The psychology of comic book fans

[Marvel_Is]

Question for you. What matters to you more, the status quo or the story?

Honestly, it can be an either/or. Because just because something returns to status quo does not mean that you will like what will come out of that alone. And as far as the story is concerned, it may not hit the right notes that will resonate with you personally, even if those stories may be good in their own right.

That how the (main) Hulk series is going right now for example - the story being told may be legitimately good right now, but it doesn't resonate with me. But, also, just simply returning it to status quo doesn't mean it'd scratch my itch either.

It's really just really an answer of if it's a hit with you, then that's just what it is. Time has a way with our perspective.

[emac1790]

Personally speaking. I say the story. If one constantly uses the status quo approach then it just handicaps a writer from telling fresh stories and letting it's characters and universe develop.

Look at the Hulk. The only real status quo he has is he's Bruce Banner. He's been green, gray, smart, dumb, hero and menace. The story has to serve him because there is no status quo to fall back on.

[Legato]

Look at the Hulk. The only real status quo he has is he's Bruce Banner. He's been green, gray, smart, dumb, hero and menace. The story has to serve him because there is no status quo to fall back on.

Also The Ultimate Universe doesn't cater to the status quo. It tells a story then uses the consequences of said story as a means to move forward.

[emac1790]

The next question is, what is more important to a superhero comic, continuity or a good story? Are they mutually exclusive?

[emac1790]

Anybody here ashamed of reading superhero comics in public? If so, why?

My answer is no, I'm not ashamed of reading superhero comics in public. If I have a comic on me while I ride the train, I'll pull it out in a heartbeat. I pulled out my Essential Warlock on the train and a cop asked me when did it come out because Warlock was one of his favorite superheroes.

[Pharozonk]

Continuity of the universe a story takes place in matters to me just as much as the story itself. It's why most Marvel NOW! and Nu52 stuff leaves me out cold.

[mlazic]

The next question is, what is more important to a superhero comic, continuity or a good story? Are they mutually exclusive?

I'm definitely in the good story camp. If the story is great I don't care if it doesn't mesh 100% with previous set continuity. I agree with what Tom Brevoort often says on his tumblr page, essentially that continuity & history is meant to be there to service the stories, not the other way around.

[Marvel_Is]

I'd have to say continuity. Continuity is magic because it helps to bring the shared universe aspect to life and it gives the reader hope that things can always be seen/used again. A good story in a superhero comic is just that. But, I'm into characters more than anything, and I like to see aspects of continuity sometimes inform the stories I'm reading so that any given story isn't a total loss.

Most stories in comics are merely average. That's a just a fact. Not terrible, but average. Some stories are bad and some are good. But, one constant in a mainstream superhero comic is the fact that there is continuity that can be used as a storytelling device.

[emac1790]

I don't think continuity and a good story are mutually exclusive. A good story can be in continuity and continuity can lead to a good story. I prefer a good story, continuity be damned, but if it's a good story wrapped up in continuity, it's just icing on the cake.

[Marvel_Is]

I'm embarrassed to read comics in public I'll admit. Everyone's sitting around me reading their monochromatic adult drivel and here I am breaking the normality with my shiny, multi-colored pamphlet. lol

I'm also slightly embarrassed to wear my superhero shirts out, and I'll try to wear the ones that look less like a comic book shirt. But, there are other times when I'm just like, "!@#$ it!". lol

[Marvel_Is]

I don't think continuity and a good story are mutually exclusive. A good story can be in continuity and continuity can lead to a good story. I prefer a good story, continuity be damned, but if it's a good story wrapped up in continuity, it's just icing on the cake.

I can dig that.

[Goggindowner]

Also The Ultimate Universe doesn't cater to the status quo. It tells a story then uses the consequences of said story as a means to move forward.

Which, for me, is why Ultimate Marvel was hitting all the right chords for me, especially after they killed off so many of the characters and skewed as far from the MU as they could basically get. I tried following the relaunch when Hickman was doing Ultimates, but I just can't read books monthly anymore and fell out of it.

[CSTowle]

You get fanboyish behavior from cape fans who want things to stay the same and are rarely willing to give new things a try until they've been convinced they're worth checking out (and sometimes not even then), and you get adolescent snobbishness from "indie" comic fans who assume that almost anything with a Marvel or DC logo on the cover that isn't done by a creator with indie comic street cred (and again, sometimes not even then) is absolute garbage. There are misguided fans/people among all hobbies.

