Does New Teen Titans by Woflman/Perez hold up?

[Falcon16]

Cyborg's dialect is one thing that modern readers will have a hard time accepting. That just seems like instant cancel culture bait.

But overall, it's a great series, and it's better than the 2003 cartoon (I mean, just look at Cyborg there...)

[Jim Kelly]

The way Vic originally talked in the comic didn't make sense to a lot of us at the time. They tried to explain it as Vic trying to sound street--but it was pretty clumsy. That's not something that was okay at the time and then later people realized it was stupid because society had advanced. We knew it was stupid at the time. A lot of things like that in comic books were obvious to anyone with a brain. People seem to miss this--they think we were idiots back then and couldn't see the flaws in the comics we were reading.

I didn't read much Marvel in the 1970s--mostly just comics that weren't part of the main continuity. I didn't get around to reading TOMB OF DRACULA until around 2000, when I picked up all the ESSENTIALs. I had to read through some stories before I could get into the style of the thing. Because it was written in Stan Lee. There were various writers at the start of the run, before Marv Wolfman took over, and they were all writing in Stan Lee style (Gardner Fox, not as much). It's really an acquired taste. But once I got an ear for it, I didn't mind it. Since Marv was coming back to the Titans after his stint on DRACULA, maybe his voice had a lingering Stan Lee resonance.

But to say something doesn't hold up now--who is anyone to say that? Writing goes through changes all the time. And what some people like to read now will not be what others like to read ten years from now.

[Adset]

I got a DC Universe (or whatever it’s called) subscription when the pandemic hit and read *every* Teen Titans issue on it, from the original series up through (at the time) the 2016 Rebirth series.

The Wolfman/Perez series was a delight and I couldn’t recommend it more. I was born in 85 so obviously didn’t read it when it was being released in floppies, but I didn’t struggle at all diving into it. Sure some things are dated, but I thought it was overall fantastic. While it noticeably dipped a bit after Perez left, I’d recommend reading through Titans Hunt. It gets pretty… pretty… bad after that. The Jurgens relaunch was fun, though!

[king81992]

The way Vic originally talked in the comic didn't make sense to a lot of us at the time. They tried to explain it as Vic trying to sound street--but it was pretty clumsy. That's not something that was okay at the time and then later people realized it was stupid because society had advanced. We knew it was stupid at the time. A lot of things like that in comic books were obvious to anyone with a brain. People seem to miss this--they think we were idiots back then and couldn't see the flaws in the comics we were reading.

I didn't read much Marvel in the 1970s--mostly just comics that weren't part of the main continuity. I didn't get around to reading TOMB OF DRACULA until around 2000, when I picked up all the ESSENTIALs. I had to read through some stories before I could get into the style of the thing. Because it was written in Stan Lee. There were various writers at the start of the run, before Marv Wolfman took over, and they were all writing in Stan Lee style (Gardner Fox, not as much). It's really an acquired taste. But once I got an ear for it, I didn't mind it. Since Marv was coming back to the Titans after his stint on DRACULA, maybe his voice had a lingering Stan Lee resonance.

But to say something doesn't hold up now--who is anyone to say that? Writing goes through changes all the time. And what some people like to read now will not be what others like to read ten years from now.

Cyborg's accent isn't a valid reason for people to say Wildman and Perez's NTT doesn't hold up.

[married guy]

Storywise?
Absolutely.

Some dialogue is obviously dated, but it's still a rock solid run of comic books.

[Menacer]

Read volume 5. Didn't strike much of a cord with me. Don't remember anything other then that it was a bit of a slog to get through. But if you like older books you will probably enjoy it.

Personally so far my favourite Teen Titans is Geoff John's Book One and Book Two. Definitely wanna start Book Three and Four.

[Agent Z]

The way Vic originally talked in the comic didn't make sense to a lot of us at the time. They tried to explain it as Vic trying to sound street--but it was pretty clumsy. That's not something that was okay at the time and then later people realized it was stupid because society had advanced. We knew it was stupid at the time. A lot of things like that in comic books were obvious to anyone with a brain. People seem to miss this--they think we were idiots back then and couldn't see the flaws in the comics we were reading.

I didn't read much Marvel in the 1970s--mostly just comics that weren't part of the main continuity. I didn't get around to reading TOMB OF DRACULA until around 2000, when I picked up all the ESSENTIALs. I had to read through some stories before I could get into the style of the thing. Because it was written in Stan Lee. There were various writers at the start of the run, before Marv Wolfman took over, and they were all writing in Stan Lee style (Gardner Fox, not as much). It's really an acquired taste. But once I got an ear for it, I didn't mind it. Since Marv was coming back to the Titans after his stint on DRACULA, maybe his voice had a lingering Stan Lee resonance.

But to say something doesn't hold up now--who is anyone to say that? Writing goes through changes all the time. And what some people like to read now will not be what others like to read ten years from now.

