Page 2 of 3 FirstFirst 123 LastLast
Results 16 to 30 of 35
  1. #16
    Astonishing Member Dataweaver's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2014
    Posts
    3,899

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by MajorHoy View Post
    But then there's the issue of when she was born to Bruce and Selina if the main Earth 0 versions are not all that much older than Helena is . . .
    To clarify, I am not saying that Helena is the daughter of the earth zero Batman and catwoman. I'm saying that she is the daughter of the now destroyed Earth 2 Batman and catwoman; she is a foreigner to Earth zero, the same way Power Girl is.
    Rogue wears rouge.
    Angel knows all the angles.

  2. #17
    Invincible Member MajorHoy's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Posts
    27,422

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Dataweaver View Post
    To clarify, I am not saying that Helena is the daughter of the earth zero Batman and catwoman. I'm saying that she is the daughter of the now destroyed Earth 2 Batman and catwoman; she is a foreigner to Earth zero, the same way Power Girl is.
    Or else . . . she could be the granddaughter of Arion of Atlantis?

  3. #18
    Astonishing Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2018
    Posts
    2,948

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by MajorHoy View Post
    Or else . . . she could be the granddaughter of Arion of Atlantis?
    ROFL - Please no.

  4. #19
    Astonishing Member Dataweaver's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2014
    Posts
    3,899

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by MajorHoy View Post
    Or else . . . she could be the granddaughter of Arion of Atlantis?
    Power Girl hasn't been that since Infinite Crisis; and restoring her status as “the cousin of the original Earth-2 Superman” while downplaying/ignoring the “granddaughter of Arion” thing was Johns' doing. He's the last person I'd expect to give Helena Wayne's backstory a Bertinelli-like twist.

    (And speaking of Bertinelli: while I'm off the opinion that she's different enough from Wayne that the two could easily coexist, I suspect that if we ever see Bertinelli again, it won't be Johns' doing.)
    Rogue wears rouge.
    Angel knows all the angles.

  5. #20
    Astonishing Member
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Posts
    3,314

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Dataweaver View Post
    I'll be surprised if it isn't Earth 0.

    Note that if it's revealed that Helena is also from Earth-0 (which won't surprise me), it will be the first time in DC history that that will be the case. When she first appeared in 1977, the Golden Age had long since splintered off from the Metaverse; and when Earth 2 was reintegrated into the Metaverse at the end of the Crisis, Helena was explicitly excluded from that. All subsequent appearances of Helena have either been from other worlds (like the JSI Earth 2 or the New 52 Earth 2) or from possible futures (like the future timeline suggested in Batman/Catwoman).

    I suspect that Helena will be like Power Girl: they'll take the pre-Crisis Huntress from Earth 2, complete with her memories of the original Earth 2, and either skip over her death in the Crisis or use the Flashpoint Beyond to resurrect her the same way Thomas Wayne found himself alive and well on that world at the start of the story, despite having recently died in Infinite Frontier.

    But, like Power Girl, it will only be memories: she won't live on Earth 2. Likewise with the JSA as a whole: they'll retain their position as Earth 0's “generation 1”, even if they also retain their full memories of all of their iterations (which they may or may not; but if anyone manages to hang on to the Metaverse memories unlocked in Death Metal, it'll be the JSA). They'll be based on Earth 0, not Earth 2.
    Yeah, I think you're spot on!

  6. #21
    Mighty Member
    Join Date
    May 2021
    Posts
    1,103

    Default

    Have to wait and see what Earth Huntress is from.

  7. #22
    Astonishing Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2014
    Posts
    2,817

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Dataweaver View Post
    Power Girl hasn't been that since Infinite Crisis; and restoring her status as “the cousin of the original Earth-2 Superman” while downplaying/ignoring the “granddaughter of Arion” thing was Johns' doing. He's the last person I'd expect to give Helena Wayne's backstory a Bertinelli-like twist.

    (And speaking of Bertinelli: while I'm off the opinion that she's different enough from Wayne that the two could easily coexist, I suspect that if we ever see Bertinelli again, it won't be Johns' doing.)
    Is Helena Bertinelli...gone?

