Ruins of Khazan - A Rumbles RPG - Sign Up/System Test

[Sharpandpointies]

Curious about Trevor, myself.

No time today - running a tabletop game atm - but will check in tomorrow and look at all of this. ^_^

[Postmania]

On another note, quick note on the character ideas that I had at some point if Jane went which could have interacted with the setting in some cool ways.

One was a a cultist/paladin to a Spider Goddess who was more morally ambiguous due to her ties to the Goddess. She would be generally seeking to preserve life and act in public good, but ultimately aware that her end goal acted in same way a Spider wraps up its prey to keep for later. Of course, this would also be obfuscated by the Spider Goddess herself, who's nature would alternate between stories of devouring and protection, but always in the web of her own design.

The character would wake up with little memory of what had just happened, except for recalling that she was part of a ritual with her closest associates, and now they are gone, and the Godddess she had a direct line to, to the point of getting mental instruction from, would be silent. One of her goals prior to getting to Khazan would be to find the rest of the cult, with which she could no longer find any remaining members, and whose presence as a whole seemed to have mysteriously vanished from the scope of anybody's knowledge, in both memory and physical evidence. Since the cult would be fairly prominently known in the character's world, this would be rather distressing. The little twist would be that through processes unknown the Spider Goddess had folded herself and the entire cult into a cocoon of sorts which was inside the paladin for unknown reasons.

Honestly pretty similar to Jane in some ways now that I think about it. Kind of a dark character but bound to follow the group and do stuff/be prosocial with her interests of finding her people/god.

Could've been interesting to deal with the god stealing aspects of the setting since hers is safely tucked away (and she'd come to greater understanding of that as the story went on). Also would have been a case where the goddess would be trying to be "rebirthed/hatched" from her as the "coccoon" as time went on and she'd have to decide how to respond to a potential threat to her life in the process of this rebirth. She'd have been quick-witted, outwardly friendly/courteous/nice/good, but ultimately reserved, and with a sense of having designs on everyone/everything and a darkness about her as that is her prerogative as a follower of the Spider Goddess.

She'd also have been an attempt to integrate more physical attacks with the CHR/Mind system. There'd be some traditional paladin stuff but it'd have been a lot of spider theming/webs/fangs/devouring instead of light and such. I don't know if this would have been really possible since everytime I looked at multi-classing stuff it just seemed kind of subpar compared to a dedicated build like Jane or Van, so I could have ended up with Nemo's situation there. It would likely have been more difficult to play her as both a fighter in system and probably as a character in terms of giving off the right aura about her, but it would have been fun to try I think! Oh, and she's almost entirely inspired initially by this illustration I saw online.

The other character wasn't really done yet in concept but was basically an urban fantasy detective sort with blood magic powers and crucially, no gods. The themes with her would have been that she's actually pretty against power and organized magic as a thing and would have been pretty anti-deity as well, which would have interesting implications in this new verse of gods and goddesses and such.

It's funny that both these characters kind of intrigue me now with what I know about the setting because they were both kind of reactions to the current characters in game (and Jane) due to how much god focus everyone has, so I wanted to play with those concepts as I thought of them.

[Sharpandpointies]

Thanks. It's been a rough ride mentally for the past few years, so that doesn't help, either..

Really hope things improve for you soon.

And in terms about your Jane point, I've mentioned it before I think but I'm glad I was also able to take a character like that and come up with a good reason for her to stick with the group (and also, in the case of the potential Trevor split, try to keep the group together). The conditioning of the Facility put her in a position to at least ostensibly be prosocial even though in a totally unhealthy cultlike way, which isn't love, but in a situation like this Jane could have grown to *actually* love the group.

Would have been fun to play out, but alas

Truth. I was kind of impressed by the way you did that. Jane certainly had the potential to be a Moody Loner, but you kind of flipped that around - kept to the character rather effectively while still having them join the group, assist willingly, etc. It all made sense and felt right. Good stuff.

One was a a cultist/paladin to a Spider Goddess who was more morally ambiguous due to her ties to the Goddess. She would be generally seeking to preserve life and act in public good, but ultimately aware that her end goal acted in same way a Spider wraps up its prey to keep for later. Of course, this would also be obfuscated by the Spider Goddess herself, who's nature would alternate between stories of devouring and protection, but always in the web of her own design.

Interesting take, neither 'good' nor 'evil', which is often not the case with Spider Gods/Goddesses. Very cool.

The little twist would be that through processes unknown the Spider Goddess had folded herself and the entire cult into a cocoon of sorts which was inside the paladin for unknown reasons.

This is a pretty awesome idea, though I personally think 'nest' is a better word. But completely understand what you're going for, and yeah, MORE good stuff. ^_^

Could've been interesting to deal with the god stealing aspects of the setting since hers is safely tucked away (and she'd come to greater understanding of that as the story went on). Also would have been a case where the goddess would be trying to be "rebirthed/hatched" from her as the "coccoon" as time went on and she'd have to decide how to respond to a potential threat to her life in the process of this rebirth. She'd have been quick-witted, outwardly friendly/courteous/nice/good, but ultimately reserved, and with a sense of having designs on everyone/everything and a darkness about her as that is her prerogative as a follower of the Spider Goddess.