You basically just described what it means to say if something "holds up".

Cyborg's accent isn't a valid reason for people to say Wildman and Perez's NTT doesn't hold up.

Yeah there's other elements they can point to for that argument.

[Holt]

Some elements have aged very poorly (Beast Boy in particular) but yes it’s still quite good. It begins losing steam after Judas Contract tho, imo.

[Rac7d*]

Cyborg's accent isn't a valid reason for people to say Wildman and Perez's NTT doesn't hold up.

I didn’t enjoy learning about his background running with gangs it’s was super cliche.

[Rac7d*]

Some elements have aged very poorly (Beast Boy in particular) but yes it’s still quite good. It begins losing steam after Judas Contract tho, imo.

It wasn’t just beast boy, the way terra spoke to the team, to starfire. The movie handled her better, I wished they were fused.

[thefinalguy]

Cyborg's accent isn't a valid reason for people to say Wildman and Perez's NTT doesn't hold up.

If it comes across as unauthentically then yes you can argue it does.

Raven was casually wearing a sari every other issue early on when they could've just made her Indian or gone for an entirely different look.

It happens especially in older comics some things that just don't make sense for today wouldn't exist.

I do think NTT is still great with just smaller nuances that are ultimately products of the era in which it existed.

I don't think Vic was as fleshed out as he could've been, Gar wasn't that funny like I said Raven in a sari, Terra, and that entire issue with Slade acting as if Terra was the bad guy in their relationship.

It's readable, underneath it all I still love it, but in terms of the handling of Vic yeah I do think they could've did better with his dialogue and story. Felt like it was always the same thing with him and that's one of the few areas the cartoon did better in.

I'd say Kory was the only one who walked out worse in the show, Dick was just a little more boring. The characterizations of Gar and Vic were a lot better.

And, ultimately characterization can be distracting from even good stories. It was somewhat of a hard pill to swallow seeing how different the characters were from the ones I grew up watching on TV.

[Holt]

It wasn’t just beast boy, the way terra spoke to the team, to starfire. The movie handled her better, I wished they were fused.

I think the way Terra speaks to Starfire is bad but that's also in line with Wolfman's intention for her to be a villain. Beast Boy is more jarring because him basically being Glenn Quagmire but as a superhero obviously hits way different in 2022 than it did in the 1980s. And we're meant to actually like him and think his antics are amusing, whereas with Terra you're supposed to think she's an annoying brat from the beginning.

[John Venus]

I'd say Kory was the only one who walked out worse in the show, Dick was just a little more boring. The characterizations of Gar and Vic were a lot better.

And, ultimately characterization can be distracting from even good stories. It was somewhat of a hard pill to swallow seeing how different the characters were from the ones I grew up watching on TV.

Interesting. Usually I hear the opposite from the fans of the show. That Starfire was so naive and innocent on the show that they didn't like how sexualized she was in the comics. Why do you think Starfire was worse off on the show?
I got into the comics not so long after watching the show and I thought the different versions of Starfire was ultimately her at different points in life. A lot of older NTT I met didn't like the show but I could see the traits from the Wolfman/Perez comics that inspired the versions on TT.

[John Venus]

I think the tv show also had better characterizations for Aqualad/Garth, Speedy (he was almost as bad as Beast Boy sometimes) and Kid Flash. Making Terra a more sympathetic character was also a good choice. She is ultimately a child and your brain is not fully developed until you're at least 26. Bumblebee and Herald were also more memorable characters on the show than in the comics.

That said, the tv show did miss the South Asian influence on Raven's character and Jinx was Indian in the comics.

[Rac7d*]

If it comes across as unauthentically then yes you can argue it does.

Raven was casually wearing a sari every other issue early on when they could've just made her Indian or gone for an entirely different look.

It happens especially in older comics some things that just don't make sense for today wouldn't exist.

I do think NTT is still great with just smaller nuances that are ultimately products of the era in which it existed.

I don't think Vic was as fleshed out as he could've been, Gar wasn't that funny like I said Raven in a sari, Terra, and that entire issue with Slade acting as if Terra was the bad guy in their relationship.

It's readable, underneath it all I still love it, but in terms of the handling of Vic yeah I do think they could've did better with his dialogue and story. Felt like it was always the same thing with him and that's one of the few areas the cartoon did better in.

I'd say Kory was the only one who walked out worse in the show, Dick was just a little more boring. The characterizations of Gar and Vic were a lot better.

And, ultimately characterization can be distracting from even good stories. It was somewhat of a hard pill to swallow seeing how different the characters were from the ones I grew up watching on TV.

What’s wrong with raven in a sari?
She not from earth, but she choose the look becuase it alligned with her feelings and personality. Also considering their original inspiration for her it was really fitting. I think it was the right moove at the time.