Are Jim Lee's days numbered?

[Stanlos]

I'm skeptical about the source, but while I do enjoy a number of DC titles, right now, DC really hasn't felt much like DC to me since he has taken an executive role. He really just seemed to take his very Image/'90s sensibilities and imprint them on DC and it just hasn't felt the same since. It would be one thing if he were actively trying to push new characters and kinds of books, but it's just been (arguably) the same old characters with a shinier coat of paint. Like he's trying to change things, but purely on a cosmetic level, not really changing anything at all.

Wow, I had a whole lot more opinions on this than I thought I would.

Didn't he co-sign the Supercuck Justice League 2/2a nonsense with Johns and Snyder? 'Nuff said

[Stanlos]

Source sounds like bullshit.

The guy is one of those comicsgate idiots.

Comicsgate? Is that slang for conspiracy theorist?

[Captain Nostalgia]

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=DQmjdToRNuI

https://www.facebook.com/10000376029...KCRes2H9FKFAl/

This would not be very shocking if true. I'm surprised Lee wasn't sacked with Didio to be honest.

You shouldn't post sources that aren’t legitimate (ie; are not from primary or secondary scholarly sources, the industry itself, or established comic book news media sights like comicbook.com ect)

Youtubers don’t fall into this category, and his source who he admits comes from a fan of the channel who apparently works in the Warner Brothers accounting office, cannot be verified as legitimate even if it turns out to be true. (As a University grad I’m a stickler for this sort of stuff)

That being said....

I have watched some of his videos before, and I would not describe him as a comicgater in the Richard Meyer sense (Though both SJW’s and Comicgater’s like to label anyone they don’t agree with as either an SJW or comicgater)

He’s getting his source from ComicBook Revolution who are getting their numbers from ICv2 (Comic Hub) We’ve had arguments on ICv2 on this forum before, some people don’t think the numbers are legitimate because of the sample size, some people do.

https://www.comicbookrevolution.com/...kings/#top-100

(Basically for me, if your getting published or interviewed in established business magazines like Forbes, than your legitimate) and...

While I actually think this month is an improvement the numbers are still really dire...

In my decades of collecting comics, I only own 1 Wonder Woman comic, so I couldn’t tell you what’s going on in the WW department other than the numbers are a complete train wreck. Poison Ivy shouldn’t be outselling Wonder Woman, though I’ve got to hand it to G Willow Wilson, she’s rockin it.

[Johnny]

Forget Poison Ivy outselling Wonder Woman, this chart shows that Ghost Rider outsold everything DC except for Batman, Dark Crisis and Flashpoint Beyond. And that's despite the 2 month delay right after the second issue. If nothing else, that is the kind of thing that should make DC take a better look at what they've been doing. When Johnny Blaze outsells all your big guns, there's something wrong.

[krazijoe]

Forget Poison Ivy outselling Wonder Woman, this chart shows that Ghost Rider outsold everything DC except for Batman, Dark Crisis and Flashpoint Beyond. And that's despite the 2 month delay right after the second issue. If nothing else, that is the kind of thing that should make DC take a better look at what they've been doing. When Johnny Blaze outsells all your big guns, there's something wrong.

Well, if it was Johnny Blaze and not the other 2,484,402 people that now claim to be Ghost Rider, that would explain why it sold.

[Johnny]

Well, if it was Johnny Blaze and not the other 2,484,402 people that now claim to be Ghost Rider, that would explain why it sold.

Ghost Rider is still a B-list character at best whether it's Blaze or someone else. Next thing you know Nova could start outselling DC too.

[Felipe Silveira]

DC's best writers and artists are working with the Batman franchise. It's not like DC is putting any effort into making the rest sell.

[thwhtGuardian]

Forget Poison Ivy outselling Wonder Woman, this chart shows that Ghost Rider outsold everything DC except for Batman, Dark Crisis and Flashpoint Beyond. And that's despite the 2 month delay right after the second issue. If nothing else, that is the kind of thing that should make DC take a better look at what they've been doing. When Johnny Blaze outsells all your big guns, there's something wrong.

For me, that really makes me question the accuracy of those numbers, sure DC's out put is pretty weak...but that weak? I'm not too sold on that.

[krazijoe]

Ghost Rider is still a B-list character at best whether it's Blaze or someone else. Next thing you know Nova could start outselling DC too.

