What's something about the X-men you feel most people don't know?

[bat39]

When it comes to either something in-universe (concerning characters, stories etc.) or real-world stuff involving creators...what are some things about the X-men that you feel more casual fans, general audiences, or even some hardcore fans might not really be aware of.

I think a big part of early X-men history which most people would be surprised to hear about is that the X-men basically started out as a covert division of the FBI! Xavier collaborated with an FBI Agent named Fred Duncan and he was the one who gave the team many of their mission to take down ''evil mutants''. Fred Duncan showed up on and off during the original 60's X-men run, at one point even disbanding the team after Xavier was presumed dead. The much-later mini-series Children of the Atom elaborates on Duncan's key role in helping Xavier set up the school and find the mutants who would become the original X-men.

To its credit, X-men First Class does pay homage to this largely forgotten aspect of X-men lore. The 'Man in Black' character is basically a stand-in for Agent Duncan, and the X-men start out as a division of the CIA rather than the FBI. And people say that the Fox movies were not ''faithful to the comics''

Its kinda surprising this hasn't come up very often since it does have some interesting implications in-universe (and out) about the X-men's mission and Xavier's dream. I mean, if you want to apply the civil right metaphor literally to the X-men (which I usually don't, but it is undoubtedly a popular reading of the franchise) this would be the equivalent of a black activist group in the 60's working as covert assets of the FBI to help them capture black militants. How you feel about it depends on your politics, but its definitely something that has political implications when seen through that prism.

[Reiko]

Most people think Hellion is cool, when in fact he isnt.

[Grinning Soul]

When it comes to either something in-universe (concerning characters, stories etc.) or real-world stuff involving creators...what are some things about the X-men that you feel more casual fans, general audiences, or even some hardcore fans might not really be aware of.

I think a big part of early X-men history which most people would be surprised to hear about is that the X-men basically started out as a covert division of the FBI! Xavier collaborated with an FBI Agent named Fred Duncan and he was the one who gave the team many of their mission to take down ''evil mutants''. Fred Duncan showed up on and off during the original 60's X-men run, at one point even disbanding the team after Xavier was presumed dead. The much-later mini-series Children of the Atom elaborates on Duncan's key role in helping Xavier set up the school and find the mutants who would become the original X-men.

To its credit, X-men First Class does pay homage to this largely forgotten aspect of X-men lore. The 'Man in Black' character is basically a stand-in for Agent Duncan, and the X-men start out as a division of the CIA rather than the FBI. And people say that the Fox movies were not ''faithful to the comics''

Its kinda surprising this hasn't come up very often since it does have some interesting implications in-universe (and out) about the X-men's mission and Xavier's dream. I mean, if you want to apply the civil right metaphor literally to the X-men (which I usually don't, but it is undoubtedly a popular reading of the franchise) this would be the equivalent of a black activist group in the 60's working as covert assets of the FBI to help them capture black militants. How you feel about it depends on your politics, but its definitely something that has political implications when seen through that prism.

I wouldn't say the X-Men were a covert division of the FBI. That would imply the FBI had the control over the training, the missions, the methods and the equipment the X-Men used. It was definitely not the case.

Xavier had instead a relationship of collaboration with Fred Ducan, who was a liason between the group and the bureau.

But yes, most people don't know that.

[Frobisher]

The X-Men are actually villains.

[bat39]

I wouldn't say the X-Men were a covert division of the FBI. That would imply the FBI had the control over the training, the missions, the methods and the equipment the X-Men used. It was definitely not the case.

Xavier had instead a relationship of collaboration with Fred Ducan, who was a liason between the group and the bureau.

But yes, most people don't know that.

Yeah, I am over-simplifying when I say they were a ''covert division'' of the FBI. In fact, IIRC the X-men themselves didn't know about Duncan for a while (until Xavier's ''death'' I believe, though I'm not sure).

But I think they were 'assets' of the FBI, or Fred Duncan at any rate, and effectively served as a covert unit of the FBI aimed at tackling mutant criminals and terrorists.

Also, who's to stay that a lot of the X-men training and methodology wasn't influenced by Duncan? Not to mention the equipment...Xavier was rich and could probably get hold of anything but maybe Duncan was the one who told him what to get. Xavier was ex-military, a skilled scientist, and had spent years traveling the globe but all those things by themselves may not have necessarily equipped him to train what was basically a paramilitary unit. Maybe that's where Duncan's expertise came in?

[CoCoBandz]

Most people think Hellion is cool, when in fact he isnt.

Choosing violence I see.

[Grinning Soul]

Yeah, I am over-simplifying when I say they were a ''covert division'' of the FBI. In fact, IIRC the X-men themselves didn't know about Duncan for a while (until Xavier's ''death'' I believe, though I'm not sure).

But I think they were 'assets' of the FBI, or Fred Duncan at any rate, and effectively served as a covert unit of the FBI aimed at tackling mutant criminals and terrorists.

Also, who's to stay that a lot of the X-men training and methodology wasn't influenced by Duncan? Not to mention the equipment...Xavier was rich and could probably get hold of anything but maybe Duncan was the one who told him what to get. Xavier was ex-military, a skilled scientist, and had spent years traveling the globe but all those things by themselves may not have necessarily equipped him to train what was basically a paramilitary unit. Maybe that's where Duncan's expertise came in?

Yeah. I think it's reasonable to assume there was some influence. I'd even say it went both ways.

This is quite normal when groups of scientists or artists collaborate, after all. So it's not unheard of and I wouldn't consider it a stretch, even if it wasn't shown on panel (that I remember).

The important distinction, though, is that the groups which collaborate are still independent. And I was just trying to highlight this in case there is a member of this forum who didn't know of this connection yet.

That's all. :)

Note: Sorry is this message seems short. I'm kinda busy in real life right now.

[Doom'nGloom]

People say X-men is the franchise for minority characters when in reality for a good chunk of its publication history the stories revolve around the same exact set of characters (Chuck, Mags, Wolvie, Cyke etc.) with the other prominent X-men being used in group settings and most minority characters are usually used as background dressing. Even the most prominent minority character in X-men's roster, Storm, took orders from Kitty at one point. I'm not saying the rest of Marvel is better when it comes to treating minority characters and to be fair the current era of X-men is better for minorities but even then I don't remember any meaningful story told with Bishop's status as a war captain. This is why I think the best chance of new minority characters succeeding at Marvel is going solo with a legacy title (Kamala Khan, Miles Morales) and not tying themselves to a franchise where a hundred different characters are struggling for panel time.

[jwatson]

That Xmen was one of the most diverse franchises when claremont took over and how that is minimized when people think about when he left. It's like the start was white, the current stuff is white but has definitely got back on track but a long way to go, but lets forget the best formulative years where claremont gave Thunderbird one of the best stories. Storm and her stories, Bishop, Bobby on the new mutants. Yukio, and many of the other characters of color he had in the background and in front of the scenes and at a time when people complained printing was one of the problems for the lack of melanin. It wasn't until morrison run, go check the lineups that the xmen became default white and about specifically charles, mags, emma more than ever and that correlates to the movies and Fox and once again morrison and what is claimed to be a quintessential run.

He also added diversity among his white character instead of everyone being from new york and the same basic type of person he had southern belle's and cajun charmers, and german and russian and so thereby even what he offered at the time was still more diverse than what you get from "Everybody from a new york suburb or rural new york or just solely America.)

[Rift]

Most people think Hellion is cool, when in fact he isnt.

Yeah, he's hot.

[Frobisher]

People say X-men is the franchise for minority characters when in reality for a good chunk of its publication history the stories revolve around the same exact set of characters (Chuck, Mags, Wolvie, Cyke etc.) with the other prominent X-men being used in group settings and most minority characters are usually used as background dressing. Even the most prominent minority character in X-men's roster, Storm, took orders from Kitty at one point. I'm not saying the rest of Marvel is better when it comes to treating minority characters and to be fair the current era of X-men is better for minorities but even then I don't remember any meaningful story told with Bishop's status as a war captain. This is why I think the best chance of new minority characters succeeding at Marvel is going solo with a legacy title (Kamala Khan, Miles Morales) and not tying themselves to a franchise where a hundred different characters are struggling for panel time.

Someone needs to page the entirety of European history that Kitty doesn't count as a minority.

[Exodus]

all X-Men are queer.

[Zelena]

He also added diversity among his white character instead of everyone being from new york and the same basic type of person he had southern belle's and cajun charmers, and german and russian and so thereby even what he offered at the time was still more diverse than what you get from "Everybody from a new york suburb or rural new york or just solely America.)

Claremont gave an international “flavour” to the X-men although they were still located in the US… It helps the exportation of the comic in my opinion.

[Grunty]

That Xmen was one of the most diverse franchises when claremont took over and how that is minimized when people think about when he left. It's like the start was white, the current stuff is white but has definitely got back on track but a long way to go, but lets forget the best formulative years where claremont gave Thunderbird one of the best stories. Storm and her stories, Bishop, Bobby on the new mutants. Yukio, and many of the other characters of color he had in the background and in front of the scenes and at a time when people complained printing was one of the problems for the lack of melanin. It wasn't until morrison run, go check the lineups that the xmen became default white and about specifically charles, mags, emma more than ever and that correlates to the movies and Fox and once again morrison and what is claimed to be a quintessential run.

He also added diversity among his white character instead of everyone being from new york and the same basic type of person he had southern belle's and cajun charmers, and german and russian and so thereby even what he offered at the time was still more diverse than what you get from "Everybody from a new york suburb or rural new york or just solely America.)

Reminds me what a bummer it was that Maggott and Cecilia Reyes were removed from the team so quickly (barely a year after their addition), because of what seems to have been a combination of writers change, editorial indecisiveness and general unfavorable reader reaction.

While Claremont briefly tried to give the later a second chance (he actualy seems to like the character) during his ill fated Revolution restart attempt, it didn't last since she was gone again when Morrison took over.

Hurray for the first black south african and puerto riccan X-men respectively, here they come, here they go and now they are killed in a stupid story in a terrible series named Weapon X.

I know Cecilia actualy managed to survive thanks to never having been confirmed dead (they never actualy adressed how Neverland got shut down either) until she made a brief cameo appearance in some mini series, but i feel the writer of Weapon X more or less implied she was done for aswell.

And before someone points the finger at the one who was allowed to stay on the X-men, the years afterwards did her little favor in the long run either (ironically in part suffering terrible characterization in the same Weapon X series), so nobody came out of the decession to cut down the new different team members unharmed or better.

Claremont gave an international “flavour” to the X-men although they were still located in the US… It helps the exportation of the comic in my opinion.

And for a while they even operated from Australia, showcasing that they don't need to be located in the US at all times either.

[Force de Phenix]

That the X-Men push had less diversity than the inhumans push. And they still haven't addressed/tried it despite having all this time and talent. Like the 3 new inhuman solos were POC and every new secondary characters as well, and this emphasis was absent with the push that has been given to the X-Men. And this is with a different CEO.

And that they're actually only allegories for lesbians and gays (and not even that sometimes), and not everything else they claim because they live in a world inside the comics that has diversity and not absent of it for it to be replaced. Hence the reason why they should not do votes for characters because the legacy characters, that are mostly non-POC, will win.