Little less of a team player in a way, but ultimately working with the group because that's what was needed. I like it.

I also like the illustration because, well, frankly put spider-goddess devotees tend to be drawn in a certain style, and this one isn't. ^_^ Nice.

The other character wasn't really done yet in concept but was basically an urban fantasy detective sort with blood magic powers and crucially, no gods. The themes with her would have been that she's actually pretty against power and organized magic as a thing and would have been pretty anti-deity as well, which would have interesting implications in this new verse of gods and goddesses and such.

So far I'm liking the concept. Krys would have liked them as well.

It's funny that both these characters kind of intrigue me now with what I know about the setting because they were both kind of reactions to the current characters in game (and Jane) due to how much god focus everyone has, so I wanted to play with those concepts as I thought of them.

I admit, this isn't the norm for me. I don't normally like characters connected to God-beings except those who are connected in negative fashions. Which is how Original Kris ended up being the only character not actually a god in a group of god-being player characters. ^_^ Man, long discussions about that with Cleric.

Hm. That came out wrong. I can like those characters if they are other people's characters, literary characters, NPC's (mine or others'), etc, just as easily (or not) as I do everything else. Nothing actually against deities in stories, or characters with links to such, or characters who derive their powers from gods, or whatever.

I just don't like PLAYING them. ^_^

[Nik Hasta]

Hmm, what would happen if they succeeded?

If Cassa had made it to the Stellar Nursery, no easy task, it woudl have recalled it's true mission, to propagate and assimilate all life in all realities. It would have fused with the Planetary Creation Matrix and turned itself into a mechnical micro-planet, which would have torn up through the bedrock of Khazan (destroying the Scientific District and messing up a few other questlines) and would have begun attempting to assimilate the city into itself. You'd get new forms of robotic enemies, an infection mechanic (though I hadn't fully sketched this out) and sudden shift for player priorities.

The PCs would then have to travel (sneak/battle/other means) to the core of the micro-planet and take it out (or talk it down) to prevent further destruction. Obviously, the deeper the social link you have with Cassa, the more likely you are to be able to get it to stop or even prevent the quest from occuring in the first place. Cassa was, in some respects, a slightly similar to Trevor insofar as it would be influenced by the actions of the players, reflecting their decisions back at them.

Can agree with that. Also I'm curious about Trevor's sheet now since he never got to do combat (if he has one)

Trevor was created to be, initially at least, a compelte liability in combat. His stats are as follows;

Trevor
Effective MAX: 68
HP 38

STR 10
PRE 5
CHR 12

DUR 10
RES 5
AGI 9

BRA 10
SPD 10
SKI 4

ENR 4
ENR VALUE 40
Latent ENR 30
Mastered ENR 10
STACK 0.20
RAC 1.40
RUM 1
Movement 24
ATK Action(s) 1
Tech Action(s) 1
Range 5

So, from the off, he's worse than a default unlevelled character. My intention was for him to experience growth and level in a different manner to conventional NPC. Depending on what players chose to teach him or what he experienced, he would get small +1s and +2s to certain stats, allowing me to reflect his growing confidence and strength as the game went on. You could also have buffed him with items and gear that you might have found as the game went on.

[Nik Hasta]

I admit, this isn't the norm for me. I don't normally like characters connected to God-beings except those who are connected in negative fashions. Which is how Original Kris ended up being the only character not actually a god in a group of god-being player characters. ^_^

Technically not the only one. My second character, Georgina, had godlike powers but wasn't actually connected to or a reincarnation of a diety. She thought she was but she was actually just an extremely Christian woman undergoing a prolonged delusional psychological break in the wake of losing her family. The "divine personality" she felt within herself was just an attempt to distance herself from her own sense of agency and autonomy.

[Nik Hasta]

We did reference the Guardian of the Gate in the campaign and I mentioned it again in the breakdown of the proposed structure of game. This is, because I'm a big Souls nerd, another instance of me riffing on a Souls character. In this case, it's Lady Maria of the Astral Clocktower. My design notes and her character sheet are as follows:

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Gate Guardian Rosa (4th Level):
It’s Maria of the Astral Clocktower. A doll automaton in the style of the Doll from Bloodborne. A beleaguered and weary guardian of a gate in Khazan. First encounter smoking a pipe under an umbrella in a rainstorm.

Weapon
Crimson Fang the Blood Drinking Katana - (+20 DMG) Drains 5 HP from the user per turn / Inflicts Lacerate on DMG.

Traits
Rally Mechanic - (+10 RES / +10 PRE) After taking damage, Rosa will gain the ability to recover 50% of any damage she inflicts on her next turn. If the target is under the influence of any Bleed effects when attacked, this will be raised to 75% of any damage.

Burning Blood - (+10 RES / +10 ENR) When her health drops below 30%, Rosa’s blood will ignite and will grant her a flat +10 additional DMG on any attacks that are met with any response except Perfect Dodge. Her melee range will also extend by 10 feet and she will be able to hit up to a maximum of three targets (depending on grouping) with a single attack.

Mechanical Body - (+10 DUR / +10 STR) Rosa is immune to Bleed effects.

Gate Guardian - (+15 SKI / +5 AGI) If any opponent tries to move through the gate, Rosa will automatically burn a RAC point and employ an Epic Technique (+60 STR Effect: Charge>Fling>Crater) to send them back.

