How have things changed since One More Day?

[WebLurker]

15 year old kids say dumb things like that because they're naive. Two 15 year olds dating who've been dating for a few months is not directly analogous to a marriage between two adults, and I don't think Bendis was trying to suggest that it was. If he was, then that would be deeply irresponsible.

We're getting off the point here. The point is, Ultimate Spider-Man isn't the best comic to cite in favor of "dating only," esp. in regards to where it ends.

[Lee]

We're getting off the point here. The point is, Ultimate Spider-Man isn't the best comic to cite in favor of "dating only," esp. in regards to where it ends.

It's a comic where Peter Parker and Mary Jane were dating, but not married. They were also minors.

The fact that they got to walk off into the sunset long after Peter had been replaced as the series' protagonist doesn't retroactively make Ultimate Spider-Man a series about a married couple. They didn't even get married in their happy epilogue.

It absolutely was a "dating only" Spider-Man comic.

[Kevinroc]

Some people are conflating the Peter x MJ relationship as a whole with the Spider-Man marriage. It's easy to understand WHY people do that, but they need to separate those two things.

[Kaitou D. Kid]

Some people are conflating the Peter x MJ relationship as a whole with the Spider-Man marriage. It's easy to understand WHY people do that, but they need to separate those two things.

The OMD Team is essentially made of two groups with two different goals.

The first group are the people who think Peter shouldn't grow past 15-22. They wanted to undo the marriage because they blamed it for making him older than that.

The second group are people who don't like MJ and the fact that Peter married her.

The reason these two groups get conflated is because, frankly, there is significant overlap between them.

[WebLurker]

It's a comic where Peter Parker and Mary Jane were dating, but not married. They were also minors.

The fact that they got to walk off into the sunset long after Peter had been replaced as the series' protagonist doesn't retroactively make Ultimate Spider-Man a series about a married couple. They didn't even get married in their happy epilogue.

It absolutely was a "dating only" Spider-Man comic.

Are we even having the same conversation at this point?

[Matt Rat]

Ultimate Peter and MJ were more than a couple that merely 'dated', but soul mates that many supporting characters compared to a married pair. Mary Jane even says the day Peter confessed to her that he was Spider-Man was the day both felt like they'd just been married.

[Lee]

They were children.

[Matt Rat]

They were children.

Some married couples start off as 'childhood sweethearts'

Stick with the original topic please.

[CrimsonEchidna]

So leaving the marriage talk aside, I've always been vocal when this topic comes up that there's been a more concerted effort on Marvel's part to "De-Age" Peter in the eyes of the Public Perception in pop culture. You can see it with the Amazing Reboot, which reset Peter back to high school, and then it got canned with the movie that had him, graduate. The MCU reboot proceeded to make him even younger and pushed the ante by having him start off as Iron Man's protege. All the cartoons have also repeatedly cast him as high school age even though they also weirdly tried to have it both ways with Peter also being a mentor to similarly aged characters.

The outliers are of course Spider-Verse and the Playstation games. And yeah fittingly, Miles Morales is the protagonist and deuteragonist retrospectively so it kind of comes across as Marvel only being comfortable aging him up as long as there's another younger hero to counter-balance him.

---------

Relationship-wise, I think Marvel wrote themselves into a corner and they know it. After Dan tried and failed with Carlie Cooper he seemed to go out of his way to put any relationship on the back burner. Even after Peter hooked up with Bobbi, they were barely written as a couple and broke up pretty quickly. And Lian Tang was also similar where the two got together in between a time skip, most of their relationship was written off-panel, and then after her betrayal, they seemingly broke up off-panel.

So now we're kind of left with Spencer's and now Wells' run opting for the "Star-Crossed Lovers" thing with Peter and MJ.

[Frontier]

So leaving the marriage talk aside, I've always been vocal when this topic comes up that there's been a more concerted effort on Marvel's part to "De-Age" Peter in the eyes of the Public Perception in pop culture. You can see it with the Amazing Reboot, which reset Peter back to high school, and then it got canned with the movie that had him, graduate. The MCU reboot proceeded to make him even younger and pushed the ante by having him start off as Iron Man's protege. All the cartoons have also repeatedly cast him as high school age even though they also weirdly tried to have it both ways with Peter also being a mentor to similarly aged characters.

The outliers are of course Spider-Verse and the Playstation games. And yeah fittingly, Miles Morales is the protagonist and deuteragonist retrospectively so it kind of comes across as Marvel only being comfortable aging him up as long as there's another younger hero to counter-balance him.

I laugh every time we get a teenage Peter Parker and Miles Morales together where the only leg up Peter has over Miles is, like, a few months at best and his main character status. It's so ridiculous .

And they always have to come up with weird solutions for Miles' codename so we don't have two characters running around with the same codename in a series.

Relationship-wise, I think Marvel wrote themselves into a corner and they know it. After Dan tried and failed with Carlie Cooper he seemed to go out of his way to put any relationship on the back burner. Even after Peter hooked up with Bobbi, they were barely written as a couple and broke up pretty quickly. And Lian Tang was also similar where the two got together in between a time skip, most of their relationship was written off-panel, and then after her betrayal, they seemingly broke up off-panel.

So now we're kind of left with Spencer's and now Wells' run opting for the "Star-Crossed Lovers" thing with Peter and MJ.

Don't forget about Mockingbird where he only hooked them up because he thought they looked good together and their relationship was mostly just making out and Bobbi kind of treating him like dirt. They didn't even have an on-panel breakup.

[phonogram12]

They were children.

Yeah, they really were. And the idea of staying with that one person and only that one person since childhood is an antiquated one at best.

[Frontier]

Yeah, they really were. And the idea of staying with that one person and only that one person since childhood is an antiquated one at best.

I think it really just depends on the couple and story.

Of course I also think couples that are dating can come off like they are practically married.

[Kevinroc]

I think they've come to acknowledge there really isn't any other person for Peter but MJ.

[CrimsonEchidna]

What really sticks in my craw is OMD could've been used as an excuse to maybe have Peter and Felicia finally give becoming a couple a serious shot since they both grew up a lot since when they broke up. But nope, they had to also regress Felicia's characterization back to how she was in the 80s.

[Scott Taylor]

Mephisto is the elephant in the room for OMD. I don't care about the marriage, its the concept of OMD and how it undermines Peter's morality to side with the devil to do anything at all.

Get rid of Mephisto, all bricks, and all red pigeons in the Spider-Man mythos and we can call it good.