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  1. #16
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kurolegacy View Post
    If I were a betting man I’d say that the wedding will never happen and Wells is gonna break them up.
    Might be an excuse to make Janice go full villain again.

  2. #17
    Unstoppable Member KC's Avatar
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    Didn't like this issue and I am not a fan of Wells' run so far. This issue felt clearly padded out for the Trade, it was a part of a complete story rather than a complete story that feeds into a bigger narrative.

    JRJR has toned down his art from how it was in the 2000s to more of a mix between his 2000s art and 80s art. It works but I prefer his style in his ASM run with Stern.

  3. #18
    Wig Over The Hoodie Style IamnotJudasTraveller's Avatar
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    I think most everybody here knows with how insular cape comics have gotten, with a small audience that refuses to budge in many areas (not just this particular hobby), that being a content creator decrying the constant "nullification" (for want of a better term) for super heroes with monthly titles literally became a good paying gig provided your videos go viral enough. I always thought that more often than not these relied on hyperbole and blowing things out of proportion.

    But reading this issue I was like "this does feel like what these guys constantly gripe about". Spider-Man seemed legit... well, to be blunt, pathetic this issue. And for how much effort the run is spending in building Tombstone it seems even he got the short end of the stick - he's still a villain and I wasn't expecting otherwise, but if all that it takes for him to go back on letting his girl marry who she wants to is for his criminal dealings go south a little bit, then you pretty much don't feel like you want to have the more empathetic approach the run was having (as far as a cutthroat mobster can even manage, anyway).
    Discovering/CONFESSING! the nature of evil... one retcon at a time.

  4. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by IamnotJudasTraveller View Post
    I think most everybody here knows with how insular cape comics have gotten, with a small audience that refuses to budge in many areas (not just this particular hobby), that being a content creator decrying the constant "nullification" (for want of a better term) for super heroes with monthly titles literally became a good paying gig provided your videos go viral enough. I always thought that more often than not these relied on hyperbole and blowing things out of proportion.

    But reading this issue I was like "this does feel like what these guys constantly gripe about". Spider-Man seemed legit... well, to be blunt, pathetic this issue. And for how much effort the run is spending in building Tombstone it seems even he got the short end of the stick - he's still a villain and I wasn't expecting otherwise, but if all that it takes for him to go back on letting his girl marry who she wants to is for his criminal dealings go south a little bit, then you pretty much don't feel like you want to have the more empathetic approach the run was having (as far as a cutthroat mobster can even manage, anyway).
    Yeah, it's really weird how he spends all that time on making Tombstone quasi-sympathetic and does the whole "no one is all bad or good" to suddenly whip around and have Tombstone be irrationally vicious and murderous. What a weird, boring waste this issue was.

    I'm usually pretty forgiving and I felt like Spider-Man fans were sometimes impossible to please. Since coming back to the series, I'm astounded at just how bad it actually is and how much contempt for the audience the writers and editors seem to have sometimes.

    It sucks. The world is a very frightening place right now and I would really like to revisit one of my favorite characters and experience stories with some joy and triumph. This is just more misery and it's not even interesting misery.

  5. #20
    Welcome Back Spidey Kurolegacy's Avatar
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    What really adds insult to injury is that this is the week of Spider-Man’s 60th birthday and the issue he’s in, he’s in a completely pathetic state ending not with anything triumphant but with him on the ground begging Tombstone, saying he’s learned his lesson after Tombstone proves what an irrational monster he is, thus proving Peter’s point that he is a bad guy.
    Last edited by Kurolegacy; 06-08-2022 at 11:11 AM.

  6. #21
    Spectacular Member duke togo's Avatar
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    Outside of the art and Tombstone's origin, I thought this was pretty bad. Felt like a rushed issue and was written in the span of 1 hour. Almost felt like a Bendis comic, but worse. Dunno, but only enjoying it for the art at this point.

  7. #22
    Astonishing Member David Walton's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kurolegacy View Post
    What really adds insult to injury is that this is the week of Spider-Man’s 60th birthday and the issue he’s in, he’s in a completely pathetic state ending not with anything triumphant but with him on the ground begging Tombstone, saying he’s learned his lesson after Tombstone proves what an irrational monster he is, thus proving Peter’s point that he is a bad guy.
    In context, he was only saying he'd learned his lesson to keep Tombstone from murdering innocent civilians. So it's more that Peter Parker is willing to swallow his pride to save lives if there's even a chance that would work.