  8. #23
    Astonishing Member Dataweaver's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2014
    Posts
    3,899

    Default

    I hope not. She is distinct enough from Helena Wayne to hold her own. But the last time that they brought a Helena Wayne back, they did so by claiming that Helena Bertinelli was merely an alias that she had been using. See New 52.

    And again, I'm saying that I think that if we see Bertinelli again it won't be Johns' doing. I think that at this moment, she's in Limbo — not in publication anywhere, out of sight and out of mind. Not formally erased; just not someone that Johns is likely to use any time soon.
    Last edited by Dataweaver; 09-22-2022 at 08:21 PM.
    Rogue wears rouge.
    Angel knows all the angles.

  9. #24
    Astonishing Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2014
    Posts
    2,817

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Dataweaver View Post
    I hope not. She is distinct enough from Helena Wayne to hold her own. But the last time that they brought a Helena Wayne back, they did so by claiming that Helena Bertinelli was merely an alias that she had been using. See New 52.
    No, shan't. Flashturd and N52 are a blight from which the DCU may never truly recover. I would not breathe further life into it for fear of prolonging its putrid stench.

  10. #25
    Astonishing Member Dataweaver's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2014
    Posts
    3,899

    Default

    Flashpoint is distinct from new 52, right up until the end. From what I understand, the original ending would have restored the original timeline, not set up the new 52. As well, Flashpoint is the setup for Flashpoint Beyond, which is the setup for new golden age, which is the setup for Justice Society of america.
    Rogue wears rouge.
    Angel knows all the angles.

  11. #26
    Mighty Member
    Join Date
    May 2021
    Posts
    1,103

    Default

    Helena Bertinelli isn't erased, she showed up some books months ago.

  12. #27
    Astonishing Member Dataweaver's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2014
    Posts
    3,899

    Default

    I'm sure you're right about Bertinelli not being erased. But we're at a point right now where everything is in flux; one what happened a couple months ago doesn't mean much.
    Rogue wears rouge.
    Angel knows all the angles.

  13. #28
    Mighty Member
    Join Date
    May 2021
    Posts
    1,103

    Default

    Depends on Flashpoint Beyond.

    But Dark Crisis has no reboot in store, only restoring the infinite multiverse.

  14. #29
    Astonishing Member Dataweaver's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2014
    Posts
    3,899

    Default

    Correct. But as you say, it depends on Flashpoint beyond. And more to the point, we know that Helena Wayne will be arriving with a warning just a moment too late; and that timeline shenanigans will ensue. And further, but this will be the result, indirectly at least, of the Flashpoint Beyond.

    Again, I don't expect him to erase Bertinelli; but it's still a little too early to absolutely rule it out. I just don't think it's his style.
    Rogue wears rouge.
    Angel knows all the angles.

  15. #30

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Dataweaver View Post
    Correct. But as you say, it depends on Flashpoint beyond. And more to the point, we know that Helena Wayne will be arriving with a warning just a moment too late; and that timeline shenanigans will ensue. And further, but this will be the result, indirectly at least, of the Flashpoint Beyond.

    Again, I don't expect him to erase Bertinelli; but it's still a little too early to absolutely rule it out. I just don't think it's his style.
    It doesn't take much to fall into deeper consuming speculation. Now, Bertinelli and Wayne are two different characters in more than just being two people. They have differing styles and personalities as well as backgrounds. No reason Bertinelli needs to go anywhere. Name change, maybe, but I'm cool with two Huntresses. Where the confusion comes into things is the nu52 Helena Wayne who hung with Damian. I suspect many fans would just like to see the nu52 Earth 2 cast fade into obscurity. There are questions we're asking that may not be answered and those are going to keep on our minds. Yes, I know us. Me, I have a tough time understanding why Batman isn't concerned with multiple interdimensional daughters of his popping up.

    I guess our best option is to wait until JSA actually comes out and we see what the situation is.

    Have Bertinelli and Wayne ever met?
    Why yes, I do enjoy hearing myself talk. it is very kind of you to notice>

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •