DCEU Superman thread/Henry Cavill is back as Superman

[Stanlos]

You're picturing a 20something Supes?

Also Tucker is 33 to Cavill's 39

[Last Son of Krypton]

That's interesting - and kinda adds to my prior impression that he's doing some heavy fighting behind the scenes for Cavill. It may (likely will?) come to nothing, but it does explain some things. That said, if people keep getting jerked around (rumor or not), it'll have the opposite effect and people will be over the idea (as many are already). So if they have a game they're playing (like doing something to see what the fan/general reaction will be), they'll have to be careful.

Yeah, the people making BA are on Cavill's side and want him as Superman for the BA's sequel. WB/DC are into the idea of the sequel, it seems (it's something it was discussed with them, obviously). If BA is a success, WB should greenlight JSA's spin offs and a follow up with BA vs Superman. I guess Cavill's deal could depend on BA's success. Idk, I just wanted this movie out in Dec. 2021 (the original release date), and be over this wait and see/guessing phase.

[JAK]

Yeah, the people making BA are on Cavill's side and want him as Superman for the BA's sequel. WB/DC are into the idea of the sequel, it seems (it's something it was discussed with them, obviously). If BA is a success, WB should greenlight JSA's spin offs and a follow up with BA vs Superman. I guess Cavill's deal could depend on BA's success. Idk, I just wanted this movie out in Dec. 2021 (the original release date), and be over this wait and see/guessing phase.

Agreed. I wonder if Johnson is getting as close to the "make BA a success and you'll see Cavill back as Superman" line as he possibly can without actually coming out and saying it (one for possible legal reasons, two because he doesn't want the 2nd film to suffer if/when it doesn't happen).

[Prime]

You're picturing a 20something Supes?

Also Tucker is 33 to Cavill's 39

Yeah someone in his 20's for a rebooted Superman

[DochaDocha]

Time for more useless speculation and conspiracy theories:

Henry Cavill tested positive for COVID, halting The Witcher filming as of July 25. Just imagine if he missed SDCC because of this and nobody wanted to do a real announcement without him on stage.

[manofsteel1979]

Time for more useless speculation and conspiracy theories:

Henry Cavill tested positive for COVID, halting The Witcher filming as of July 25. Just imagine if he missed SDCC because of this and nobody wanted to do a real announcement without him on stage.

That's a possibility....perhaps they'll push it back to Fandome?

However...I think at this point unless Black Adam blows the doors off the box office and Rock gets more power to have his way, Henry's days as Superman are likely over.

[Jeffrey2]

The scoop about Cavill was obviously fake from the get-go. Ironically it anything the BA stuff seems to hint no Cavill cameo.

I thought BA/Johnson planted the false story. But it sort of came back at BA as some in the audience supposedly booed parts of the BA panel I guess for lack of Cavill stuff? Clearly a small group of Cavill fans took it to heart and some expressed their disappointment at the panel. I now think Cavill's team put out the rumor. He loves to disrupt things.

IMO the decision is made. Cavill is not coming back. There is little/no talk of Superman coming from WBD/Zaslov and the small amount there is often is false. Like Zaslav said to stop all Superman projects and get Cavill. Never happened, it was someone at WBD, not Zaslav - most likely the guard at the main entrance was the source. LOL

MOS likely lost money for WB and Zaslov will not touch the franchise for that reason. Especially as he has so many billion or near billion DC franchises. The bottom line may preclude any more film Superman from WBD other than a Black Superman reboot. Even there it appears there are worries about its profitability so it's not a given they greenlight the Abrams project.

Why the WB/Cavill fan dance that has gone on for years? Beats me. Cavill knows WB won't do more Supes and WB knows Cavill won't agree to do cameos in WBD DC films. It's like WBB could hire another less expensive actor to do cameos. Given that situation they would pay at scale w/o any premium as Cavill would cost. I think WB/Zaslav will announce that Cavill is no longer associated with the role once the new DC head is named. So sometime this year.

I think the Rock and Cavill could have agreed that the Rock would do everything to get a Superman cameo with Cavill in BA and also to push a Superman solo film. The Rock failed.

