Doctor Strange Vs Scarlet Witch

[Cody]

1. Current versions

2. Strongest versions

[big_adventure]

Strongest version of Witchie is a universal / multiversal reality warper who just has to think "no more goatee-wearers" and it's over. Strongest version of Strange is, ISTR, a Galactus+ level cosmic-y dude. Edge to Wanda, I guess.

Couldn't say for current.

[Galerion]

Well current is easy since Strange is dead or at least Stephen is

[Cody]

Strongest version of Witchie is a universal / multiversal reality warper who just has to think "no more goatee-wearers" and it's over. Strongest version of Strange is, ISTR, a Galactus+ level cosmic-y dude. Edge to Wanda, I guess.

Couldn't say for current.

Alright how about how they are usually presented to be in the last decade.

[big_adventure]

Alright how about how they are usually presented to be in the last decade.

Strange doesn't really have a "usual" level over the last decade. He's always being either de-powered or amped. "Classic Strange" is generally 70's and 80's on into the 90's - Sorcerer Supreme with feats of busting a planet while astrally projected just to use it as propulsion and making Dormammu work pretty hard to get wins. "Fern Buster Strange" comes well after that, in the 2000s, where he's suddenly written much weaker, mostly to be able to include him in teams he'd otherwise be doing everything for. This guy got punked by Ghost and had to use a forbidden blah blah blah just to lose to the jobber-master WW Hulk. Over the last decade he's been between "normal guy with some magical toys" and "moderately high-end cosmic who kicked Galactus' ass" with everything in between.

[7-Love]

Strange doesn't really have a "usual" level over the last decade. He's always being either de-powered or amped. "Classic Strange" is generally 70's and 80's on into the 90's - Sorcerer Supreme with feats of busting a planet while astrally projected just to use it as propulsion and making Dormammu work pretty hard to get wins. "Fern Buster Strange" comes well after that, in the 2000s, where he's suddenly written much weaker, mostly to be able to include him in teams he'd otherwise be doing everything for. This guy got punked by Ghost and had to use a forbidden blah blah blah just to lose to the jobber-master WW Hulk. Over the last decade he's been between "normal guy with some magical toys" and "moderately high-end cosmic who kicked Galactus' ass" with everything in between.

How strong are God of Magic Doctor Strange and Black Priest Doctor Strange in comparison to Classic Doctor Strange?

[Sharpandpointies]

Current Strange is Clea Strange, who is roughly on par with Classic Strange. No idea how that pans out against current Wanda.

The Strange before Clea (assuming we're not talking about the shadow of the past Strange from 'Death of Doctor Strange') was at least approaching his Classic levels of power, so we have that to consider if we're insisting that this be Stephen Strange.

Most powerful Strange I know of is Black Magic/Shuma-Gorath-Consuming Strange. Now, Wanda may be universal, may not be, depends on which interpretation one looks at of her No More Mutants feat. She might be powerful enough to take out this version of Strange, who is rather above Galactus, frankly.

Regardless, even during that period she was still a mortal in a mortal body. As such, she dies instantly as enough energy to literally annihilate galaxies - in the multiples, with all that implies (including the distance between said galaxies) - floods the arena at the bell.

[Sharpandpointies]

Well current is easy since Strange is dead or at least Stephen is

Seeing as Clea has officially taken his name, I'm cool with considering her 'Current'.

[big_adventure]

Current Strange is Clea Strange, who is roughly on par with Classic Strange. No idea how that pans out against current Wanda.

The Strange before Clea was at least approaching his Classic levels of power, so we have that to consider if we're insisting that this be Stephen Strange.

Most powerful Strange I know of is Black Magic/Shuma-Gorath-Consuming Strange. Now, Wanda may be universal, may not be, depends on which interpretation one looks at of her No More Mutants feat. She might be powerful enough to take out this version of Strange, who is rather above Galactus, frankly.

Regardless, even during that period she was still a mortal in a mortal body. As such, she dies instantly as enough energy to literally annihilate galaxies - in the multiples, with all that implies (including the distance between said galaxies) - floods the arena at the bell.

For me, it's a quick draw for the two high-end ones, I just think that slightly favors Wanda (and this is really just a feeling - though she did have a feat or two of ignoring otherwise fatal damage during her House of M days, IIRC). If it comes down to Strange trying something specific to Wanda just thinking "depowered" I'd favor that - again, slightly.

[Sharpandpointies]

For me, it's a quick draw for the two high-end ones, I just think that slightly favors Wanda (and this is really just a feeling - though she did have a feat or two of ignoring otherwise fatal damage during her House of M days, IIRC). If it comes down to Strange trying something specific to Wanda just thinking "depowered" I'd favor that - again, slightly.