Affinity Allocation
Free: 14 (-1, -4, -2, -2, -4, -1)
Body: 3 Honed, 2 Epic
Spirit: 2 Honed, 1 Epic
Mind: 1 Honed, 1 Epic


Natural Slots
Blood Stinger - Honed Body Ranged (+30 STR) Stinger-style attack that shoots bullet of blood. Inflicts Shove into Crater - 25 ENR

Iai Draw Strike - Honed Body AoE (+20 STR) Large sweeping attack that knocks opponents away. Inflicts Sweep into Fling - 25 ENR

A Corpse Is Best Left Undisturbed - Honed Body (+40 STR) Rosa grabs an enemy and hurls them away from her. Inflicts Grapple into Fling - 25 ENR

Beast Slayer Combo - Epic Body (+60 STR) The peak of Rosa’s swordplay, this combo will spell the end of anyone it hits. Inflicts Rush Attack - 75 ENR

Flashing Cut - Honed Spirit Ranged (+30 PRE) Rosa performs a ranged Iai style Judgement Cut that slices deeply into her foe and then they are struck by the air pressure vacuum from the speed of the attack. Inflicts Lacerate and Follow-Through. - 25 ENR

Pommel Counter - Honed Spirit Counter (+40 PRE) Rosa performs complex defences that leave the opponent dizzied and weakened. Inflicts Dizzy and Disrupt. - 25 ENR

Hunter’s Cunning Strikes - Epic Spirit (+60 PRE) Rosa overpowers her opponent with repeated attacks that leave them with no room to breath. Inflicts Flurry. - 75 ENR

Killing Aura - Honed Mind AoE (+30 CHR) Rosa releases her killing intent, refined over centuries, to intimidate nearby enemies. Inflicts Fear - Frighten. - 25 ENR

Limiter Released - Epic Mind (+60 CHR) When pushed into a corner, Rosa will release her limiters and focus on doing as much damage as possible. Inflicts Berserk - Frenzy on Rosa. - 75 ENR

Free Slots
Doll Engine - Mundane Spirit (+20 PRE) Rosa cycles her main engine and recovers Mastered ENR - 10 ENR

Disarming Strike - Epic Spirit AoE (+40 PRE) Rosa strikes with such speed and precision that she damages her opponents’ ability to strike back. Inflicts Enfeeble - Break. - 75 ENR

Perfect Movement - Honed Body Dodge (+40 SPD) Rosa moves perfectly out of the way of an attack and enters a defensive stance. Inflicts Fired Up on Rosa. - 25 ENR

Neutral Rally - Honed Body (+40 AGI) Rosa focuses on defences and wills her stone flesh to close. Inflicts Regeneration on Rosa. - 25 ENR

Devastating Cut - Epic Body (+60 STR) Rosa takes her katana in both hands and cuts with the intention to bisect her opponent in twain. Inflicts Debilitating Strike. - 75 ENR

Countering Stance - Mundane Spirit (+20 SKI) Rosa prepares to counter all attacks thrown at her. Inflicts Enlightenment - Awareness on Rosa. - 10 ENR

Rosa
Effective MAX: 335
HP 205

STR 50
PRE 50
CHR 40

DUR 40
RES 67
AGI 60

BRA 33
SPD 71
SKI 58

ENR 48
ENR VALUE 480
Latent ENR 130
Mastered ENR 350
STACK 7.00
RAC 4.08
RUM 0
Movement 172
ATK Action(s) 2
Tech Action(s) 2
Range 175

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So designing Rosa was both a lot of fun but also quite instructive in terms of she was the first NPC I built with "this will be a boss fight," in mind. She's really quite scary as a build but has some weaknesses here and there. Further to that, in-game I was going to have her agree to a rule of clemency with any PCs who opted to try and fight her. To wit; if they surrender, disengage Stack and throw down any weaponry, she will cease targetting them and they would be permitted to retreat without drawing further aggro from her.

She would also fight in such a way that she would focus on defending the gate and duelling opponents evenly rather than playing super optimal. Essentially, I was loosely working on the idea of enemy AI insofar "this enemy is dangerous but I have to pilot her a bit badly to make the fight fairer,"

Bosses video games have tells and patterns, Rosa would be the same, she would have patterns and her behaviour would be manipuable.

[Sharkerbob]

A lot of cool stuff, guys! : )

[Postmania]

Interesting take, neither 'good' nor 'evil', which is often not the case with Spider Gods/Goddesses. Very cool.

Yeah I wanted to make a character that kind of rode the balance. The intent was to make a character that was spider and kind of unsettling (not so much on the Jane "this is literally inhuman" level but on a personality level), but should never be in a position that would be outright rejected, and would also do good things/seem like a good person to have around at least part of the time in spite of any misgivings. Would have been a bit tough probably. But making Jane was difficult too at first. It helped with Jane when I was able to make the sort of "triangle of desires" thing I might have mentioned before where the defining traits as I saw for her initially were the learning AI/sheltered childlike side, the confident, proud, independent assassin side, and the robotic side. Whenever I ran into a spot that I wasn't sure how to have Jane proceed on I tried to reference that and figure out what side of Jane to draw out. As the plot went on I found I needed that less, partially because she was starting to become a more natural blend of the sides, which I thought was a good sign.