[Jeffrey2]

Agreed. I wonder if Johnson is getting as close to the "make BA a success and you'll see Cavill back as Superman" line as he possibly can without actually coming out and saying it (one for possible legal reasons, two because he doesn't want the 2nd film to suffer if/when it doesn't happen).

Folks are trying to read too much into this. Looking for something that Johnson or others say that may, might, could mean Cavill is coming back. He isn't. All indications point that way. Zaslav is not talking Superman and certainly not Cavill.

It is possible MOS actually lost money (the real numbers that studios tweak) and Zaslav is all about the bottom line. He won't touch another Superman film but maybe for the Black Superman project which may be financially dicey as well. Another Superman film will be financially risky no matter how well BA does. Zaslov is not waiting to see how well BA does before announcing a Superman film. The franchise stands on its own or it doesn't, and WBD/Zaslav seem to think it doesn't.

At this point doing a traditional Superman film and a recast would take what - 4, 5 years to see the light of day. If they started like today? By then WBD is just a few years from the IP going public. At that point it immediately loses a lot of its value. Just saying that, looking at the bottom line, it makes no sense for WBD to do more Superman.

[Last Son of Krypton]

Agreed. I wonder if Johnson is getting as close to the "make BA a success and you'll see Cavill back as Superman" line as he possibly can without actually coming out and saying it (one for possible legal reasons, two because he doesn't want the 2nd film to suffer if/when it doesn't happen).

Yeah, this is the kind of thing he couldn't say explicitly. But him saying there are people BTS who want Henry to win say it all.

Time for more useless speculation and conspiracy theories:

Henry Cavill tested positive for COVID, halting The Witcher filming as of July 25. Just imagine if he missed SDCC because of this and nobody wanted to do a real announcement without him on stage.

It's always time for that. Everything about Cavill and his Superman are useless speculations and tin foil hat conspiracy theories.

It was a podcast I never heard of that made this claim first right after SDCC: https://youtu.be/k9YoYPzrxyE?t=3317

He got Covid for real?

[Jeffrey2]

Which goes back to my larger point....WB, at least until recent history and before the current in progress regime change, aren't all that bothered with making another Superman movie. The only reason we got MOS was that the heirs of Jerry Siegel stood to gain the film rights to the character Had WB not made another Superman film by 2013, and Chris Nolan and David Goyer brainstormed the alien first contact story idea that eventually became MOS. They want to do the bare minimum with the IP and I'm sure the faceless cameos they've done recently is all a way to make sure they don't have to be forced to make another Superman solo movie. They can legally say Superman is still being used on the big and small screen whilst retaining the film rights and make sure they don't lapse.

Again...they love the money that big yellow and Red S makes for them through licensing..

Hanging onto effective control of the IP requires maximizing the mark prior to it going public. Faceless cameos will not do that. Indeed, if that was WB's intention, they would have dropped Cavill, gotten another actor and given that actor more than cameo appearances in DCEU films. WBD seems like it will let the IP go public w/o a fight and that means they don't feel it has intrinsic value, or a lot of intrinsic value. In the court case WB exec Alan Horn (at the time) said WB had doubts about Superman's financial viability. Under oath. But the family was pressing, and MOS was rushed out to do something w/the franchise which the family said WB was letting lapse. MOS severly underperformed at the box more or less confirming Horn's/WB's view of the franchise.

I don't know if the licensing of Superman makes that much money compeered to other DC franchises. I seldom see Superman products in stores or online while Batman, Spiderman, Flash and WW products are over the place. Hence WBD letting the francishhe go public w/o a fight.

[Vordan]

Apparently Collider is backing them up, that Redanian Intelligence site is is legit when it comes to Witcher stuff from what I’ve seen. But I don’t think Cavill getting Covid is why he didn’t show up, he could’ve zoomed in, or recorded a message, or even just posted something on his Instagram but he hasn’t done any of that. That half of the rumor is bullshit imo

Hanging onto effective control of the IP requires maximizing the mark prior to it going public. Faceless cameos will not do that. Indeed, if that was WB's intention, they would have dropped Cavill, gotten another actor and given that actor more than cameo appearances in DCEU films. WBD seems like it will let the IP go public w/o a fight and that means they don't feel it has intrinsic value, or a lot of intrinsic value. In the court case WB exec Alan Horn (at the time) said WB had doubts about Superman's financial viability. Under oath. But the family was pressing, and MOS was rushed out to do something w/the franchise which the family said WB was letting lapse. MOS severly underperformed at the box more or less confirming Horn's/WB's view of the franchise.

I don't know if the licensing of Superman makes that much money compeered to other DC franchises. I seldom see Superman products in stores or online while Batman, Spiderman, Flash and WW products are over the place. Hence WBD letting the francishhe go public w/o a fight.

Dude I swear it’s like you live in a different dimension from the rest of us. WB isn’t doing anything with Superman? You know there’s a theatrical Super-Pets movie coming out this week right? He’s in that. He’s got a TV show, 3 animated movies next year are going to feature him in some capacity, he and Kon were major focuses of the last season of YJ, he’s got an animated cartoon coming out next year and there’s a LoSH series by Bendis that’s in the works and is likely going to star his son, he’s second to Batman in the number of comic book projects he’s got, what on Earth gives you the impression that WB has no interest in him and is letting him go without a fight? No company EVER let’s ANYTHING go without a fight. Plus they can’t lose the Superman franchise because Supergirl is in that franchise and they’re planning on using her over in films.

I don’t know how you don’t see any “Superman products” in stores:



He’s on candy bars and has t-shirts in Walmart, he’s in Lego sets, he’s all over the place. Go compare Superman to Green Lantern right now and tell me with a straight face Superman has it worse.

[Jeffrey2]

Just saw a vid saying Cavill is done with Superman. it fits with the BA panel and other hints, but I won't get my hopes up yet. Lord that this is true

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cNu_OczJ8ts

The claims that he wants more money for coming back have been out there. Reports that he is very difficult to work with go way back. During the filming of BvS it was reported that Cavill seldom came out of his dressing room to mingle with cast/crew or visitors. That is telling if true. He has many projects going and I doubt money is a problem for him. Though, given rumors around Cavill, it could be true he was demanding a price WBD could not pay to return as Supes. IMO Cavill does not give a f**k about Superman fans. Many of them absolutely think he was awful in the role and others are neutral. Only Cavill fanatics think he did a good job. Who knows, maybe Cavill's team was the source of the rumor - done to give a dig to Superman fans.

I don't know how much play the rumor got on social media - beyond the geeks - but it got enough to get a story in The Wire and IMO this does not put WBD is a good light. Even though WBD didn't start the rumor. Many have their suspicions as to who did. If WBD thinks it was someone from the Cavill camp it would only further the animosity that supposedly exists between WBD and Cavill. It could be coming to a head as the previous suits doing nothing one way or the other makes WB look incompetent. Zaslov can't afford to continue the Cavill drama as it will make him look as bad as his predecessors. WB should fire Cavill and do so publicly or tell him to announce he is leaving the role - before WBD does so. I hope an "official" announcement is coming soon one way or the other that Cavill is out. Then again, Cavill not being in BA may, in the end, be the only announcement Cavill is gone. Nothing formal just as there was not with Routh.

[DochaDocha]

He got Covid for real?

According to Collider, yeah.

[JAK]

Folks are trying to read too much into this. Looking for something that Johnson or others say that may, might, could mean Cavill is coming back. He isn't. All indications point that way. Zaslav is not talking Superman and certainly not Cavill.

It is possible MOS actually lost money (the real numbers that studios tweak) and Zaslav is all about the bottom line. He won't touch another Superman film but maybe for the Black Superman project which may be financially dicey as well. Another Superman film will be financially risky no matter how well BA does. Zaslov is not waiting to see how well BA does before announcing a Superman film. The franchise stands on its own or it doesn't, and WBD/Zaslav seem to think it doesn't.

