Little Mermaid hate

[HollowSage]

It only falls apart if they are totally adverse to remakes and don't watch them yet offer criticism. But if they do watch them and they have an opinion, then I think the argument is valid.

You can have a bad pizza. Now, it doesn't put you off pizza, but you do say, "damn, I disliked that pizza". You watch a remake and it good? Great. You talk about said remake. You watch a bad remake and you what? You talk about what you dislike about it, don't you?

Look, you've seen all the Miracle on 34th Street, right? (You stated that in one of your earlier posts). Now, did you absolutely love each and every version?

Fine. However this thread is about the Little Mermaid. Once it’s actually out and people have seen it then you can talk about what you didn’t like about it.

[CSTowle]

The problem is not discussing the relative merit of any individual movie in a rational way. The problem is making a broad argument that certain movies are entirely devoid of merit and shouldn't even exist.

My statement that the remake is not for all people is completely valid. If you want a brand new IP with new songs, characters or story, then a remake is not for you. That is not lazy, that is not demeaning, that is a simple fact.

I've seen very little of that opinion out in the wild. Mostly people with fatigue of these live action remakes because they A. love the original animated versions and B. love most Disney stuff historically so they'd rather see Disney allocate resources to developing the next "Toy Story" or at least a different (though probably not too different) version of the Disney Princess tale instead of making a few cosmetic changes to movies they already have seen and likely already own or can stream. As discussed below and in the rest of the thread, that's a valid opinion whether you agree with it or not.

That is such a BOLD thought and idea





I so glad you put it in bold and all caps or I would have never came to the conclusion all on my own.

And It's not that I don't like remakes, I'm just tired of them as there seem to be everywhere theses days. With that, no movie is "for" me there are those I like and those I don't but nothing is done for me and I don't what it to be becasue I probably wont like it. I'm cynical that way.

Key point. Again, movies are for the consumption and review of anyone.

I’m tired of reading about how tired some people are of remakes. So you’re tired. Good to know. Now that you’ve shared with the class how many times do you need to repeat it.

It goes both ways. People can offer criticism of anything (even remakes) providing they do so in a constructive and polite manner. You complain about people raving about "disliking remakes" but what about those who love them? Should only one line of opinion be allowed because it suits your own stance? Come on, you know that's not right.

It's an open forum. Debates can and do occur. The problem is most people just don't know how to debate topics without taking it as a person affront or insult to themselves. It isn't most of the time.

We just agree to disagree and move on.

That's the key. Know that your opinions aren't fact, and neither are anyone else's. Someone disagreeing with something you love (or loving something you hate) isn't invalid and more importantly doesn't invalidate or undermine your love or hate of the product. Our opinions are wholly our own. We don't need to act as if someone disagreeing with us is attacking us, and we also shouldn't be attacking others for having the temerity to disagree with us.

The point of this thread is to criticize invalid criticism of a movie that isn't out yet, based almost entirely on the race change of the title character. There's a valid discussion to be had there. We don't need to conflate any criticism of this movie (when it's out to be validly criticized) or anything else we like as being the same as those criticism.

[Moon Ronin]

So you're "tired" of something you don't even partake in?

Well golly gosh, I'm SICK AND TIRED of football (American and otherwise). I wish it didn't exist anymore. Sports fans should get creative and invent a new mainstream sport. Every time a football game is playing on the TV in a restaurant I'm trying to enjoy a meal in, I get sick to my stomach and can only imagine how it's just a "remake" of a previous game at some point.

See that? That's your argument.

My opinion (mileage may very) is based on my own experiences. Movies are a big part of my life and always have been, I'm in a association that heavily involves me in film. I've seen over 190 movies this year so I here discussions about remakes even though I don't watch them so just becasue I don't chose to partake in them does not mean they are absent form my live. You took a single sentence I wrote online and made a assumption that my view is completely wrong and yours is right.. and to be fair I've never said that anyone's view on this is wrong I just have my own.