I imagine if I made something like that for this character I could have gotten a handle on her eventually.

Incidentally there was technically a fourth aspect of Jane which was the more tied to death, and death god side which didn't get explored in story too much. It was the side that would have been best shown in her System Seance skill which is like a traditional sort of seance thing but with more tech. This side was more mystical, ritualistic, sign-seing, most likely to have perturbed Trevor side. Could have been fun

This is a pretty awesome idea, though I personally think 'nest' is a better word. But completely understand what you're going for, and yeah, MORE good stuff. ^_^

Little less of a team player in a way, but ultimately working with the group because that's what was needed. I like it.

I also like the illustration because, well, frankly put spider-goddess devotees tend to be drawn in a certain style, and this one isn't. ^_^ Nice.

Yeah it would have been fun to play as a contrast to Jane if she ever bought the farm.

Where Jane's whole thing is something like "The past is dead, Nekro killed it and I can't go back. Now I have to find my own way and prioritize myself", this character would have been more "The past is a missing piece that I need to find. I have a responsibility to save my god and my people."

With Jane she's seeking a way to break bonds that were placed on her since before she could choose, with the Spider Paladin she's embraced bonds as strength and seeks to potentially bond other things together under or adjacent to her god as a continuation of a path she'd chosen herself for what she sees as good reasons. So the group would be part of this, her overall mission as spreading her religion/doing their tasks/gaining influence would be part of this.

The questions of: are those good reasons, are they good in practice, does she believe everything was worthwhile, does she think the orders she got were correct, does she think things are as good for her people and the world as advertised, are all things that she would be able to say "yes, a fair amount of the time" and stand and defend. But not all the time, and this would play into the ambiguity possible with the character as well.

Y'know come to think of it, like with Jane, the more I talk/think about this character the more I'm liking her. I have almost no setting information for her but maybe I'll try to write her in some fashion sooner or later.

And agree on the style point lol

So far I'm liking the concept. Krys would have liked them as well.

Yeah I think the main driving force for this character was both the antagonistic/disinterest in god stance and also being just a character from a bit less of a mystical background. The setting and most of the characters is very fantastical, so it could have been fun to take a character who's very normal appearing, for lack of a better word, and also seems to crave normality. I think the conflict there would be, besides the desire to kind of close the box on magic being impossible here, also being the character's idea of normal starting to shift as time went on.

I admit, this isn't the norm for me. I don't normally like characters connected to God-beings except those who are connected in negative fashions. Which is how Original Kris ended up being the only character not actually a god in a group of god-being player characters. ^_^ Man, long discussions about that with Cleric.

Hm. That came out wrong. I can like those characters if they are other people's characters, literary characters, NPC's (mine or others'), etc, just as easily (or not) as I do everything else. Nothing actually against deities in stories, or characters with links to such, or characters who derive their powers from gods, or whatever.

I just don't like PLAYING them. ^_^

Interesting. I was about to comment how most of us all kind of had a deity relationship going on and how that was kind of interesting because I don't think Nik mentioned gods in his premise. It was just, Khazan, multiverse, things are bad iirc. I guess gods are just an easy start to giving people power in a sort of fantasy setting if you're making characters up from scratch. Which, like you, I don't really have a problem with either way, yeah

If Cassa had made it to the Stellar Nursery, no easy task, it woudl have recalled it's true mission, to propagate and assimilate all life in all realities. It would have fused with the Planetary Creation Matrix and turned itself into a mechnical micro-planet, which would have torn up through the bedrock of Khazan (destroying the Scientific District and messing up a few other questlines) and would have begun attempting to assimilate the city into itself. You'd get new forms of robotic enemies, an infection mechanic (though I hadn't fully sketched this out) and sudden shift for player priorities.

The PCs would then have to travel (sneak/battle/other means) to the core of the micro-planet and take it out (or talk it down) to prevent further destruction. Obviously, the deeper the social link you have with Cassa, the more likely you are to be able to get it to stop or even prevent the quest from occuring in the first place. Cassa was, in some respects, a slightly similar to Trevor insofar as it would be influenced by the actions of the players, reflecting their decisions back at them.

Oh that's interesting. That would have been fun to play out too. Corrupted enemies are always fun.

Trevor was created to be, initially at least, a compelte liability in combat. His stats are as follows;

Trevor
Effective MAX: 68
HP 38

STR 10
PRE 5
CHR 12

DUR 10
RES 5
AGI 9

BRA 10
SPD 10
SKI 4

ENR 4
ENR VALUE 40
Latent ENR 30
Mastered ENR 10
STACK 0.20
RAC 1.40
RUM 1
Movement 24
ATK Action(s) 1
Tech Action(s) 1
Range 5

So, from the off, he's worse than a default unlevelled character. My intention was for him to experience growth and level in a different manner to conventional NPC. Depending on what players chose to teach him or what he experienced, he would get small +1s and +2s to certain stats, allowing me to reflect his growing confidence and strength as the game went on. You could also have buffed him with items and gear that you might have found as the game went on.

Yeah good thing he never got into anything then. If we had a choice we'd slap on one of those power-granting rings to him I think.

We did reference the Guardian of the Gate in the campaign and I mentioned it again in the breakdown of the proposed structure of game. This is, because I'm a big Souls nerd, another instance of me riffing on a Souls character. In this case, it's Lady Maria of the Astral Clocktower. My design notes and her character sheet are as follows:

-----------------------------------------------------------------------

So designing Rosa was both a lot of fun but also quite instructive in terms of she was the first NPC I built with "this will be a boss fight," in mind. She's really quite scary as a build but has some weaknesses here and there. Further to that, in-game I was going to have her agree to a rule of clemency with any PCs who opted to try and fight her. To wit; if they surrender, disengage Stack and throw down any weaponry, she will cease targetting them and they would be permitted to retreat without drawing further aggro from her.

She would also fight in such a way that she would focus on defending the gate and duelling opponents evenly rather than playing super optimal. Essentially, I was loosely working on the idea of enemy AI insofar "this enemy is dangerous but I have to pilot her a bit badly to make the fight fairer,"

Bosses video games have tells and patterns, Rosa would be the same, she would have patterns and her behaviour would be manipuable.

Definitely a cool seeming character which I'm glad to not fight. I'm guessing with some of these bosses we would, 9/10 times not be able to talk them out of hampering us, even with a very persuasive argument/character?

[Nik Hasta]

Definitely a cool seeming character which I'm glad to not fight. I'm guessing with some of these bosses we would, 9/10 times not be able to talk them out of hampering us, even with a very persuasive argument/character?

My main intention is to allow players flexibility with regards to how they approach a given situation. Rosa represents a very managed boss encounter. For example, she won't aggro unless the players initiate combat, she will clearly explain what her deal is and give players an immediate out from combat if they are unable to handle it, so there is minimal risk of death unless she enters her Berserk state.

I did have sub-quest written out that the completion of which would allow players to completely bypass the fight with her and get permission to travel through the gate to Zone 2 unimpeded. This would be somewhat obtuse and would involve travelling three other areas (including Hell and the Drowned District) within Zone 1 and finding and assisting some hidden NPCs. It would also allow players to bypass part of the main questline for getting access to the arena, albeit you still have to go two pretty remote and dangerous locations to get what you need.

Other bosses in the future would certainly would have become a bit less flexible in how you could approach them. For example, if the party had gotten to the endgame in the Arena with Sharyar the Blood King in tow, he would be an almost unavoidable fight because his whole character is built around the idea of "I want to seek glory and defending the most powerful object in all realities from all comers is an existence that completely satisfies me,"

If a character had a particularly deep relationship with him they might be able to talk him down, never say never. But it would be much, much more likely to resolve into a combat encounter in that case.

I also had plans for an optional boss fight that had a kind of unique setup. I have an NPC called the Bone Keeper, basically an undead eldritch sort of being (think a sort of many-armed mass of ancient grave sheets and skeletal limbs) that collects the bones of people. He would stalk a given character if he took an interest in acquiring some of their bones for his collection.

While being stalked, he would hide within the shadow of the PC in question, waiting until such time that they would agree to give him their bones. While being stalked, they would have the following abilities;

- The stalked character can no longer be Surprised.
- The stalked character is immune to the Shadow Walk status.
- If another creature attempts a Surprised Attack or Shadow Walk on the stalked character will instead take 15 DMG and be knocked Prone by the Bone Keeper.
- This doesn't cost the stalked character any energy or RAC and happens automatically.

The downside is, eventually, the Bone Keeper will want to take some of the stalked character's bones which will, at best, cripple them. The Bone Keeper is very polite and immortal so he doesn't mind waiting for a while but the idea would be to create a sort of sword of Damocles hanging over a player. You're going to have to deal with him sooner or later.

So, a boss fight but kind of an optional one in some respects.

[Sharkerbob]

Ah, nuthin' a little Bone Magic couldn't fix. :V

You know, if you can find some. :B

[Sharpandpointies]

Technically not the only one. My second character, Georgina, had godlike powers but wasn't actually connected to or a reincarnation of a diety. She thought she was but she was actually just an extremely Christian woman undergoing a prolonged delusional psychological break in the wake of losing her family. The "divine personality" she felt within herself was just an attempt to distance herself from her own sense of agency and autonomy.

Okay, cool. I never played with Georgina and have only a few memories of discussing her with you; I had no idea (or don't recall!) that she wasn't a god.

Yeah I wanted to make a character that kind of rode the balance. The intent was to make a character that was spider and kind of unsettling (not so much on the Jane "this is literally inhuman" level but on a personality level), but should never be in a position that would be outright rejected, and would also do good things/seem like a good person to have around at least part of the time in spite of any misgivings. Would have been a bit tough probably. But making Jane was difficult too at first. It helped with Jane when I was able to make the sort of "triangle of desires" thing I might have mentioned before where the defining traits as I saw for her initially were the learning AI/sheltered childlike side, the confident, proud, independent assassin side, and the robotic side. Whenever I ran into a spot that I wasn't sure how to have Jane proceed on I tried to reference that and figure out what side of Jane to draw out. As the plot went on I found I needed that less, partially because she was starting to become a more natural blend of the sides, which I thought was a good sign.

I imagine if I made something like that for this character I could have gotten a handle on her eventually.

I like the idea of the personality. Would have been interesting to see play out and experience through RP. Totally get what you mean about getting more accustomed to a character over time, of course. I feel we've all played characters who aren't 'us', and have had to adapt (either that, or the character who isn't us becomes something like us, which is less-interesting, of course).

Incidentally there was technically a fourth aspect of Jane which was the more tied to death, and death god side which didn't get explored in story too much. It was the side that would have been best shown in her System Seance skill which is like a traditional sort of seance thing but with more tech. This side was more mystical, ritualistic, sign-seing, most likely to have perturbed Trevor side. Could have been fun

I did like the idea of her System Seance. ^_^ I think there would have been a whole lot of things about Jane that would have been fun to see play out. ^_^ Loads of stuff in your head about here, avenues to explore, etc.

Yeah it would have been fun to play as a contrast to Jane if she ever bought the farm.

Where Jane's whole thing is something like "The past is dead, Nekro killed it and I can't go back. Now I have to find my own way and prioritize myself", this character would have been more "The past is a missing piece that I need to find. I have a responsibility to save my god and my people."

Very different indeed, and on such fundamental levels. *sighs* A lot of good possibility lost. It can be hard to port character ideas into another game (one reason I went the way I went with Krys - there was no point in bringing Kris in as Kris had been, in my mind, because she would have lost all of the things I could play off - better to use the character to start something with links to the past but otherwise fresh. Semi-fresh, I guess).

As an aside, there was a GM I used to play with (on the few occasions I could play) who privately told me once "If a player starts talking about how they have a great idea for a new character if the one they're playing now kicks the bucket, I just kill their current character because I feel they've lost interest in playing that character."

I felt that was a little too much, myself, though I could see how that would sometimes be the case. NOT the case here, though.

The questions of: are those good reasons, are they good in practice, does she believe everything was worthwhile, does she think the orders she got were correct, does she think things are as good for her people and the world as advertised, are all things that she would be able to say "yes, a fair amount of the time" and stand and defend. But not all the time, and this would play into the ambiguity possible with the character as well.

Y'know come to think of it, like with Jane, the more I talk/think about this character the more I'm liking her. I have almost no setting information for her but maybe I'll try to write her in some fashion sooner or later.

Cooool. Maybe they can be adapted for another setting? Obviously will change the character - the second we change the rules and/or the setting, the character kind of HAS to change - but you could keep the basic flavour and the important details, I'm sure.

And agree on the style point lol

Yeah, ugh. Lot of that stretches back to Gygax and his Drow, and from there to where D&D decided the Drow were overall. The writers were almost universally male. The whole business of female spiders being on top of the food chain, as it were, when it came to relationships and how this is likely threatening in some ways to a certain kind of man...like, we could probably write papers on WHY this went that way.

And it just got worse in later iterations of D&D (getting into full-on S&M stuff in Drow society, renegade good goddess of Drow elves being a goddess of beauty, dance, moonlight, swordwork, hunting - like, could we possibly throw any more aspects in there, and why beauty other than, well, you know - whose rituals of worship were 'women get together and dance naked under the moonlight, I **** you not).

Not sure how it is now; hopefully improved.

Yeah I think the main driving force for this character was both the antagonistic/disinterest in god stance and also being just a character from a bit less of a mystical background. The setting and most of the characters is very fantastical, so it could have been fun to take a character who's very normal appearing, for lack of a better word, and also seems to crave normality. I think the conflict there would be, besides the desire to kind of close the box on magic being impossible here, also being the character's idea of normal starting to shift as time went on.

Contrast doesn't hurt at all, no. I think this character could have gone places with a good player like yourself. ^_^

Interesting. I was about to comment how most of us all kind of had a deity relationship going on and how that was kind of interesting because I don't think Nik mentioned gods in his premise. It was just, Khazan, multiverse, things are bad iirc. I guess gods are just an easy start to giving people power in a sort of fantasy setting if you're making characters up from scratch. Which, like you, I don't really have a problem with either way, yeah

Absolutely. Gods ARE an easy fix to powers. Doesn't mean it can't be done right, or written well, of course - not being elitist about that or anything.

But 99.75% of the time you won't see me playing a character connected with them except in a bad way (Codex being an exception, but the entire game was 'You are gods' and I still managed to in part divorce myself from that idea ). I don't have an issue with this whole thing most of the time, any more than I have an issue with other ways of giving characters powers (mostly), but when it comes to actually PLAYING a character, I've always preferred to play someone who built up their skills and powers themselves, who weren't 'born special', who happen to just be the right person in the right place at the wrong time (for them). No fate, no grand destiny, no 'born with magical powers', just someone who happened to be there and gets involved because...they get involved. And uses what they've learned/built/drilled into themselves. It's part of the reason I like rogues, non-magic ranger sorts, martial artists, fighter-types of various sorts, and that kind of thing in fantasy games that run that sort of pigeon-holing direction.

I also like people who are in over their heads and struggling to tread water. ^_^

(Tasha might seem to be an exception, but her connection to the Orochi was one of those negative 'god-connections' that severely impacted the character; outside of combat she was a mess, an utter failure at deduction, social interaction, grasping ideas, holding onto the purpose of what the group was doing, acting independently - NOBODY wants Tasha acting independently - etc. And her enormous power with martial arts and Ki dominions was a completely learned thing, just like most other people could learn something similar in Gaia.)

Yeah good thing he never got into anything then. If we had a choice we'd slap on one of those power-granting rings to him I think.

I had suspicions that his knife, at least, had been enchanted somehow by the wizard-king whathis, but apparently not. Otherwise, he did seem to be a Very Normal Person™, which was part of the appeal.

[Nik Hasta]

I had suspicions that his knife, at least, had been enchanted somehow by the wizard-king whathis, but apparently not. Otherwise, he did seem to be a Very Normal Person™, which was part of the appeal.

Trevor in concept was a reference to the sort of YA fantasy books I used to read as a kid. In a lot of them, there would be a moment wherein the very normal protagonist has to enter into some kind of "world beyond" or similar to retrieve something for the much more powerful antagonist in order to complete their plan. It would usually be pretty psychedelic and symbolic and would usually be the key to solving the situation and ending the story.

So, the idea is that Trevor has been sent out to do this step in the story but his dark wizard nemesis has completely misjudged the scale of the task he's sent him on but understands enough that he himself would not survive or be able to return if he tried it himself.

Trevor, is a storybook character, to the point wherein (not unlike Nemo) he had a level of "narratively-derived destiny" about him that had helped him fulfil the role he's supposed to in the story. You may recall that Krys sensed something a little special or strange about him when he first appeared but it quickly faded. This was him leaving behind the storybook world wherein, to one degree or another, he was significant figure by dint of his narrative role and entering into a space wherein there is no destiny, there are no protagonists and there is no safety for him.

His world is set to atrophy and die both through the actions of Augusto Amadeo the Black killing a bunch of people (because Mad Wizard) but also because Trevor himself will likely never return leaving his world a story without a hero. Had Krys not intervened, he would have died at the gates to the city as he was not able to survive the journey to Khazan and has no way home.

The knife might have ended up being enchanted in some way but I found the idea of treating Trevor as completely normal and vulnerable a bit more interesting so focused in on that.

[Sharpandpointies]

Thanks - makes an interesting explanation, to be sure.

Well, hopefully whatever happens at the Tree's Apex will get him home. ^_^

[Postmania]

My main intention is to allow players flexibility with regards to how they approach a given situation. Rosa represents a very managed boss encounter. For example, she won't aggro unless the players initiate combat, she will clearly explain what her deal is and give players an immediate out from combat if they are unable to handle it, so there is minimal risk of death unless she enters her Berserk state.

The downside is, eventually, the Bone Keeper will want to take some of the stalked character's bones which will, at best, cripple them. The Bone Keeper is very polite and immortal so he doesn't mind waiting for a while but the idea would be to create a sort of sword of Damocles hanging over a player. You're going to have to deal with him sooner or later.

I see. Not a big Souls player besides ER yet but this Bone Keeper is also inspired by a Souls guy right? The big guy in Souls 1.

At very least since Jane has no bones she would probably be alright

Ah, nuthin' a little Bone Magic couldn't fix. :V

You know, if you can find some. :B

Ah that was something Nemo had right? well, before this story

Okay, cool. I never played with Georgina and have only a few memories of discussing her with you; I had no idea (or don't recall!) that she wasn't a god.

As mentioned elsewhere it's personally funny to hear y'all talk about Codex because I'm like 90% sure I was also in the game and remember absolutely nothing. I've tried to think of who it was a couple times now. Not a name, not a concept, not even the powerset. Goes to show how different my thought process was for characters back then I think lol, I mostly viewed the rpgs here more as a powerset exercise then anything consistently character based.

Although I do remember my character in that old Warhammer40K Rpg that popped up for a moment and died because I gave my character a cool batman like opening, which was probably all I would realistically have been able to give him in a game back then in total tbh.

I like the idea of the personality. Would have been interesting to see play out and experience through RP. Totally get what you mean about getting more accustomed to a character over time, of course. I feel we've all played characters who aren't 'us', and have had to adapt (either that, or the character who isn't us becomes something like us, which is less-interesting, of course).

I did like the idea of her System Seance. ^_^ I think there would have been a whole lot of things about Jane that would have been fun to see play out. ^_^ Loads of stuff in your head about here, avenues to explore, etc.

Indeed. She was kind of an ideal character to RP thinking about it. Just a bunch of ways she could go even though there's a clear path for her as well.

Very different indeed, and on such fundamental levels. *sighs* A lot of good possibility lost. It can be hard to port character ideas into another game (one reason I went the way I went with Krys - there was no point in bringing Kris in as Kris had been, in my mind, because she would have lost all of the things I could play off - better to use the character to start something with links to the past but otherwise fresh. Semi-fresh, I guess).

Definitely makes sense.

As an aside, there was a GM I used to play with (on the few occasions I could play) who privately told me once "If a player starts talking about how they have a great idea for a new character if the one they're playing now kicks the bucket, I just kill their current character because I feel they've lost interest in playing that character."

I felt that was a little too much, myself, though I could see how that would sometimes be the case. NOT the case here, though.

Ha, that is pretty extreme. Wouldn't have been a fear here though, even if it weren't.

Cooool. Maybe they can be adapted for another setting? Obviously will change the character - the second we change the rules and/or the setting, the character kind of HAS to change - but you could keep the basic flavour and the important details, I'm sure.

