Is It Possible Peter Doesn't Love MJ As Deeply As He Loved Gwen?

[Minerboh]

I recently had the chance to read Son Of M translated in greek.
In the first issue we see Spider-Man dealing with the impact the House Of M left him and one internal monologue got my attention.
While going out, just before he saved that Mutant from those bullies, Spidey said that in that new reality Wanda made, he was ACTUALLY HAPPY, married with the woman he ALWAYS loved and having a family with her. And that her was not Mary Jane. It was Gwen!
What is that suppose to mean? Is it possible that Peter doesn't really love MJ as deeply as he did with Gwen?
I mean, yes, I can relate wth the ''nothing can top the first crush'' but I always thought that he wanted to have a family with MJ and cared for her.
Could this be some kind of foreshadowing for what happened with OMD?

[spiderlink]

Imo it was more of a shock value twist to settle the tone of the story, if you follow the relationship of peter and mj until that point of house of m, they had their moments of happiness. But as always it depend of the author

[Lukmendes]

It's not exactly consistent, but during the marriage era he generally talked like he moved on from Gwen and he loved MJ more on the few times the comparison is even made, but stuff like House of M can make it look like it's not the case.

So yeah, pretty sure the number of times that indicates that he loved MJ more is higher than otherwise.

Could this be some kind of foreshadowing for what happened with OMD?

Not really, Strange specifically says he can't erase Spidey's memories at the end of House of M, which completely contradicts all of the times he did erase memories, and OMIT also has him erasing memories worldwide.

If that's foreshadowing it's bad foreshadowing.

[HypnoHustler]

It’s a comic. It depends on the writer.

[Kevinroc]

Are you also gonna say that Peter secretly wishes he was the Green Goblin? Because House of M said that too.

[Lunala]

There's a bittersweet edge to their tragedy which sharpens with grief and when he's feeling low but "proportional, yet isn't willing to break a committed relationship with MJ if Gwen were to return because they're equally loved and he won't willingly hurt who he's dating in that way" is my preferred take.

I prefer Mary Jane to Gwen because she's had better character writing but I despise stories where an author turns love into a competition between romantic partners or suggests a man isn't capable of loving two persons in equal amounts but for different reasons so I reject anything that says otherwise lol.

[Lukmendes]

Are you also gonna say that Peter secretly wishes he was the Green Goblin? Because House of M said that too.

Maybe the marriage with Gwen was bad enough he wished he could throw her off a bridge, which's why he secretly wished for that .

There's a bittersweet edge to their tragedy which sharpens with grief and when he's feeling low but "proportional, yet isn't willing to break a committed relationship with MJ if Gwen were to return because they're equally loved and he won't willingly hurt who he's dating in that way" is my preferred take.

I prefer Mary Jane to Gwen because she's had better character writing but I despise stories where an author turns love into a competition between romantic partners or suggests a man isn't capable of loving two persons in equal amounts but for different reasons so I reject anything that says otherwise lol.

I mean, society overall prefers monogamous relationships, so not having "competition" would be weird even if we don't consider how people don't like sharing someone in general, so uh, either a character chooses one or ends up with nobody for the most part lol.

[Frontier]

I mean, Peter cared about Gwen, no doubt, but it makes no sense to me that he'd still feel so much for her given how much deeper and longer he's been with MJ by comparison.

He's been more intimate with Felicia than he ever was with Gwen.

[Lunala]

lol.

Peter also traded his marriage for Aunt May./j I'm reminded of the joke you made some time ago about Freud perhaps being more right than he knew.


Monogamy has only existed for 1000 years or so and even then it's not universal. Western culture values it over anything else and Spider-Man comics are written by Western authors. About one-third (32%) of US adults say that their ideal relationship is non-monogamous to some degree so it's not impossible to suggest that Peter might be amoung that 32%. He did kiss Jean while they were dating. Kinda polyamorous, that Parker. Thankfully Peter matured somewhat from the bratty manchild he was. /j ^^ Peter has usually been connected to someone else when approached by a Gwen-clone yet he never picked MJ over Gwen while they were dating. He was attracted to *grimace* Sarah so... it's not exactly cut and dry example of choice when the girlfriend literally died imo. Grief inspires unique emotional responses and so does love. My understanding of the sentiment is that sometimes, people will literally remain in love with someone their entire lives yet they can find something similar yet equal(love won't be the same in every relationship because every person is different) in other people, can share if all partners are equally mature and accepting, etc. I find competition over love annoying and overplayed. That's not likely to change anytime soon.

intimate with Felicia

I love Felicia more than Gwen too but, as a romantic asexual, I feel obligated to point out that physical intimacy doesn't always indicate the strength of someone's feelings either.

[TinkerSpider]

This feels like pitting two female characters against each other and reducing them to objects to hang on Peter’s arm.

Love isn’t a competition. Love isn’t finite. Love isn’t a pie and if you eat a slice, there’s less for the next person. If we are lucky, we will love many people in many different ways over many years.

Loving person A doesn’t mean you have less love to give person B, and vice versa. Peter loved Gwen and he loves MJ. He had/has different relationships with each because each is a different person in their own right.

Also, House of M and its related titles are just….bad.

[Krakoa]

House of M was a lot of giving characters what they think they want more than what deep down they truly want.

[Lunala]

This feels like pitting two female characters against each other and reducing them to objects to hang on Peter’s arm.

Love isn’t a competition. Love isn’t finite. Love isn’t a pie and if you eat a slice, there’s less for the next person. If we are lucky, we will love many people in many different ways over many years.

Loving person A doesn’t mean you have less love to give person B, and vice versa. Peter loved Gwen and he loves MJ. He had/has different relationships with each because each is a different person in their own right.

Also, House of M and its related titles are just….bad.

