Zaslav's era could be the worst time for WW.

[Vordan]

JL movie yes. And injustice, dceased, son of kal el, and literally all the JL comics till these days. Where she is a glorified poster and nothing more. While Superman alwways gets to do something. I don't care about GL and AQ dear. Those characters getting bad treatment doesn't change the fact that the so called most important and iconic female in comics has a guinness record of being treated like trash by the company that swears she is so important. SM's white straight privilage needs to stop. She shouldn't be his punching bag, when he can't even make the big numbers that the real money cow batman does. WW at this point has more than earned the right to be more than Superman's punching bag.

Well “dear” this year you have content wise
- Her ongoing
- WW: Evolution
- WW: Black & Gold
- Historia
- Nubia’s mini
- Trial of the Amazons her first event in ages
- A Hippolyta one shot

And just recently you have this:




They gave you EXACTLY what you constantly blubber about wanting: WW utterly dominating Superman. But of course that’s not enough because you would literally die if you didn’t find something to complain about. Ever get tired of being the eternal victim?

Edit: Funniest thing about this is that you think WW beating up Superman means anything. Like if she beats him up that’s going to make her co-equal with Batman or something. Guess what mystical - Superman is one of the biggest jobbers in comics. He’s CONSTANTLY getting his butt kicked. But Batman beat you to that punch over 40 years ago and nobody cares anymore. Superman getting beat up means nothing.

[WonderLight789]

Well “dear” this year you have content wise
- Her ongoing
- WW: Evolution
- WW: Black & Gold
- Historia
- Nubia’s mini
- Trial of the Amazons her first event in ages
- A Hippolyta one shot

And just recently you have this:




They gave you EXACTLY what you constantly blubber about wanting: WW utterly dominating Superman. But of course that’s not enough because you would literally die if you didn’t find something to complain about. Ever get tired of being the eternal victim?

Edit: Funniest thing about this is that you think WW beating up Superman means anything. Like if she beats him up that’s going to make her co-equal with Batman or something. Guess what mystical - Superman is one of the biggest jobbers in comics. He’s CONSTANTLY getting his butt kicked. But Batman beat you to that punch over 40 years ago and nobody cares anymore. Superman getting beat up means nothing.

WW was and still is SM's punching bag 95% of the time. So no it's not enough. Superman is still seen as a powerhouse that other characters are compared to. And WW is a pathetic weaklink compared to him. The following needs to happen.

Genocide stomps Doomsday.

Cheetah destroys Mongul.

Queen Clea stomps Zod.

Circe destroys Darkseid.

And of course. WW stops being the punching bag that SM kills in one or 2 hits. Or the second option for SM's bedroom when lois isn't available. Oh and that comic you posted. Funny how WW needed kryptonite. SM never needs more than his fists to stopm her in all the battles he has trashed her. Next.

[Baseman]

WW was and still is SM's punching bag 95% of the time. So no it's not enough. Superman is still seen as a powerhouse that other characters are compared to. And WW is a pathetic weaklink compared to him. The following needs to happen.

Genocide stomps Doomsday.

Cheetah destroys Mongul.

Queen Clea stomps Zod.

Circe destroys Darkseid.

And of course. WW stops being the punching bag that SM kills in one or 2 hits. Or the second option for SM's bedroom when lois isn't available.

Why and how exactly would Circle go after Darkseid (or vice versa)?.The two live on different planets.Same with Cheetah and Mongul.Why would these people fight in the first place?

[WonderLight789]

Why and how exactly would Circle go after Darkseid (or vice versa)?.The two live on different planets.Same with Cheetah and Mongul.Why would these people fight in the first place?

I don't know. Ask DC. When they want WW and her lore to be the punching bag for others. They always find a way. See Cheetah vs catwoman. 3 times already. When they wanted to show that WW's Gods are trash next to new Gods. They found a way. So use your imagination.

[Gaius]

I was shocked when I learned that this had as much effects shows as Infinity War.

That's crazy. It's a Flash movie. It shouldn't be this expensive and it should never have been a reboot.

I bet they were counting on Batman and the JL cameos to bring in the billions.

Honestly, I wish they would just release it and get it over with at this point.

Do doubt they were.

Stranger things have happened, Aquaman reached a billion and the new Batman movie didn't but would be surprised to see even a well-received Flash movie reach those numbers.

[WonderLight789]

Do doubt they were.

Stranger things have happened, Aquaman reached a billion and the new Batman movie didn't but would be surprised to see even a well-received Flash movie reach those numbers.

The batmam making less than Wonder Woman 2017. Now that was beautiful. Truly a moment to celebrate.

[bardkeep]

The batmam making less than Wonder Woman 2017. Now that was beautiful. Truly a moment to celebrate.

Is it something to celebrate? The Batman was a genuinely great movie, certainly more deserving of a billion than Aquaman or NWH. It also came out on the tail end of that really crazy Omicron wave at the beginning of this year which likely affected its BO total.

[Colossus1980]

SM has had flops at BO for over 4 decades now. WW84 had streaming released at the same time during a global lockdown. Context matters.

I am comparing because even though WW has been making money for DC. More than SM at BO nowadays. And her title sells in the same range as his title. She still gets thrown under the bus to be his punching bag binstead of getting more respect.