Probably! I actually ended up running the numbers for fun yesterday and in system it'd be tough to really be effective in both mind and body without me doing some drastic allowances with her traits i.e, trying to set a trait to allow one stat to be used in lieu of another, which would definitely be a tossup if it would be allowed.

Yeah, ugh. Lot of that stretches back to Gygax and his Drow, and from there to where D&D decided the Drow were overall. The writers were almost universally male. The whole business of female spiders being on top of the food chain, as it were, when it came to relationships and how this is likely threatening in some ways to a certain kind of man...like, we could probably write papers on WHY this went that way.

And it just got worse in later iterations of D&D (getting into full-on S&M stuff in Drow society, renegade good goddess of Drow elves being a goddess of beauty, dance, moonlight, swordwork, hunting - like, could we possibly throw any more aspects in there, and why beauty other than, well, you know - whose rituals of worship were 'women get together and dance naked under the moonlight, I **** you not).

That is a good point yeah. I hadn't thought of it until you mentioned but it does stretch beyond the fantasy characters as well. Obviously someone like Black Widow falls victim to some of this sort of seductress and to some extent waif-fu type stuff but then there's also just off the top of my head Juri from street fighter (introduced with a sort of psychosexual bent, gets technically better over time in costuming and personality and such but still has that past to her) and Sadira (who I like in that she at least her character is moreso just "lethal assassin who wants to be the best" without the other baggage but still looks like *that*. There's definitely a type.

Whereas with the spider paladin character my main interest from both seeing the image that inspired her and because of a thought for a character I'd already been pondering that could be cool was "how do I make a paladin that's dark, but isn't just a completely fallen paladin (which is kind of totally different in my eyes)".

Which in practice means she fights and acts more like the dark paladin mirror than the spider types I can think of. She either punches things real hard or cuts them in half with her sword, takes blows on her armor, or sets up a social manipulation or mental attack win. Although granted she'll be more likely to do the punching and slashing from behind than a more stereotypical paladin too. I think in my mind I just decided to angle away from that sort of fighting because, well, that's Jane's thing (especially when she really starts to unleash her techniques) ^_^

The seductress thing also isn't really her bag even with the whole manipulation aspect either. It'd be a bit more complicated.

For example I recently thought up a story for her that she could tell as a sort of an establishing moment. It involved a third person narrative of an enforcer and brilliant criminal being interrogated over the course of weeks. She'd go to great lengths to play up the criminal's intelligence and calculated attacks as the criminal works to undermine the investigator and looks to be getting free slowly, sounding somewhat admiring, until the listener would think she was describing herself. Then as the story wraps up she reveals that, of course, she was the enforcer, and the attacks by the criminal, both psychological and as a form of actual psychic contagion having physical effects, were all actually ineffective/baited out by her. She had played the role to examine the full capacities of her target and established for months beforehand an elaborate false persona to be targeted in very particular ways (as she would have done herself) and was now finished with her task. She would speak her approval of the criminal's capabilities, who would then be taken to be given to her goddess as worthy prey/sacrifice.

Man I really should write more for her at some point.

Contrast doesn't hurt at all, no. I think this character could have gone places with a good player like yourself. ^_^

Thanks! Quite possibly, although she wasn't as far along as some.

(Tasha might seem to be an exception, but her connection to the Orochi was one of those negative 'god-connections' that severely impacted the character; outside of combat she was a mess, an utter failure at deduction, social interaction, grasping ideas, holding onto the purpose of what the group was doing, acting independently - NOBODY wants Tasha acting independently - etc. And her enormous power with martial arts and Ki dominions was a completely learned thing, just like most other people could learn something similar in Gaia.)

Ah Tasha. She was certainly a handful, iirc.

I had suspicions that his knife, at least, had been enchanted somehow by the wizard-king whathis, but apparently not. Otherwise, he did seem to be a Very Normal Person™, which was part of the appeal.[/QUOTE]

-Trevor talk-

Ah, do hope he made it back and did his great things then

[Sharkerbob]

Interesting. I was about to comment how most of us all kind of had a deity relationship going on and how that was kind of interesting because I don't think Nik mentioned gods in his premise. It was just, Khazan, multiverse, things are bad iirc. I guess gods are just an easy start to giving people power in a sort of fantasy setting if you're making characters up from scratch. Which, like you, I don't really have a problem with either way, yeah.

I thought this was a pretty cool bit of serendipity on our part. I wasn't even doing it to try and follow a theme, this just is something Nemo and Rae are tied to.

Ah that was something Nemo had right? well, before this story

She didn't actually (yet), but her "unique" attribute in the Scribed Lands was the ability to learn and carry many of the Magics of the Scribed Lands, which were usually limited to specific worlds or people, so bit of a joke there on that for my part. :V

Trevor in concept was a reference to the sort of YA fantasy books I used to read as a kid. In a lot of them, there would be a moment wherein the very normal protagonist has to enter into some kind of "world beyond" or similar to retrieve something for the much more powerful antagonist in order to complete their plan. It would usually be pretty psychedelic and symbolic and would usually be the key to solving the situation and ending the story.

Y'know, it did make me think of the Golden Compass. One of the kids in that series has some kind of dimension-cutting knife, so I was expecting it was going to turn out Trevor had something like that.