Black Panther: Wakanda Forever

[Jokerz79]

Not really not counting BvS they have eatch had 1 movie MOS came out before a billion was a normal thing and the Batman came out during the pandemic BvS did close to a billion.

Superman 1978 when adjusted for Inflation was a Billion Dollar Movie. Dark Knight, Dark Knight Rises, Avengers, and Iron Man 3 all made a Billion Dollars MoS had no excuse except the audience didn't like it enough. No Way Home cane out before The Batman and made a Billion Dollars. No Way Home is really the Benchmark for when the Pandemic quit affecting cinema.

If you're WB you see there's an issue and start trying to right the train.

[Agent Z]

Can we not derail this thread with talks about box office and other superhero films that aren't even from Marvel, please?

[Scott Taylor]

Honestly, Namor did not feel like he was the villain of the story and his request to Wakanda was not invalid as nobody would have even bothered him or his people if not for the reveal of Vibranium's existence and really can it not be said he got what he wanted by his last line saying that Wakanda would need them as allies?

Namor wanted to team with Wakanda to seize control of the world by using all of their combined vibranium technologies in order to control oppression, get revenge, blah blah blah. He was Killmonger, but in the water and without as much resolve.

The movie sets up a detente between Wakanda and Namorland, keeping each other in check. But mostly Wakanda keeping Namor and his buddies in check.

[Alpha]

Namor wanted to team with Wakanda to seize control of the world by using all of their combined vibranium technologies in order to control oppression, get revenge, blah blah blah. He was Killmonger, but in the water and without as much resolve.

The movie sets up a detente between Wakanda and Namorland, keeping each other in check. But mostly Wakanda keeping Namor and his buddies in check.

Not quite. There are many similarities between Killmonger and Namor. There are also many differences. One big difference is that Killmonger's whole goal was to force Wakanda to be open to the world, whereas Namor was extremely focussed on keeping his people hidden from the world and using any method to make sure the information and technology couldn't be passed around. So in that area they are actually the opposite of each other.

[Scott Taylor]

Not quite. There are many similarities between Killmonger and Namor. There are also many differences. One big difference is that Killmonger's whole goal was to force Wakanda to be open to the world, whereas Namor was extremely focussed on keeping his people hidden from the world and using any method to make sure the information and technology couldn't be passed around. So in that area they are actually the opposite of each other.

Wow. You are talking about Wakanda where for hundreds of years they literally had the entire world believing that they were just a rural, agrarian society. Whereas they were really hidden behind advanced shielding technology and keeping all their vibranium completely to themselves, while spies were sent around the world specifically to make sure the Wakandan secret was kept safe.

[kidfresh512]

Wow. You are talking about Wakanda where for hundreds of years they literally had the entire world believing that they were just a rural, agrarian society. Whereas they were really hidden behind advanced shielding technology and keeping all their vibranium completely to themselves, while spies were sent around the world specifically to make sure the Wakandan secret was kept safe.

Namor would have preferred they stayed that way. He said T'challa deciding to come out was a mistake pretty much and not one Namor wanted to repeat thus the threats to not spread news of their existence.

Even at the end with the new alliance he told Namora that he thinks they hold all the cards in the alliance. Wakanda has to come to them when the world attacks them and they need help. And mostly no one else still knows about them other than Wakanda.

[Scott Taylor]

Namor is right, though, it was a mistake. The world powers are pretty much doing anything they can to try and steal vibranium.

[choptop]

Superman 1978 when adjusted for Inflation was a Billion Dollar Movie. Dark Knight, Dark Knight Rises, Avengers, and Iron Man 3 all made a Billion Dollars MoS had no excuse except the audience didn't like it enough. No Way Home cane out before The Batman and made a Billion Dollars. No Way Home is really the Benchmark for when the Pandemic quit affecting cinema.

If you're WB you see there's an issue and start trying to right the train.

The Pandemic is still affecting cinema man just look at the numbers from 18/19 compared to 21/22.

Anyway you keep talking like there's been so many batman or superman moves there's been 1 for each in modern movie times not counting BvS MOS came out as the MCU was really started to get going and batman came out during the pandemic both still did really well.

[The Cool Thatguy]

Does anyone know/remember what the Americans overheard with Ross, though? They might have an inkling about Namor's people

[Twickster]

Does anyone know/remember what the Americans overheard with Ross, though? They might have an inkling about Namor's people

The Wakandans gave Ross nothing, only vague references that there was "another hidden world power". Nobody still knows that Talokan exists.

[80sbaby]

Does anyone know/remember what the Americans overheard with Ross, though? They might have an inkling about Namor's people

Ramonda never told him exactly what was going on. Just that there was a new power player but not if they were new or someone they already know about.

[Mistah K88]

I finally saw the movie a couple days ago. I liked it, not as much as the first, but I understood that Real Life Writes the Plot. I'm curious to know what the plans were before Chadwick's death. That said, just like the first, I'm glad that this movie was standalone (i.e. no real connections to other movies except well...Black Panther.). I mean you wouldn't even remember that Thanos snapped people out of existence for 5 years with them reappearing out of nowhere later.

Riri was kind of there for no reason...but I guess they wasted Stark protege on Peter Parker for a good several years so eh it works.

Shuri, I like her...but for some reason I don't think she could carry a movie alone, luckily the rest of the cast were really entertaining.

I liked Namor a lot, and definitely felt that he was quite the presence and I felt it was a good call to make the underwater kingdom something that wasn't Atlantis (as far as the general audience is concerned, we've seen the Greco-Roman architecture twice with DC's Paradise Island and Atlantis), it was something out of the ordinary for me. Also, the fact that it was T'Challa opening up to the world that brought this problem to Namor's doorstep in the first place is something I'm glad was touched on, as I figured that plotline would be forgotten. M'Baku said something about Namor's people thinking he was a god (probably due to his longevity as well as being able to breathe above water as well.), however I think after Namora saw him kneeling when they were clearly winning makes her realize that Namor is just a man, a really strong one, but a mortal regardless.

[The Cool Thatguy]

Ramonda never told him exactly what was going on. Just that there was a new power player but not if they were new or someone they already know about.

True, but IIRC, didn't the woman from the CIA team say that the attackers weren't Wakandians?

I imagine they might have an inkling of what's out there, but no facts.

[Starrius]

[QUOTE= M'Baku said something about Namor's people thinking he was a god (probably due to his longevity as well as being able to breathe above water as well.), however I think after Namora saw him kneeling when they were clearly winning makes her realize that Namor is just a man, a really strong one, but a mortal regardless.[/QUOTE]

yeah........They thought he was a god because of his longevity, ability to breathe both in and out of water, his appearance with his pointy ears and wings on his feet as well as not being light blue, his great superhuman strength and durability, and his extremely fast flying ability, and extremely fast swimming ability

unlike his people, he's a mutant

[Sutekh]

Finally got to see this yesterday. Pretty interesting. As a reader of comics for, far longer than I like to admit, I actually enjoy when the MCU (or DCU) comes up with something original in adapting their vast and convoluted (and oft-times contradictory, thanks to decades worth of retcons and changes) catalog of characters and setting elements.

Random thoughts;

Shuri doesn't show up to the Wakandan waterfall leadership summit, and M'Baku does, challenging for the throne. (Does anyone else? If not, does he win by default? Will he be the first ever Wakandan ruler who isn't of the Panther tribe, or has it changed between the tribes before?) I really enjoy M'Baku, and it's neat seeing him be the voice of wisdom when Shuri gets her vengeful on (and takes terrible advice from the last dead guy she should). He'd be an interesting Wakandan king, and that seems like where they are going. (And does the King always get to be Black Panther, too, and does that mean M'Baku will get to be a Black Panther, if he becomes King?)

In the comics, Namora is a strong ally, and Attuma and often-times rival / foe of Namor. Here, we see Namora getting a bit disillusioned with seeing her god 'kneel before the Wakandans,' and it would intrigue me if *she's* the one to mount a challenge to Namor's leadership! Attuma, on the other hand, had a really fun rivalry with Akoye, to the point that it almost got a little flirty (yanno, except for the part where they were really trying to kill each other...). Like I said above, I like when they show me something I would not have expected, and Namora a potential foe to Namor in later appearances, and Attuma being even remotely 'fun' to watch (although not nearly so much that he'd be 'the Talokan M'Baku'), was definitely counter to any expectations I went in with.

Talokan is fairly young, given the time frame, and certainly couldn't be the inspiration for Greek tales of Atlantis, which predate Namor's mom turning blue and aquatic by one or two thousand years... That's probably for the best, as DC has boldly gone there already, and I'd rather see something new than a couple of different companies showing me competing views of Atlantis.

Bast leads Bashenga to the heart-shaped herb in Wakanda. Some god I don't remember the name of leads Namor's mom's priest-dude to the underwater vibranium-infused herb that transformed them. We've seen gods in Thor and Moon Knight, and possibly other stuff I'm not remembering. I'm intrigued by how some gods, like Thor, seem like just dudes-with-powers, not any more 'godlike' than say, the Hulk, or Namor, while Bast and this MesoAmerican dude act a bit more 'godlike' and don't actually appear, save in visions and portents.

Hm, Angela Basset is free to play Storm, I guess, the role I wanted for her before Halle Berry got the job for the Fox-Men movies. Not gonna happen, but I can dream!

Riri. Meh. I would really have liked if she was already part of the Wakandan Outreach Program thingie, or at least on the short-list to be recruited for it. I like's me some connective tissue, where the gun seen in the first act gets fired by the third act. (Why tell me about an Outreach program if you're not gonna pull that trigger? Talk to me about stuff that's relevant in the two hours my ass is in this seat!) Still, she gets to play the Agent Ross 'NPC who gets to stare in awe at all the cool Wakandan stuff' role, in this one, and pretty much gets the same 'fly around and shoot stuff' in the third act. But Riri *and* the Midnight Angel suits was about 200% too many Wakandan Iron Man suits for my tastes. Riri makes one? Fine. She's amazing, I'll accept it. But then Shuri pumps out a couple? No. Craps on how amazing Riri is, *and* feels disrespectful to Stark, as well. I'd be similarly displeased if she said 'oh, magic is real?' and an hour later was out sorcerer-ing Dr. Strange, or whipping up some vibranium-enhanced gamma-formula that let Doras Hulk out willy-nilly. Niche protection, Shuri. Don't rub another man's rhubarb!

Agent Ross better get used to be called 'colonizer,' 'cause I think he's persona non grata in Langley.

Akele? The new Dora with the knives, who is dating Akoye by the end. So pretty.

Namor's nose-piercing/septum-plug thingie? So distracting! Yikes!