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  1. #1
    Mighty Member Kuro's Avatar
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    Default Supreme Kai runs the Cell Gauntlet

    Supreme Kai decides to prove his status as the god of the universe 7 and takes on the most powerful villain up to point where he arrived on Earth. Cell

    He starts from Imperfect and gradually moves up, recovering all of his lost stamina after each fight.

    How does he do?

  2. #2
    Reborn Samurai Len Ikari145's Avatar
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    He gets stomped by Perfect Cell. Shin has precious few feats on his own and is mostly bolstered by character statements. *If* we go by statements, he's several times stronger than Final Form Frieza (pre-revival) and more powerful than Post-Kami Fusion Piccolo (who stated their power levels were "dimensions apart"). Shin was also extremely cautious around Dabura, whose suppressed power level was around Perfect Cell's according to Goku (Goku later reassesses his initial estimation after watching Gohan and Dabura fight, realizing that Dabura is actually stronger than Super Perfect Cell). So, he probably wins against Imperfect Cell, may just eke a win against Second form, but gets utterly trounced by Perfect and Super Perfect.
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  3. #3

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    Quote Originally Posted by Len Ikari145 View Post
    He gets stomped by Perfect Cell. Shin has precious few feats on his own and is mostly bolstered by character statements. *If* we go by statements, he's several times stronger than Final Form Frieza (pre-revival) and more powerful than Post-Kami Fusion Piccolo (who stated their power levels were "dimensions apart"). Shin was also extremely cautious around Dabura, whose suppressed power level was around Perfect Cell's according to Goku (Goku later reassesses his initial estimation after watching Gohan and Dabura fight, realizing that Dabura is actually stronger than Super Perfect Cell). So, he probably wins against Imperfect Cell, may just eke a win against Second form, but gets utterly trounced by Perfect and Super Perfect.
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  4. #4
    Pro Mutant Anarchist's Avatar
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    Goku later reassesses his initial estimation after watching Gohan and Dabura fight, realizing that Dabura is actually stronger than Super Perfect Cell
    Uh, what? I don't remember that at all. Goku only ever says that he gauges Dabura to be around Cell's level (which logically has to be Perfect Cell, since he didn't meet Super Perfect Cell face to face).

  5. #5
    Reborn Samurai Len Ikari145's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Anarchist View Post
    Uh, what? I don't remember that at all. Goku only ever says that he gauges Dabura to be around Cell's level (which logically has to be Perfect Cell, since he didn't meet Super Perfect Cell face to face).
    It's slightly ambiguous but by the context, I would assume he was talking about SP Cell since he was technically present when Gohan was having his Kamehameha duel with Cell since they were telepathically linked via King Kai (even stating that he knew Gohan was holding back his power so he wouldn't cause damage to the Earth), and it's well established at that point in the story that he can sense power levels across dimensions.

    As for his reassessment of Dabura, while he doesn't outright state that he's stronger than Cell, he does say that he's more powerful than he expected him to be.

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    Last edited by Len Ikari145; 09-18-2022 at 05:48 AM.
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  6. #6
    Friendship's Shockwave BitVyper's Avatar
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    I think that's a pretty ambiguous statement that could be referencing, for instance, how much weaker the other guards were. Dabura definitely shows he's at Perfect Cell's level, and regardless of how aware he was of SP Cell's strength, Goku actually *fought* an extended battle with the vanilla version, so the ambiguity can go both ways. I'd be willing to accept that he's in SP Cell's ballpark, but I think taking him further than that on ambiguous statements alone is too much. His fight with Gohan is too hard to judge beyond that level because Gohan's weaker and HE'S trying to draw it out.
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  7. #7

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    I think him being able to telekinetically restrain SS2 Gohan -- albeit with great difficulty -- means he's well above base Cell or Imperfect. But he can't be too much stronger -- Gohan's SS2 was stronger when he was a child; Kid Gohan would have annihilated Dabura, who Kaioshin was badly surprised by him having fallen under Babidi's control.

    he's not weak, but he's not on the level or Goku, Vegeta, or Gohan as a kid. i suppose having to watch either a quarter of the universe, or the whole thing, means your attention to one planet can't be high.
    Last edited by penguin-in-leather-jacket; 09-18-2022 at 10:38 AM.

  8. #8
    Legendary God of Pirates Nik Hasta's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BitVyper View Post
    His fight with Gohan is too hard to judge beyond that level because Gohan's weaker and HE'S trying to draw it out.
    I thought the gimmick for the resurrection of Buu was that any damage done to the good guys was converted into fuel for Buu?

    Dabura wouldn't be trying to draw it out, he'd be trying to do damage on him. He tried to cut him in half with a sword and everything.

  9. #9
    Friendship's Shockwave BitVyper's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nik Hasta View Post
    I thought the gimmick for the resurrection of Buu was that any damage done to the good guys was converted into fuel for Buu?

    Dabura wouldn't be trying to draw it out, he'd be trying to do damage on him. He tried to cut him in half with a sword and everything.
    It's been forever, so I could be way off, but what I recall is that Babidi specifically wanted the fights to be drawn out because the ki released by the fighters (maybe just good guys? I donno) was contributing to Buu's rez. Which makes sense, since the whole thing started with him ganking a bunch of ki from Gohan. I... think he was still pulling energy from his own fighters? It's a little awkward because it completely wasn't working out for him anyway until he mindganked Vegeta. I mean Dabura fighting Gohan was, except Vegeta was getting impatient and about to renegade interrupt that whole fight.

    But it's the same argument either way: Either Dabura was fighting to hurt-not-incapacitate, or Dabura was fighting to get Gohan to fight more harder. In either case, it just adds another asterisk to our interpretation of that fight. I'd say I believe Dabura when he tells Babidi that he wasn't especially pressed, but it's not great for placing him in context with Cell.
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  10. #10
    Friendship's Shockwave BitVyper's Avatar
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    So I paged through the comic, and they kind of switch up saying one or the other. "Damage becomes energy" is definitely a theme, but it seems more like damage making them use more energy and thereby getting the energy absorbed by Babidi's ship. The chump who looks like Frieza is the first to refer to the damage-converted-to-energy concept, followed by Vegeta's comments suggesting getting hurt means they release energy, which fits, then when Goku fights Yakon, Babidi pointedly complains that Yakon eating his energy means it isn't going to Buu.

    So the concept is a bit ambiguous, but either way seems to suggest that just killing one of them outright wouldn't be enough. As far as Dabura using his sword goes, I mean he slashes at Gohan in the same way that Trunks tried to behead Goku. It's just martial arts drama, that's just how you say hello.

    Looking at the whole fight is definitely making me feel more like Dabura's around Perfect Cell's level and nothing more, at any rate.

    Edit: Buu then reaches full power pretty much the instant Vegeta and Goku transform and have their very first exchange, so I dunno what to take away from that. Gohan says big power means big damage, but like they've barely started. I think some detail is maybe being lost in localization, because it sounds more like it has to do with the ki they use to protect themselves or compensate for damage or whatever is getting sucked up.

    Edit: Man I totally forgot Babidi's barrier survives an attack that leaves Vegeta barely able to stand. Dude's magical chops are for real.
    Last edited by BitVyper; 09-20-2022 at 07:40 PM.
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