  8. #23
    Astonishing Member David Walton's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Refrax5 View Post
    Yeah, it's really weird how he spends all that time on making Tombstone quasi-sympathetic and does the whole "no one is all bad or good" to suddenly whip around and have Tombstone be irrationally vicious and murderous. What a weird, boring waste this issue was.
    Tombstone was explaining his clearly warped, villainous philosophy. I don't think it's surprising that the guy who thinks might makes right is vicious.

    Peter got picked on as a kid, too, and he never became a mass murderer.

    I think what Wells is doing here is setting up a contrast with Tombstone not accepting responsibility for his actions as opposed to Peter making responsibility his life's work.

  9. #24
    Astonishing Member David Walton's Avatar
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    I'm not really enthused about the Paul/MJ stuff, but there's not a lot to go on yet. Still, it's just bizarre for MJ to be so down on Peter for doing what probably amounts to the same kinds of things he always does.

  10. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by David Walton View Post
    I'm not really enthused about the Paul/MJ stuff, but there's not a lot to go on yet. Still, it's just bizarre for MJ to be so down on Peter for doing what probably amounts to the same kinds of things he always does.
    Yeah, like MJ knows Peter since forever it’s kinda weird that she don’t even let Peter explain what happened/why he do it

  11. #26
    Mighty Member Malachi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by David Walton View Post
    I'm not really enthused about the Paul/MJ stuff, but there's not a lot to go on yet. Still, it's just bizarre for MJ to be so down on Peter for doing what probably amounts to the same kinds of things he always does.
    One problem is that it’s very hard for readers who have read Spider-man for years to imagine what this horrible thing Peter has done is. Not that there doesn’t exist horrible things one can do. No the problem is what can Peter do that betrays MJ, the heroes, May and not completely break him. MJ has been with him through some bad stuff. So for Wells to build it up like this and stick the landing, well that will be close to impossible. No barring on his talent but just the nigh impossible task he has set himself up for.

  12. #27
    Welcome Back Spidey Kurolegacy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by David Walton View Post
    In context, he was only saying he'd learned his lesson to keep Tombstone from murdering innocent civilians. So it's more that Peter Parker is willing to swallow his pride to save lives if there's even a chance that would work.
    Even so, it’s a senseless swallowing of pride because he knows Tombstone isn’t gonna stop especially since this rampage isn’t about his “lesson” but rather gang warfare. So it just becomes a pathetic scene especially combined with him somehow being unable to escape chains and having spent the issue getting beaten up by someone not even in his weight class.

  13. #28
    Astonishing Member David Walton's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Malachi View Post
    One problem is that it’s very hard for readers who have read Spider-man for years to imagine what this horrible thing Peter has done is. Not that there doesn’t exist horrible things one can do. No the problem is what can Peter do that betrays MJ, the heroes, May and not completely break him. MJ has been with him through some bad stuff. So for Wells to build it up like this and stick the landing, well that will be close to impossible. No barring on his talent but just the nigh impossible task he has set himself up for.
    Then you run into the problem that Peter is obviously not going to do something truly terrible.

    At any rate, I think the mystery box is more a sleight of hand trick to put distance between Peter and MJ being in a good place at the end of Spencer's run and where they are now. So the reason might end up being something of an afterthought when it finally arrives.

  14. #29
    Mighty Member Malachi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by David Walton View Post
    Then you run into the problem that Peter is obviously not going to do something truly terrible.

    At any rate, I think the mystery box is more a sleight of hand trick to put distance between Peter and MJ being in a good place at the end of Spencer's run and where they are now. So the reason might end up being something of an afterthought when it finally arrives.
    Yeah it wouldn’t be the first time that Marvel has employed the tactic of:
    A) sudden change
    B) story that will tell why
    C) draw it out
    D) hope that the ambiguity and time passed will mean that when the answer rolls around people just don’t care as much anymore.

  15. #30
    Astonishing Member David Walton's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kurolegacy View Post
    Even so, it’s a senseless swallowing of pride because he knows Tombstone isn’t gonna stop especially since this rampage isn’t about his “lesson” but rather gang warfare. So it just becomes a pathetic scene especially combined with him somehow being unable to escape chains and having spent the issue getting beaten up by someone not even in his weight class.
    I'm not sure about the chains, but Spider-Man getting beaten in close quarters made sense.

    I don't see the problem with Peter begging for civilians' lives even if he knows it's a long shot. I mean, John McClane begs Hans Grueber not to kill people too.

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