As to the psychology of fans who get upset over things like OMD, I'd agree it's the feeling of attachment fans get after following a comic for years and sometimes decades. It's not something you can get from movies, it's not something you can really get from TV outside of soap operas and the Simpsons, so when they've been living in their comfort zone and someone gets an idea that radically alters that it's understandable they'd get upset. Also, suspension of disbelief. I've been annoyed (though not to the point of boycotting or even writing a letter, way too much effort) at things like OMD because I enjoyed watching Peter Parker progress as an adult and because the reasons behind it (we could have a whole new thread about the psychology of creators uncomfortable with characters having already progressed) seemed suspect.

But I'm also old enough to know two things which squash my annoyance and allow me to quickly move on when this happens to a comic I love: 1. I'm under no obligation to continue buying. That may be a hard cord to cut when I've been reading for a while, but with reboots/new issue #1s and creative team turnover I'm always provided with plenty of jumping-off points and have become used to it. And 2. There are too many good comics out there for me to ever afford, so when there's a bad one that's just an excuse to drop it and check out one of the many titles I've been wanting to but haven't had the money for. There are also so many good comics in trade form that I could drop monthlies altogether and focus on those and probably never run out of good comics.

[emac1790]

You get fanboyish behavior from cape fans who want things to stay the same and are rarely willing to give new things a try until they've been convinced they're worth checking out (and sometimes not even then), and you get adolescent snobbishness from "indie" comic fans who assume that almost anything with a Marvel or DC logo on the cover that isn't done by a creator with indie comic street cred (and again, sometimes not even then) is absolute garbage. There are misguided fans/people among all hobbies.

As to the psychology of fans who get upset over things like OMD, I'd agree it's the feeling of attachment fans get after following a comic for years and sometimes decades. It's not something you can get from movies, it's not something you can really get from TV outside of soap operas and the Simpsons, so when they've been living in their comfort zone and someone gets an idea that radically alters that it's understandable they'd get upset. Also, suspension of disbelief. I've been annoyed (though not to the point of boycotting or even writing a letter, way too much effort) at things like OMD because I enjoyed watching Peter Parker progress as an adult and because the reasons behind it (we could have a whole new thread about the psychology of creators uncomfortable with characters having already progressed) seemed suspect.

But I'm also old enough to know two things which squash my annoyance and allow me to quickly move on when this happens to a comic I love: 1. I'm under no obligation to continue buying. That may be a hard cord to cut when I've been reading for a while, but with reboots/new issue #1s and creative team turnover I'm always provided with plenty of jumping-off points and have become used to it. And 2. There are too many good comics out there for me to ever afford, so when there's a bad one that's just an excuse to drop it and check out one of the many titles I've been wanting to but haven't had the money for. There are also so many good comics in trade form that I could drop monthlies altogether and focus on those and probably never run out of good comics.

I know I said "let's stick to superheroes" but you bring up a excellent point. Yes, some indie comics fans are snobs. (you see this in some indie music fans, too) There is a mind set that believes indie=good, corporate=bad. Just because something is indie, it doesn't mean they're good comics. I read some good indie comics and some indie comics that, quite frankly, should have been never released to the public.

Another thing to consider is what is "indie". If indie means free from corporate influence, that's one thing. But that doesn't mean these indie comics are not out there to make money. A better name for such comics is alternative comics. Comics alternative to what DC/Marvel puts out. Comics like these offer a wide range of genres.

Another good point you brought up is the psychology of creators. We know that many creators are some of the biggest fans of comics, but even they are not immune to the stereotyped fanboy behavior.

Take Alex Ross, for example. He sees himself as a comic book purist. I've read many of his interviews with him stating things like "Superhero-Man shouldn't be like that. He should be like this". Sometimes he comes off like the ultimate snob. I don't agree with many of his views because to me, they seem like they're fueled by pure nostalgia. I find some of his ideas limiting to comics overall. It's like he wants to freeze comics to a certain time. The time when he first started reading them and falling in love with them.(one of the reasons Marvels ended at the death of Gwen is because Ross felt that was the end of the Marvel U. Keep in mind, Gwen died in 1973) Comics can't survive that way. Nothing can survive that way. All things eventually change. Stagnation is death.

Imagine a guy like that running DC.

[ed2962]

Imagine a guy like that running DC.

Right up until the nu52, that's exactly what folks were saying against Geoff Johns. That he was bringing back all the characters he grew up on and that he was stuck on nostalgia.