At this point doing a traditional Superman film and a recast would take what - 4, 5 years to see the light of day. If they started like today? By then WBD is just a few years from the IP going public. At that point it immediately loses a lot of its value. Just saying that, looking at the bottom line, it makes no sense for WBD to do more Superman.

Again, I don't think you're wrong on Cavill likely not coming back. But that doesn't mean that no one is still trying, and I don't think it's reading too much into anything that Johnson is (or he knows people that are). Him trying to push for it and it happening are two VERY different things, but nothing in what we've seen shows certainty that no one is still pushing.

I'm aware of Zaslav's motivations; you've said it before (and I've known it before you'd mentioned it the first time: the whole CNN+ thing being pulled was kinda hilarious - except for the behind-the-scenes staff losing jobs, that sucks -, and that happened as soon as he walked in the door). I'm not questioning any of that. All I'm saying is that I think others are still pushing, and I'm fascinated by it. I'm not saying that to instill hope for people or anything else, I'm just noting what it looks like to me.

But I don't agree with your logic that WB won't do anything else with Superman again since it's close to the IP being public. They won't own the original concept, but there's a LOT that they will still control, including a good number of popular characters and iconography - including the villains. Heck, Batman is a massive thing for them, and his goes a year after Superman. However, you're right that it will change things to a degree, and may even put pressure to do more before the IP deadline while they can, if they know they have an audience for it. What that translates into is literally anyone's guess, however, and will depend on how much brand loyalty movie goers have at that point, and what others do with the property (or as much of it as they're legally allowed to).

[Jeffrey2]

Again, I don't think you're wrong on Cavill likely not coming back. But that doesn't mean that no one is still trying, and I don't think it's reading too much into anything that Johnson is (or he knows people that are). Him trying to push for it and it happening are two VERY different things, but nothing in what we've seen shows certainty that no one is still pushing.

I'm aware of Zaslav's motivations; you've said it before (and I've known it before you'd mentioned it the first time: the whole CNN+ thing being pulled was kinda hilarious - except for the behind-the-scenes staff losing jobs, that sucks -, and that happened as soon as he walked in the door). I'm not questioning any of that. All I'm saying is that I think others are still pushing, and I'm fascinated by it. I'm not saying that to instill hope for people or anything else, I'm just noting what it looks like to me.

But I don't agree with your logic that WB won't do anything else with Superman again since it's close to the IP being public. They won't own the original concept, but there's a LOT that they will still control, including a good number of popular characters and iconography - including the villains. Heck, Batman is a massive thing for them, and his goes a year after Superman. However, you're right that it will change things to a degree, and may even put pressure to do more before the IP deadline while they can, if they know they have an audience for it. What that translates into is literally anyone's guess, however, and will depend on how much brand loyalty movie goers have at that point, and what others do with the property (or as much of it as they're legally allowed to).

WB is doing S&L, animated Superman stuff and such. They really don't need to do a Superman film given the financial situation (read ROI) re: Superman compared to its billion-dollar franchises like Aquaman, Joker, WW & Batman (near billion) and possibly BA. Frankly, WBD and Cavill look like clowns in this back and forth. Zaslov is all business, and I don't think he will let this drag on. As to Cavill, if he loves the character as he professes then why hold out for the last dollar to return to the role? Especially if it's the only chance there is to see a classic Superman on the big screen again. And, if Cavill is as perfect for the role as he seems to think he is, then one of the cameos, well received, could turn into a solo film down the line.

In the meantime, the Black Superman script should be back by now or soon from its rewrite so maybe there will be news on that front in the next month or so.

And, to cut Cavill some slack, many of his non-Superman fans are glad he is not returning to the role as they see it as boring and limiting his career. As here they believe WB needs Cavill but Cavill doesn't need WB/Superman and doesn't need the "toxic" Superman fans. .

https://www.btlnews.com/commentary/h...ns-toxic-fans/

It’s dumb, pointless, and the essence of toxic fandom, and Henry Cavill, for one, clearly has no use for it. There are a lot of interesting roles in his future, and I’ll bet none of them will require him to wear spandex.