Just curious where WW stood in media franchise sales which apparently includes everything and was surprised to see WW did not make the list, the lowest amount to be considered was 2 Billion. Superman was there at 10.9B but of course Bat-God was towering over both with 29.9B. Spider-Man was the top super-hero of the two big companies with 31.8B. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...dia_franchises

The first WW movie thrashed MOS but beyond that I wouldn't say WW is a guaranteed success at the BO. 1984 was a bit of a critical stinker and doubt it would have anywhere near the first WW box office. Directors matter and Snyder dropped the ball on MOS as well as BVS. WW came out at a time when the superhero craze was really on fire. I don't think if she appeared onscreen in the 90s and early 2000s she would have dominated.

[bardkeep]

Just curious where WW stood in media franchise sales which apparently includes everything and was surprised to see WW did not make the list, the lowest amount to be considered was 2 Billion. Superman was there at 10.9B but of course Bat-God was towering over both with 29.9B. Spider-Man was the top super-hero of the two big companies with 31.8B. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...dia_franchises

Totally unfair comparison.

1. Over the last many decades Batman and Superman have each had several TV shows (animated and live action), over half a dozen live action movies dating back to the ‘70s, and several more animated movies, many if not most of which were in the DCAU’s peak years in the ‘90s. Batman has the wildly successful Arkham games and Supes’ games have sucked but he’s had 2 of them. And Superman comics sold gangbusters back in the day.

WW has the Lynda Carter series, 2 DC animated movies that were released long past the DCAU’s peak (plus home video sales are worth nil in the age of streaming and Bloodlines came out in 2019), and 2 live action movies, one of which was released at the height of the pandemic when most movie theaters were closed with a simultaneous streaming release. I agree that WW84 wouldn’t have hit the first movie’s BO total but given its HBO Max streaming numbers it still would’ve undoubtedly been a commercial success.

2. You literally can’t have this conversation without addressing the impact of misogyny. Other than Twilight (which had a massively successful 4-book series and 5 huge movies), all of the female-led franchises on that list are merchandising juggernauts aimed at small children (Disney princesses, Dora the Explorer, Hello Kitty). And on the same token, unless you count anime characters, there are no POC-led franchises on that entire list other than Dora.

I agree that in the ‘90s/early ‘00s she wouldn’t have seen the same success but it’s not just the modern superhero craze - NO female-led big budget blockbusters were coming out. Only recently have people really come around to more diverse content with women leads. Right now I’d argue that there’s def more of a public appetite for WW than Superman, though the fact that his last several movies sucked probably doesn’t help.

[HestiasHearth]

Is that last art from WW: Dead Earth? Yikes. That's some ugly *** art...

[HestiasHearth]

Just to clarify, I'm mostly speaking in terms of one particular poster whose sole purpose seems to be comparing the two.

There is an ignore button. Also, this is a discussion board for all WW fans to talk about what they feel is awesome or awful about WW comics.. Not everyone will be in agreement about all things WW 100 % of the time.

[Veni]

No word yet. We only have a screen cap of it.

It probably will be released though, since it's more adult oriented. It's the preschool animation and live action shows that they are cutting.

They also announced Scooby-Doo! and the Mystery Pups (a preschool Scooby-Doo cartoon) after the merger was completed. It will release in 2024. So that won't be canceled. The status of the Velma HBO show is unknown and a release date hasn't been announced.

[Veni]

Do doubt they were.

Stranger things have happened, Aquaman reached a billion and the new Batman movie didn't but would be surprised to see even a well-received Flash movie reach those numbers.

Aquaman was released in December 2018. There was no other movie in theaters at the time except Mary Poppins Returns (which flopped). People needed something to watch and Aquaman was it since there was no Marvel movie in theaters at the time.

[Veni]

Totally unfair comparison.

1. Over the last many decades Batman and Superman have each had several TV shows (animated and live action), over half a dozen live action movies dating back to the ‘70s, and several more animated movies, many if not most of which were in the DCAU’s peak years in the ‘90s. Batman has the wildly successful Arkham games and Supes’ games have sucked but he’s had 2 of them. And Superman comics sold gangbusters back in the day.

WW has the Lynda Carter series, 2 DC animated movies that were released long past the DCAU’s peak (plus home video sales are worth nil in the age of streaming and Bloodlines came out in 2019), and 2 live action movies, one of which was released at the height of the pandemic when most movie theaters were closed with a simultaneous streaming release. I agree that WW84 wouldn’t have hit the first movie’s BO total but given its HBO Max streaming numbers it still would’ve undoubtedly been a commercial success.

2. You literally can’t have this conversation without addressing the impact of misogyny. Other than Twilight (which had a massively successful 4-book series and 5 huge movies), all of the female-led franchises on that list are merchandising juggernauts aimed at small children (Disney princesses, Dora the Explorer, Hello Kitty). And on the same token, unless you count anime characters, there are no POC-led franchises on that entire list other than Dora.

I agree that in the ‘90s/early ‘00s she wouldn’t have seen the same success but it’s not just the modern superhero craze - NO female-led big budget blockbusters were coming out. Only recently have people really come around to more diverse content with women leads. Right now I’d argue that there’s def more of a public appetite for WW than Superman, though the fact that his last several movies sucked probably doesn’t help.

You forgot to mention The Hunger Games franchise which is also female-led and is one of the most successful franchises. Another one is Sailor Moon, which is popular with both kids and adults.

[BiteTheBullet]

Is it something to celebrate? The Batman was a genuinely great movie, certainly more deserving of a billion than Aquaman or NWH. It also came out on the tail end of that really crazy Omicron wave at the beginning of this year which likely affected its BO total.

Is that your opinion or fact? Because I thought the movie was too long and actually quite a bit on the boring side. And the fact that unlike Wonder Woman, Batman is apparently bullet proof and is dumb enough to just take point blank range shots to his body from the bad guys. Insipidly stupid in parts of the movie.