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  1. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by krazijoe View Post
    Not a fan of the first episode but the rest of them were straight up baller. Wait, should a 52 year old man be using that terminology? Ok, they are awesome! There, that probably sounds better.
    I do wish they did a little more with Dooku to show more of the why he fell and how he fell. I mean, he was a pretty strong Jedi and should not have been so easily swayed by the Emperor.
    I've always kind of thought the dirt secret about writing Dooku is that he works best when he's basically "too orthodox" at being a Jedi, becomes too detached from other people, and thus just becomes obsessed with being a disciplined enforcer of order, like a cop growing corrupt because he doesn't have any compassion in a job where, whether the management emphasize it or not, compassion is much more necessary than detachment.

    He clearly thinks he's being a great Jedi, looking out for and defending the authority of the Order where others would neglect it, but bristles at others being rewarded for doing what he sees as less effective jobs - in part because he wants to treat the Order and their authority as being what matters more than either the members or the public/Republic they serve. It's like how quickly he moves to uncover why a fellow Jedi was killed, but seems uninterested in the actual problem of the people in the episodes beyond their function as motives, and why, even though it has some impact on him emotionally, he is ready to betray Qui-Gon so easily.

    I think its a bit of a dirty secret because it provides a condemnation of detachment in contrast to LFL's desire to be able to reject relationship for Jedi they don't want with the "no attachments" rule they so inconsistently apply.
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  2. #47
    Extraordinary Member thwhtGuardian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by godisawesome View Post
    I've always kind of thought the dirt secret about writing Dooku is that he works best when he's basically "too orthodox" at being a Jedi, becomes too detached from other people, and thus just becomes obsessed with being a disciplined enforcer of order, like a cop growing corrupt because he doesn't have any compassion in a job where, whether the management emphasize it or not, compassion is much more necessary than detachment.

    He clearly thinks he's being a great Jedi, looking out for and defending the authority of the Order where others would neglect it, but bristles at others being rewarded for doing what he sees as less effective jobs - in part because he wants to treat the Order and their authority as being what matters more than either the members or the public/Republic they serve. It's like how quickly he moves to uncover why a fellow Jedi was killed, but seems uninterested in the actual problem of the people in the episodes beyond their function as motives, and why, even though it has some impact on him emotionally, he is ready to betray Qui-Gon so easily.

    I think its a bit of a dirty secret because it provides a condemnation of detachment in contrast to LFL's desire to be able to reject relationship for Jedi they don't want with the "no attachments" rule they so inconsistently apply.
    That's pretty much the opposite of who Dooku was though, both from what we saw here and from what was known previously by the characterization of Qui-Gon Jon being labeled unorthodox and commenting that he learned it from his master.
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  3. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by thwhtGuardian View Post
    That's pretty much the opposite of who Dooku was though, both from what we saw here and from what was known previously by the characterization of Qui-Gon Jon being labeled unorthodox and commenting that he learned it from his master.
    Dooku is unorthodox, but its a completely different type of unorthodox compared to Qui-Gon.

    Dooku wants to be a Cowboy Cop Jedi, sure, especially with his focus on using a dueling style suited more for melee and his tendency to bend or break the rules - but its because he wants to be a Jedi without accountability, rather than a servant of the Force or the people. He wants to fight the symptoms of dangerously corrupt senators, not the cause of inequality; he wants to smite the wicked, not help the helpless. He hates his enemies, he doesn't love his neighbors.

    And that's very much a compassionless, detached, inward-looking perspective that contrasts hugely with Qui-Gon's warm compassion, empathy, and willingness to connect on a deeper level with people. Qui-Gon learned the rules are flexible, but his instincts and observations are the opposite of his master's; he sees pain and hurt among victims, and determines how to de-escalate a scenario through understanding and love, while Dooku sees cancer to be cut out.

    And then, years later, Dooku is simply shuffling who he targets and what his "victory conditions" are, because while he tells himself he cares about stopping corruption... he really doesn't, because that would require caring about others, as seen when he starts complaining about being an accessory to Qui-Gon's death more like a business decision he didn't like than as a bereaved father or teacher.
    Like action, adventure, rogues, and outlaws? Like anti-heroes, femme fatales, mysteries and thrillers?

    I wrote a book with them. Outlaw’s Shadow: A Sherwood Noir. Robin Hood’s evil counterpart, Guy of Gisbourne, is the main character. Feel free to give it a look: https://read.amazon.com/kp/embed?asi...E2PKBNJFH76GQP

  4. #49
    Extraordinary Member thwhtGuardian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by godisawesome View Post
    Dooku is unorthodox, but its a completely different type of unorthodox compared to Qui-Gon.

    Dooku wants to be a Cowboy Cop Jedi, sure, especially with his focus on using a dueling style suited more for melee and his tendency to bend or break the rules - but its because he wants to be a Jedi without accountability, rather than a servant of the Force or the people. He wants to fight the symptoms of dangerously corrupt senators, not the cause of inequality; he wants to smite the wicked, not help the helpless. He hates his enemies, he doesn't love his neighbors.

    And that's very much a compassionless, detached, inward-looking perspective that contrasts hugely with Qui-Gon's warm compassion, empathy, and willingness to connect on a deeper level with people. Qui-Gon learned the rules are flexible, but his instincts and observations are the opposite of his master's; he sees pain and hurt among victims, and determines how to de-escalate a scenario through understanding and love, while Dooku sees cancer to be cut out.

    And then, years later, Dooku is simply shuffling who he targets and what his "victory conditions" are, because while he tells himself he cares about stopping corruption... he really doesn't, because that would require caring about others, as seen when he starts complaining about being an accessory to Qui-Gon's death more like a business decision he didn't like than as a bereaved father or teacher.
    He expressly stated that he served the people, and his whole motivation for wanting to go against the Replublic and the Jedi order was because he wanted a new order that looked out for the little guys.
    He teams up with Darth Sidious in an ends justify the means kind of a relationship, and it seems to me that the reason Sidious pits Anakin against him is because he knows that as soon as the Republic was gone Dooku would turn on him.
    Last edited by thwhtGuardian; 12-04-2022 at 03:32 PM.
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  5. #50
    Ultimate Member ChrisIII's Avatar
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    In the ROTS novel he seems to believe that Palpatine will re-create the old Sith (With hundreds of Sith instead of just two) now that they're close to victory. But nope....
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