And my wife would agree on football, she doesn't partake in any part of the sport but give it about 3 weeks from now and she will be tired of it.
i

[Bunch of Coconuts]

My opinion (mileage may very) is based on my own experiences. Movies are a big part of my life and always have been, I'm in a association that heavily involves me in film. I've seen over 190 movies this year so I here discussions about remakes even though I don't watch them so just becasue I don't chose to partake in them does not mean they are absent form my live. You took a single sentence I wrote online and made a assumption that my view is completely wrong and yours is right.. and to be fair I've never said that anyone's view on this is wrong I just have my own.

And my wife would agree on football, she doesn't partake in any part of the sport but give it about 3 weeks from now and she will be tired of it.
i

Shielding yourself from criticism with "my opinion isn't wrong" is fine and all, but people that complain about remakes existing remind me of the silly people that started boycotting Cracker Barrel for including meatless options in their new menu.

And that's my opinion.

[Nyssane]

Shielding yourself from criticism with "my opinion isn't wrong" is fine and all, but people that complain about remakes existing remind me of the silly people that started boycotting Cracker Barrel for including meatless options in their new menu.

And that's my opinion.

Oh my god, I love that comparison.

[Moon Ronin]

Shielding yourself from criticism with "my opinion isn't wrong" is fine and all, but people that complain about remakes existing remind me of the silly people that started boycotting Cracker Barrel for including meatless options in their new menu.

And that's my opinion.

I say my opinion is "mileage my very" becasue people can take as far as they want. Seems some what to take it on a freakin' cross country road trip.

the thing about an opinion is it doesn't have to be "right" or "wrong" that's the beauty of it. Its all based on your personal fallings. I've never said I'm right, or that some one that disagrees with me is wrong just that this is how I see the subject. I never a made snide comparison because some one thinks differently about a trivial subject. I absolutely enjoy the fact that not every body agrees with me 100% it means what we don't live in a drab monolithic society in which we are forced to conform to a single mind set.

I'm really not understanding the die on the hill absolutism. They don't want to watch re-makes! Must be a witch burn um! " You have an opinion and it's different than mine, Awesome! I'm not gonna try to convince you to agree with me and come over to the dark side, even though we have cookies. I don't believe my feelings in the matter are superior to anyone else and insult those that feel different. It so strange to go from expressing and debating an opinion to defending even having a difference of thought at all. But I guess that is the way the world is. A dichotomy of us and them and the other side has be be wrong becasue reasons....

[Bunch of Coconuts]

The biggest suggestion has actually been to “not watch remakes if you don’t want to.”

It’s the complaints that they exist at all that’s strange.

I don’t go to football threads and complain about football. I just ignore it’s existence to the best of my ability.

[Maestro 216]

The biggest suggestion has actually been to “not watch remakes if you don’t want to.”

It’s the complaints that they exist at all that’s strange.

I don’t go to football threads and complain about football. I just ignore it’s existence to the best of my ability.

The most hateful ones won't accept that. They want to see the actress get hate for "blackwashing" a character they love and proclaim minorities will always result in woke= broke. It is a "war" to them...

[Rincewind]

I've seen very little of that opinion out in the wild. Mostly people with fatigue of these live action remakes because they A. love the original animated versions and B. love most Disney stuff historically so they'd rather see Disney allocate resources to developing the next "Toy Story" or at least a different (though probably not too different) version of the Disney Princess tale instead of making a few cosmetic changes to movies they already have seen and likely already own or can stream. As discussed below and in the rest of the thread, that's a valid opinion whether you agree with it or not..

I disagree. Your opinion still boils down to "Disney should stop making the stuff I don't like and only make stuff I like." No matter how many times you try to phrase it, it still comes off as selfishly wanting a company to cater to your tastes and your tastes alone.

[Username taken]

Honestly, I think the whole "I don't want remakes" is a distraction from why Little Mermaid is actually getting as much hate as it is from some quarters. I don't watch Disney remakes but that won't make me go online and use hateful language against it and worse still try and justify why others might be doing so. As someone said, it sounds like the "Disney is making me racist" argument.

I'm not saying that everyone that has a problem with the Little Mermaid remake is racist but we need to be careful to not provide cover for racist arguments.

