Dark Web

[Lunala]

Normie

The protagonists in the novels To Kill a Mockingbird, A Song of Ice and Fire, Ender's Game, The Girl Who Loved Tom Gordon, etc. are around those ages.

I'd like to think the idea that Peter is younger than 30+ is disproved if Normie is a preteen.

[Kevinroc]

The really strange thing about Zeb Wells continuing to point to JMD and JMS as his favorite runs is that he's one the one who supposedly said during BND that Mary Jane was boring and a drag, all she did was wait by the window. But those are two runs where MJ was anything but a drag, she had her own life, and she was integral to the stories being told - can't tell The Child Within/Death of Harry Osborn without her, she's important to the The Other story, too, and Doomed Affairs, which is one of JMS's most acclaimed issues, certainly doesn't work without her.

So again, I'm back to reading comprehension issues or he just simply doesn't believe women can nor should play an important, positive role in hero's lives. Certainly he's already reduced Felicia and Gwen to rewards for Peter's decent behavior and turned MJ into an expressionless damsel object who has had all the life and personality leeched out of her, while Aunt May is just a saintly mother figure.

Basically, women don't exist in Wells's run - to date - except as objects to make Peter feel either better (Felicia, Gwen, May) or bad (MJ, Kamala digging at him) about himself. (Moira was just cartoonish evil, she was barely a character). Even when the women aren't expressly revolving around Peter, their thoughts revolve around other men, like Anna Maria being obssessed with Ock in ASM 900.

And, y'know, he did the same thing in his She-Hulk episode. The Retreat episode was humorous, but the only woman in the episode is Jen, the title character. No Nikki, no Mallory, no Titania, not even a mention of Blonsky's soulmates who paid for the retreat in the first place. Jen's thoughts only revolved around the guy who ghosted her, and the Retreat was basically men reassuing Jen that not all men are like that, there's a guy out there who will like her because having a boy like you is all a gal needs to be happy apparently. Even the minor characters: the tow truck driver, the parole officer - were male.

I think the internet is too quick to label someone as something. I think Wells isn't very good at handling the drama and angst in a satisfying manner. He has Peter and MJ break-up off-panel with no explanation (yes, I know the explanation is supposed to happen after Dark Web). Felicia knowing she's Peter's rebound and seemingly being cool with it despite all the character development she got in (particularly in MacKay's Black Cat series), and once again hitting the "Peter is sad about Gwen" button, with the Progenitor being cool with Peter's recent actions and blessing him with Gwen's presence (despite this not being how it works anywhere else).

[Huntsman Spider]

https://www.marvel.com/articles/comi...-eve-nycc-2022

Normie Osborn gets an ongoing whe not even Felicia can sustain one? Wow

I'm just curious as to how that's gonna work when the Carnage remnants inside Normie were extracted in Absolute Carnage.

I think the internet is too quick to label someone as something. I think Wells isn't very good at handling the drama and angst in a satisfying manner. He has Peter and MJ break-up off-panel with no explanation (yes, I know the explanation is supposed to happen after Dark Web). Felicia knowing she's Peter's rebound and seemingly being cool with it despite all the character development she got in (particularly in MacKay's Black Cat series), and once again hitting the "Peter is sad about Gwen" button, with the Progenitor being cool with Peter's recent actions and blessing him with Gwen's presence (despite this not being how it works anywhere else).

Fair enough.

[Mercwmouth12]

What if hallows eve isnt Janine but Betty

[TinkerSpider]

What if hallows eve isnt Janine but Betty

Does anyone really care?

With the solicit for Mary Jane and Black Cat #2 revealing now MJ has powers, the only question is who in Peter's life DOESN'T have some sort of superpower? Get ready for Golden Oldie Aunt May to appear any minute now. :rolleyes

So incredibly bored. The one thing Wells's run had sort of going for it was a return to more street level stories after Spencer's supernaturalpalooza, but he's giving interviews where he says he's most excited about Dark Web because of Ben and Madelyne and teaming up with the X-Men (um, Zeb, you are aware that Spider-Man is the titular hero, right? Right?) and now he's handing out powers like candy to MJ and apparently Janine (or maybe Betty, or maybe it's Carlie or Liz, who cares). And we're probably not going to know who Hallows' Eve is because the only thing Wells can rely on for reader engagement is to throw mystery box after mystery box at the reader without any progress on the boxes he's already thrown. I know he says the "What did Peter do?" mystery box will be solved after Dark Web - but originally he said it would be solved by the time Dark Web started, so he's obviously just making it up as he goes along and doesn't really have a plan.

Really hoping Wells's run ends sooner than later.

[Pav]

What if hallows eve isnt Janine but Betty

Does anyone really care?

Certainly.

I can't say I'm thrilled with the idea of Janine having super powers -- I'm definitely in "wait and see" mode, as per usual -- but I'm still just kind of in awe that she's being used at all.

Honestly, before Beyond, how many people felt confident that we'd ever see Janine again?

Say what you will about everyone having powers, but I am keen on her continued use.

-Pav, who's interested to see how Chasm, Hallow's Eve, and Queen Goblin will interact in future stories...

[Mercwmouth12]

Certainly.

I can't say I'm thrilled with the idea of Janine having super powers -- I'm definitely in "wait and see" mode, as per usual -- but I'm still just kind of in awe that she's being used at all.

Honestly, before Beyond, how many people felt confident that we'd ever see Janine again?

Say what you will about everyone having powers, but I am keen on her continued use.

-Pav, who's interested to see how Chasm, Hallow's Eve, and Queen Goblin will interact in future stories...

Actually one that makes more sense now is Liz. If we're going full symbiote stuff. She has access to goblin tech from her home hidden away. Clearly the books are moving to the Osborn legacy and she would have access to the tech as well and falls under the heavily established characters

[TinkerSpider]

Actually one that makes more sense now is Liz. If we're going full symbiote stuff. She has access to goblin tech from her home hidden away. Clearly the books are moving to the Osborn legacy and she would have access to the tech as well and falls under the heavily established characters

We know from solicits Normie is the Red Goblin - when he needed a babysitter just a few issues ago - so why not Liz, make it a whole family who thinks the calendar only consists of October. :rolleyes

[Ursalink]

We know from solicits Normie is the Red Goblin - when he needed a babysitter just a few issues ago - so why not Liz, make it a whole family who thinks the calendar only consists of October. :rolleyes

This is another reason why I like MC2's Spider-Girl and RYV's Spiderling so much. In both realities, Peter and MJ's offspring manages to make Normie Osborn to break ties with its family's curse; but on Earth-616, without her, Normie keeps getting cursed by the Goblin's curse.

[Huntsman Spider]

This is another reason why I like MC2's Spider-Girl and RYV's Spiderling so much. In both realities, Peter and MJ's offspring manages to make Normie Osborn to break ties with its family's curse; but on Earth-616, without her, Normie keeps getting cursed by the Goblin's curse.

Which is probably why Mephisto interfered in the first place, because beyond his foreseen ultimate defeat at the hands of Peter and Mary Jane's daughter, said daughter would be a force for good unlike any other in the MU and that would mess things up for him even more.

[Lukmendes]

The protagonists in the novels To Kill a Mockingbird, A Song of Ice and Fire, Ender's Game, The Girl Who Loved Tom Gordon, etc. are around those ages.

I'd like to think the idea that Peter is younger than 30+ is disproved if Normie is a preteen.

The timeline makes no sense anyways, Dylan looks way too old for Spidey to be less than 30 lol.

I think the internet is too quick to label someone as something. I think Wells isn't very good at handling the drama and angst in a satisfying manner. He has Peter and MJ break-up off-panel with no explanation (yes, I know the explanation is supposed to happen after Dark Web).

Honestly, the problem is that timeskips are annoying and very hard to do correctly, 'cause the changes have to feel in some way, organic, and you need to do pretty good writing for what happened to feel justified, and the writing of the post timeskip stuff has to be good too.

So yeah, chances of Wells managing to make this interesting are minimal.

and once again hitting the "Peter is sad about Gwen" button,

Kinda annoying how over time he moved on less from Gwen lol.

with the Progenitor being cool with Peter's recent actions and blessing him with Gwen's presence (despite this not being how it works anywhere else).

I still think Spidey shouldn't have passed lol.

Although the Celestial's standards are a bit fucked up... On the other hand he definitely shouldn't have rewarded Spidey.

Does anyone really care?

With the solicit for Mary Jane and Black Cat #2 revealing now MJ has powers, the only question is who in Peter's life DOESN'T have some sort of superpower? Get ready for Golden Oldie Aunt May to appear any minute now. :rolleyes

I prefer Spider-Ma'am .

So incredibly bored. The one thing Wells's run had sort of going for it was a return to more street level stories after Spencer's supernaturalpalooza, but he's giving interviews where he says he's most excited about Dark Web because of Ben and Madelyne and teaming up with the X-Men (um, Zeb, you are aware that Spider-Man is the titular hero, right? Right?) and now he's handing out powers like candy to MJ and apparently Janine (or maybe Betty, or maybe it's Carlie or Liz, who cares).

Venom has stolen Liz, so probably not her.

So annoying how other characters keep stealing from Spidey's world...

And we're probably not going to know who Hallows' Eve is because the only thing Wells can rely on for reader engagement is to throw mystery box after mystery box at the reader without any progress on the boxes he's already thrown. I know he says the "What did Peter do?" mystery box will be solved after Dark Web - but originally he said it would be solved by the time Dark Web started, so he's obviously just making it up as he goes along and doesn't really have a plan.