There have been many times where I've wished I could 'like' a post on CBR. This is one of those times.

[Minerboh]

Are you also gonna say that Peter secretly wishes he was the Green Goblin? Because House of M said that too.

What he said regarding MJ was in Son Of M though.

And there's the fact Wanda gave Peter a family with Gwen, not MJ.

[WebLurker]

Got the idea somewhere that the House of M series was written by a Gwen fan. Even so, wasn't it a plot point that Spidey's marriage to Gwen wasn't going well and he was contemplating having an affair with MJ? Also remember seeing scans of a follow up when the reality was fixed and Spidey was depicted as being utterly upset that he wasn't with his wife in the ostensible world where what he wanted, indicating that was what he really wanted.

Course, I remember seeing an "hey, remember this?" article online pointing out that a random Fantastic Four cartoon stated beyond a shadow of a doubt that Sue Storm truly wanted to be with Namor, not Reed Richards and you can guess how many writers have stuck with that "fact." I think the moral of the story is to remember that different writers have different ideas and to not let certain ones ruin things for you.

[Lukmendes]

I mean, Peter cared about Gwen, no doubt, but it makes no sense to me that he'd still feel so much for her given how much deeper and longer he's been with MJ by comparison.

He's been more intimate with Felicia than he ever was with Gwen.

Yeah, if you actually go back to those stories, Gwen was a big deal but the relationship itself was pretty unhealthy, and since it was so poorly developed, it can give the idea they didn't know each other that well despite datingfor over 50 issues.

It can also look funny if you compare how Spidey reacted to Gwen's death and MJ's "death" in Byrne's run, it didn't take that long for Spidey to move on once he was done grieving, while with MJ he basically never stopped grieving and only really went on dates for the most part 'cause other characters annoyed him into doing so, that really makes it look like he loved Gwen more, although, in Gwen's defense, back then stories kinda advanced in real time (Or at least, advanced faster than they do now), so he would've kinda grieved for longer offscreen.

Peter also traded his marriage for Aunt May./j I'm reminded of the joke you made some time ago about Freud perhaps being more right than he knew.

Lol, didn't even remember making a joke about Freud here.

Monogamy has only existed for 1000 years or so and even then it's not universal. Western culture values it over anything else and Spider-Man comics are written by Western authors.

"Only" 1000 years old still makes it be the current modern standard.

I mean ****, cocaine wasn't even illegal 200 years ago, and I think heroin was advertised as non-additive medicine, just because stuff was different back then doesn't mean much when current standards are so different.

So yeah, monogamy is still the standard in US of A, and Spidey being kind of an everyman means he won't stop being monogamous, and at this point it would be bizarre if he did, considering he never showed interest in stopping being monogamous.

Even if he's willing to change that, doesn't mean his love interests will, and I don't see MJ, Gwen, Felicia or whatever wanting to share him.

About one-third (32%) of US adults say that their ideal relationship is non-monogamous to some degree

I wonder how many of those actually realize what polyamory actually means, 'cause a man getting to crush more puss sounds fun, but the same man realizing the women can also get to ride other dicks? Probably not as fun

Vice versa too of course.

so it's not impossible to suggest that Peter might be amoung that 32%.

For the most part he only really wanted to be with one woman, I can't recall him even even jokingly wondering of ending up with more than one woman, Spidey has been long established as only really caring about being with one woman, getting married, and once in a while kids are wondered too.

So yeah, it's safe to say he's not part of this 32%, and he would need some Krakoan-like mischaracterization to change that.

He did kiss Jean while they were dating. Kinda polyamorous, that Parker. Thankfully Peter matured somewhat from the bratty manchild he was. /j ^^

In Ditko's run, he once considered going on a date with Liz despite dating Betty at the time lol:



(ASM#15)

The way he words it makes it look like he wanted to do so out of spite than anything else though, but hey, worth commenting on it anyways lol.

Peter has usually been connected to someone else when approached by a Gwen-clone yet he never picked MJ over Gwen while they were dating. He was attracted to *grimace* Sarah so... it's not exactly cut and dry example of choice when the girlfriend literally died imo. Grief inspires weird emotional responses and so does love.

In general in those cases, Spidey felt a minor attraction but didn't go much beyond that, to the point the whole Sarah nonsense had her be the one who kissed him and not the other way around.

My understanding of the sentiment is that sometimes, people will literally remain in love with someone their entire lives yet they can find something similar in other people, can share if all partners are equally mature and accepting, etc.

It's not even just about just about maturity, a lot of people just don't like sharing someone else in romantic situations because they don't like sharing someone else in romantic situations, and just "I don't like it" reasoning is very valid.

Polyamory needs the first damn step to have everyone involved to actually be okay with it at its very minimum, not being coerced into being "okay" with it, and with the way Spidey is like, he wouldn't be okay with it, and I don't see MJ, Gwen and Felicia being okay with it either, just one person not wanting it already ends all chances of it happening, or at least, happening in a healthy way, but everyone involved not being interested? Yeah...

I find competition over love annoying and overplayed. That's not likely to change anytime soon.

Well, I find romance to be overall a garbage genre, so I can't blame ya on that, though it has far more problems than just this.

There have been many times where I've wished I could 'like' a post on CBR. This is one of those times.

That won't be happening as long as this website remains as a 90's relic.

Like ****, you don't even get a notification if someone quotes you, and I've seen at least one website that is a 90's relics have that feature lol.

Course, I remember seeing an "hey, remember this?" article online pointing out that a random Fantastic Four cartoon stated beyond a shadow of a doubt that Sue Storm truly wanted to be with Namor, not Reed Richards and you can guess how many writers have stuck with that "fact." I think the moral of the story is to remember that different writers have different ideas and to not let certain ones ruin things for you.

Huh, wonder what cartoon did that.