Also, the argument that Disney isn't making new IPs is bunk. It's nonsense. They've released TONs of new IPs from Onward to Coco to Encanto to Soul and the list goes on and on. How many studios are actually creating as many brand-new IPs as Disney is? One can make the argument that it's because of the Pixar merger but the point still stands. What's genuinely encouraging about all this is the diversity in these projects on-screen and behind these projects. Strange World is coming soon and it features a black gay character as one of the leads and is voiced by a gay, black actor in real-life. For me (and most right-thinking people), this is a good thing for the children (the target audience) because they now see themselves in their entertainment.

There's a reason why conservatives, right-wingers, and now hardcore racists are united in attacking Disney. This is why they are being attacked as "woke". It's not because they are a big corporation, it's because they have dared to feature diversity in their productions (and in their theme parks their main source of business). When you have folks like these attack you, you know you are doing something right.

Regarding the whole "Disney is weaponizing race", I believe Disney has race-bent the lead of a massive, huge, whopping total of one (1) of their existing IPs in live-action (if I'm wrong, I stand to be corrected). This isn't something they've been doing at all (except if you want to count the genie in Aladdin which would be a stretch). Basically, the harsh criticism of the Little Mermaid remake really comes down to anti-black racism. Not just "general bigotry" but targeted anti-black racism. Most people are hesitant to call out folks' racism but this is a clear-cut of racism fueling people's anger.

I said this earlier but a lot of people need to unlearn what they have learned and start to see beyond folk's skin color. Halle Bailey is already an accomplished singer and was relatively well-known even before the Little Mermaid teaser, the director picked her for the role because of her talent, there aren't too many people that have the sort of voice she has.

Just my two cents.

[Jokerz79]

It only falls apart if they are totally adverse to remakes and don't watch them yet offer criticism. But if they do watch them and they have an opinion, then I think the argument is valid.

You can have a bad pizza. Now, it doesn't put you off pizza, but you do say, "damn, I disliked that pizza". You watch a remake and it good? Great. You talk about said remake. You watch a bad remake and you what? You talk about what you dislike about it, don't you?

Look, you've seen all the Miracle on 34th Street, right? (You stated that in one of your earlier posts). Now, did you absolutely love each and every version?

I've seen 4 the original, one of the 50's ones that I watched on Youtube out of curiosity because it had MacDonald Carey in it who played Tom Horton on Days, the 70's tv one which was on tv a lot when I was a kid, and the 94 big screen remake when it was released. They're all fine but the same story and I prefer the original in its black and one format so that's what I watch every Christmas. That's my point no one is forcing me to watch the others so why care?

Remakes don't bother me because if good I have a new film to enjoy if bad or meh, I have the original. What bothers me something like the SW Special Editions. I don't get the hate for Sequels and Prequels, and I dislike the Prequels and TLJ and think TFA and TROS are ok nothing special. But I don't have to watch them while the Special Editions replaced something I loved. Which ironically Lucas fought against colorizing films and yet I can still watch the Black and White Miracle on 34 Street but can't get a good version of the original versions of the original Trilogy on Blu-Ray or DVD because of him.

[Moon Ronin]

I disagree. Your opinion still boils down to "Disney should stop making the stuff I don't like and only make stuff I like." No matter how many times you try to phrase it, it still comes off as selfishly wanting a company to cater to your tastes and your tastes alone.

Disney can keep making what ever they want, they're a business and wouldn't do something unless there was some kind of market for it. No company that wants to be widely successful should cater to anyone it would be a horrible marketing strategy.

Honestly, I think the whole "I don't want remakes" is a distraction from why Little Mermaid is actually getting as much hate as it is from some quarters. I don't watch Disney remakes but that won't make me go online and use hateful language against it and worse still try and justify why others might be doing so. As someone said, it sounds like the "Disney is making me racist" argument.

I'm not saying that everyone that has a problem with the Little Mermaid remake is racist but we need to be careful to not provide cover for racist arguments.