Which Nova? thse fans fight over that like the Huntress or Robin fans fight over here...

[K7P5V]

Which Nova? thse fans fight over that like the Huntress or Robin fans fight over here...

I know, right?! Both Rich Rider & Frankie Raye are all-time favorites (XD)

[Holt]

People still posting gator shit on here?

[Johnny]

Which Nova? thse fans fight over that like the Huntress or Robin fans fight over here...

With smaller IPs it wouldn't matter which since no specific character has proven to be much of a draw.

But if this whole thing is really "gator shit", then I guess it doesn't matter one way or the other.

[Aahz]

That being said....

I have watched some of his videos before, and I would not describe him as a comicgater in the Richard Meyer sense (Though both SJW’s and Comicgater’s like to label anyone they don’t agree with as either an SJW or comicgater)

He’s getting his source from ComicBook Revolution who are getting their numbers from ICv2 (Comic Hub) We’ve had arguments on ICv2 on this forum before, some people don’t think the numbers are legitimate because of the sample size, some people do.

You can argue ICv2 all you want, but there is simply no alternative at the moment.

When it comes to the channel, at least sofar I think he has mostly stuck cover news from somewhat reliable comic sides.
And while he is a conservative, the guests he has on his channel are not the typical comics gate/fandom menace guys.

[HsssH]

Alternative is https://www.comichron.com/ but it is working slower (now has only April for DC) and doesn't throw DC's comics into Diamond rankings because they are using different distributors so it is not very useful for "hot takes".

I have watched some of his videos before, and I would not describe him as a comicgater in the Richard Meyer sense (Though both SJW’s and Comicgater’s like to label anyone they don’t agree with as either an SJW or comicgater)

If we wanted to be technical then Meyer isn't Comicsgate either, he has many times directly (and indirectly) said that he doesn't want anything to do with them. Couple of months ago he even implied that EVS has mental problems. But we aren't writing scientific paper here and there is no reason to start distinguishing between different shades of the same line of thought.

I'll give Critical Thinking one thing thou, unlike many other "gaters" he at least actually reads comics. Yes, you'd think that people complaining about decline of Marvel/DC comics would actually read them, but lots of them just migrated to comics from other "gate" movements and just use same talking points.

[Captain Nostalgia]

Alternative is https://www.comichron.com/ but it is working slower (now has only April for DC) and doesn't throw DC's comics into Diamond rankings because they are using different distributors so it is not very useful for "hot takes".

If we wanted to be technical then Meyer isn't Comicsgate either, he has many times directly (and indirectly) said that he doesn't want anything to do with them. Couple of months ago he even implied that EVS has mental problems. But we aren't writing scientific paper here and there is no reason to start distinguishing between different shades of the same line of thought.

I'll give Critical Thinking one thing thou, unlike many other "gaters" he at least actually reads comics. Yes, you'd think that people complaining about decline of Marvel/DC comics would actually read them, but lots of them just migrated to comics from other "gate" movements and just use same talking points.

Fair enough. I remember Meyer when he first came out with Diversity & Comics, I found some of his comments a bit foul and off putting (It didn’t help that he sued one of my favourite writers; Mark Waid)

If he’s not a comicgater then we can at least say at best he’s an anti woke activist, but yeah, probably a lighter shade of the same line of thought.

As for Thinking Critical, he’s just a regular guy. Sometimes he harps on a bit too much about sexuality (I get his gripe though with the creative overkill at DC over the last couple of years) his panelists are normal as well, some that have worked for the industry.

Comicgaters and SJW's are pretty much two opposite faces on the same coin. Unfortunately because politics has gone cultural I don't see either vacating the realm of comic books anytime soon.

You can argue ICv2 all you want, but there is simply no alternative at the moment.

When it comes to the channel, at least sofar I think he has mostly stuck cover news from somewhat reliable comic sides.

And while he is a conservative, the guests he has on his channel are not the typical comics gate/fandom menace guys.

Well I think the important thing coming out of this thread is not whether or not Jim Lee will be fired (the source he cites is not legitimate) but the numbers coming from comicbookrevolution.com pulled from the ICv2. (The lagging comichron numbers are usually not any better)

The fact that Aquamen (The leading Aquaman title) is unranked because it didn’t make the top 200, is not only embarrassing, but it’s a damning indictment on how poorly DC comics is being run.