spectacular run and maybe one or two other times. A revival isn't physically possible so of course there have never been any serious talks about it. I mean, I love the 90's show but I see nowhere near the level of love for it that Spectacular gets, and the Disney cartoons probably aren't in the running.

Wouldn't mind a Miles Morales series with an older Peter being a terrible mentor. (Such an adaptation really should be a Mayday series, but what'cha gonna do?)

The only way I'd be okay with Peter in a Miles series is if he's an AU Peter who isn't permanently in Miles' dimension or physically unable to ever be Spider-Man again.

I did a reread of Mayday's Spider-Girl series last year. Peter and MJ hover between being supportive and being terrified, and Peter is a terrible mentor in the times when he is trying to be supportive. But Miles is absolutely a bigger deal.

I'd prefer calling him a complicated mentor to terrible.

[Kevinroc]

I think Spec contributed to the character revamping of Gwen Stacy.

It was homaged in Zdarsky's Spectacular run and maybe one or two other times. A revival isn't physically possible so of course there have never been any serious talks about it. I mean, I love the 90's show but I see nowhere near the level of love for it that Spectacular gets, and the Disney cartoons probably aren't in the running.

I'd say the Ultimate Spider-Man comic started the revamping of Gwen Stacy, even if it was a different direction than was the usual at the time.

I'd certainly rate Spec as "more popular" than any of the series that came after it. The fact that the MCU deal and the Holland movies exist at all is not something that is the usual in the industry. If those can happen, people should be pushing for a Spec revival, or at least getting the series on D+ or something. But... nothing... I don't see the series as being as big a deal as other people clearly do.

The only way I'd be okay with Peter in a Miles series is if he's an AU Peter who isn't permanently in Miles' dimension or physically unable to ever be Spider-Man again.

I'm thinking something like what Bruce was like in Batman Beyond.

I'd prefer calling him a complicated mentor to terrible.

It sounds nicer, but he was a terrible mentor. It's definitely where Into the Spider-Verse got the idea.