They do it for clicks, likes, views, shares, retweets, what have you. These are people that see validity by people responding to them. I see way more people responding to people making racist statements than people making those statements. Which is awesome but its yelling at a little brick wall except it is making the wall feel important for some reason. A group of youtubers/podcasters cry foul in a game that doesn't even have a rule book are doing so because it gives them attrition. When they see headlines like "Little Mermaid Live-Action Trailer Flooded With Racist YouTube Comments, Downvotes" it's a feeling of accomplishment and does absolutely nothing to discourage such behavior. Not saying that it needs to 100% ignored but the constant spotlight on them is just putting wind in their sails.

It also goes both ways, studios need to stop using racist arguments as cover from real criticism. I can not like the character Rose from TLJ for legitimate reasons.

[Moon Ronin]

I've seen 4 the original, one of the 50's ones that I watched on Youtube out of curiosity because it had MacDonald Carey in it who played Tom Horton on Days, the 70's tv one which was on tv a lot when I was a kid, and the 94 big screen remake when it was released. They're all fine but the same story and I prefer the original in its black and one format so that's what I watch every Christmas. That's my point no one is forcing me to watch the others so why care?

Remakes don't bother me because if good I have a new film to enjoy if bad or meh, I have the original. What bothers me something like the SW Special Editions. I don't get the hate for Sequels and Prequels, and I dislike the Prequels and TLJ and think TFA and TROS are ok nothing special. But I don't have to watch them while the Special Editions replaced something I loved. Which ironically Lucas fought against colorizing films and yet I can still watch the Black and White Miracle on 34 Street but can't get a good version of the original versions of the original Trilogy on Blu-Ray or DVD because of him.

Lucas's argument was that he was changing his own films, such as a painter going back to a painting to do touch ups later. Where as colorizing films was an outside group trying to change an era for film history to modernize it to fit the standard that we have for film today.

[Surf]

the harsh criticism of the Little Mermaid remake really comes down to anti-black racism. Not just "general bigotry" but targeted anti-black racism.

1,000%. Lol, and that's 4 cents btw bruh.

I've been saying- if the drops in the bucket we're now seeing as far as more Black faces in front of the camera is so disturbing, dust off any of the history of Hollywood's first damn near 80 years, across EVERY MAJOR studio, where the few faces of color are either demeaned or played to part by white actors or ignored all together. Have the freak at it, plenty out there and will be forever.

Mind you, this says NOTHING in regards to the amount of those Black folks behind the scenes, frozen out of the industry by decades of Hollywood unions who refused their entrances into the labor force over that same amount of time. Mirroring so many other industries as it pertains to labor in this country.

This project would have gotten a spin or two on the streams in my house cause I got littles anyway. NOW, it's a thing and I'M gonna have to sit through it on the strength, for the algorithms and for the hate, on general principle. This will be my first real sit down with anything Little Mermaid so all this promotion helped I guess.

[HollowSage]

Disney can keep making what ever they want, they're a business and wouldn't do something unless there was some kind of market for it. No company that wants to be widely successful should cater to anyone it would be a horrible marketing strategy.



They do it for clicks, likes, views, shares, retweets, what have you. These are people that see validity by people responding to them. I see way more people responding to people making racist statements than people making those statements. Which is awesome but its yelling at a little brick wall except it is making the wall feel important for some reason. A group of youtubers/podcasters cry foul in a game that doesn't even have a rule book are doing so because it gives them attrition. When they see headlines like "Little Mermaid Live-Action Trailer Flooded With Racist YouTube Comments, Downvotes" it's a feeling of accomplishment and does absolutely nothing to discourage such behavior. Not saying that it needs to 100% ignored but the constant spotlight on them is just putting wind in their sails.

It also goes both ways, studios need to stop using racist arguments as cover from real criticism. I can not like the character Rose from TLJ for legitimate reasons.

This is a one way street. Studios can and should address and stand up for their actors/directors/writers when they come under attack from racism.

If your legitimate criticisms are being overlooked and drowned out by all the noise from the racists then your problem is with the racists. They are the ones creating an environment where it’s hard to have a civil discussion and trying to downplay their impact isn’t helpful. The spotlight is necessary otherwise people can have a tendency to forget and then act like it doesn’t exist at all and that doesn’t make it magically go away.