Really? Huh, well that sucks lol.

Really hoping Wells's run ends sooner than later.

Careful with that Monkey's Pawn man.

[Kevinroc]

Honestly, the problem is that timeskips are annoying and very hard to do correctly, 'cause the changes have to feel in some way, organic, and you need to do pretty good writing for what happened to feel justified, and the writing of the post timeskip stuff has to be good too.

So yeah, chances of Wells managing to make this interesting are minimal.

Oh, the writing in this volume is atrocious. I'm just saying that some people on the internet are too quick to label him a misogynist.

Kinda annoying how over time he moved on less from Gwen lol.

Honestly, it feels like bad fanfiction. You would think with the advent of Spider-Gwen, Marvel would have moved on, but they keep doubling down on Gwen as the "tragic lost love" of Peter's life.

I still think Spidey shouldn't have passed lol.

Although the Celestial's standards are a bit fucked up... On the other hand he definitely shouldn't have rewarded Spidey.

Agreed on both counts. The Progenitor failed Steve Rogers and passed Doctor Doom. Its standards are messed up.

[Lukmendes]

Oh, the writing in this volume is atrocious. I'm just saying that some people on the internet are too quick to label him a misogynist.

Oh that's what you meant lol.

Well using someone's writing of characters to label 'em is, complicated, you could easily say that Garth Ennis is a psychopath 'cause of what he writes lol.

Ultimately though, what one writes and what one is in life can be two different things, my favorite example is Ruroini Kenshin, it's a story about trying to be a better person basically, and its creator is a pedophile.

Honestly, it feels like bad fanfiction.

At least fanfictions are free, and mostly aren't fucking with people's perceptions of characters.

You would think with the advent of Spider-Gwen, Marvel would have moved on, but they keep doubling down on Gwen as the "tragic lost love" of Peter's life.

Old dogs, new tricks, y'know how it goes lol.

Agreed on both counts. The Progenitor failed Steve Rogers and passed Doctor Doom. Its standards are messed up.

I guess passing Spidey is an example of the standards being messed up too .

[Kevinroc]

Oh that's what you meant lol.

Well using someone's writing of characters to label 'em is, complicated, you could easily say that Garth Ennis is a psychopath 'cause of what he writes lol.

Ultimately though, what one writes and what one is in life can be two different things, my favorite example is Ruroini Kenshin, it's a story about trying to be a better person basically, and its creator is a pedophile.

Yeah, I'm familiar with Rurouni Kenshin and its creator. I used to really like it too. But... uumm... yeah...

At least fanfictions are free, and mostly aren't fucking with people's perceptions of characters.

The ultimate message of Gwen's death is it is possible to find love again, but acting like Peter "settled" for MJ because "the love of his life" died is such an unhealthy viewpoint that later creators and Marvel Editorial have embraced. And is that really the message you want to send? I get the need for "drama", but that's just such a terrible message to send.

Old dogs, new tricks, y'know how it goes lol.

I mean, I never expect them to use dead love interest Gwen in a show, movie, video game, etc. again. Editorial just talked about how they want to be the inspiration to the next batch of MCU content, but they're still relying on "Gwen died and Peter never got over it" stories, lol.

I guess passing Spidey is an example of the standards being messed up too .

LOL. Maybe that's a good point, but the whole issue reads like they got notes on how the Progenitor is supposed to work and they didn't quite get it because it is totally different in that one tie-in issue than it is in the big event comic.

[Lukmendes]

Yeah, I'm familiar with Rurouni Kenshin and its creator. I used to really like it too. But... uumm... yeah...

Apparently he got his job back just fine lol.

Ironically now he's a similar situation that Kenshin himself was, with everyone hating him for shit he did in the past.

The ultimate message of Gwen's death is it is possible to find love again, but acting like Peter "settled" for MJ because "the love of his life" died is such an unhealthy viewpoint that later creators and Marvel Editorial have embraced. And is that really the message you want to send? I get the need for "drama", but that's just such a terrible message to send.

I doubt they're even sending any message intentionally, they just want Spidey to be miserable and that's that.

I mean, I never expect them to use dead love interest Gwen in a show, movie, video game, etc. again. Editorial just talked about how they want to be the inspiration to the next batch of MCU content, but they're still relying on "Gwen died and Peter never got over it" stories, lol.

That tells you about how inspired editorial is.

LOL. Maybe that's a good point, but the whole issue reads like they got notes on how the Progenitor is supposed to work and they didn't quite get it because it is totally different in that one tie-in issue than it is in the big event comic.

While I can't say anything about how he passed Spidey, the fact Spidey got some Gwen-related reward makes me wonder if Wells even read the notes lol.

At best, maybe at some point the Celestial was meant to give rewards and ASM got an early version of that (Stuff like that has happened a few times), but somehow I doubt it.