I feel I need to clarify.

This is something that just 'happens'. At the bell, boom, the entire arena is flooded with energies capable of disintegrating galaxies. It's a 'side-effect'. It's not something Strange needs to will into happening, cast, or whatever. It happens because he shows up, and that's it for Wanda.

IF Wanda had enough time to do anything, and IF she were actually universal (as I understand, that's a matter for debate), she might be able to deal with him.

She doesn't have the former - bell rings, she's gone.

[Sharpandpointies]

Seeing as Clea has officially taken his name, I'm cool with considering her 'Current'.

Will also clarify this:

Clea has officially taken his name, his sanctum, his magical doo-dads, his position as the Earth Dimension's Sorcerer Supreme (which means she's now the Sorcerer Supreme of TWO dimensions), his best friend (although, honestly, Clea and Wong got along great back in the old days anyway), and has told Doctor Doom 'I'm the Sorcerer Supreme, Victor, leave before I get irritated'.

And he did.

SO I'm pretty cool with considering her Current Strange. ^_^

[Sharpandpointies]

So, a little more on the subject of Black-Magic/Shuma-Gorath Consuming Strange.

Kaluu is a dude who was a solid match for Classic Strange back in his heyday. Easily on his level of power, peer of the Ancient One, etc. Let's keep in mind that Strange is perfectly capable of protecting himself from a supernova with shields cast by his astral form (ie weaker than normal), perfectly capable of fighting a very losing battle against Dormammu (sure, losing, but not dying instantly and making a fight of it), capable of withstanding attacks from some cosmic beings without instantly caving, etc.

And again, Kaluu is his equal.

Kaluu finds Stephen in the distant dimension where he fought Shuma-Gorath - Stephen currently being mentally a mess due to what he has done - and decides to take them home. He opens up a gateway to begin the process of moving through the dimensions, and Stephen immediately erupts with energies. Kaluu realizes that it's only because they're in this dimension far, far from the Earth dimension that all of this energy can be kept within Stephen, and notes that Strange just showing up in the Earth Dimension will basically make galaxies - plural - wither and die. So he starts slowly moving them through the dimensions, allowing Stephen the opportunity to bleed off some of his power and get things under control.

AFTER they've moved through multiple dimensions and Strange has bled off some of the power, Kaluu - his shields visibly up - does all of grab Strange by his shirt front and immediately starts dying. Just touching Stephen - who isn't visibly giving off any of his energies here - is killing him through his Classic-Strange level shields.

He gets a reaction out of Strange, and lets him go. He then thinks "If he touches me once more with the power that's in him, I will die like a leaf in a bonfire."

Kaluu. Peer of Classic Strange. If this version of Strange just touches him, all his defenses up and ready, he flat-out dies. After Stephen has supposedly bled off some of his power.

[Sophicles]

Killing Wanda at her most powerful wouldn't 10-count her though.

Even if the arena was flooded with galaxy-disintegrating energies right off the bat, she's shown she could just resurrect herself, like when Hawkeye killed her. She was literally back up in like 1 panel later and instantly disintegrated him for scaring her children.
For a reality warper on her scale, death was pretty much meaningless at that point for her.

[Sharpandpointies]

Killing Wanda at her most powerful wouldn't 10-count her though.

Even if the arena was flooded with galaxy-disintegrating energies right off the bat, she's shown she could just resurrect herself, like when Hawkeye killed her. She was literally back up in like 1 panel later and instantly disintegrated him for scaring her children.
For a reality warper on her scale, death was pretty much meaningless at that point for her.

If she is actually universal level and can come back after getting BBQ by a cosmic being more powerful than Galactus, then Strange may have a problem.

Of course, she needs to come back in the middle of this constant eruption of multi-galaxy destroying power, (edit: plus whatever Strange actually DOES with, you know, actual intent rather than just as a side-effect of him being around) which could actually lead to a 10-count.

Do you have an issue and number for her coming back from the dead? I'm curious, now.

[Cody]

Was looking forward to your input in this Sharp .

Current Strange is Clea Strange, who is roughly on par with Classic Strange. No idea how that pans out against current Wanda.

The Strange before Clea (assuming we're not talking about the shadow of the past Strange from 'Death of Doctor Strange') was at least approaching his Classic levels of power, so we have that to consider if we're insisting that this be Stephen Strange.

I had Stephen in mind when making this thread. I didn't know Clea was a doctor, so I didn't clarify better, sorry.

Now, Wanda may be universal, may not be, depends on which interpretation one looks at of her No More Mutants feat.

What differing interpretations are there of the feat?