Mary Jane : if not with Peter, with who ?

[maryjane]

in the last years they have separated Peter and Mj a few times (mephisto ecc.), recently they seemed back together and then separated again... suppose in one of these periods, she ends up in a relationship (romantic, or sexual ecc.) with another superhero, which one would be perfect with her ??
(this shoud be a poll, but I don't know how to add choices... )
1 - Daredevil
2 - Johnny Storm
3 - Luke Cage
4 - Gambit
5 - Hawkeye
6 - Tony Stark
7 - Black Panther
8 - Wolverine
9 - Namor
10 - some other (write the name in the comments)

[Spider-Chan]

Black Cat.

[NC_Yankee]

in the last years they have separated Peter and Mj a few times (mephisto ecc.), recently they seemed back together and then separated again... suppose in one of these periods, she ends up in a relationship (romantic, or sexual ecc.) with another superhero, which one would be perfect with her ??
(this shoud be a poll, but I don't know how to add choices... )
1 - Daredevil
2 - Johnny Storm
3 - Luke Cage
4 - Gambit
5 - Hawkeye
6 - Tony Stark
7 - Black Panther
8 - Wolverine
9 - Namor
10 - some other (write the name in the comments)

What about no one? If they are not going to use MJ in a Peter comic then why use her at all? We already seen her in Iron Man, that did not work. I know they had the MJ/Felicia team up and that was a success but that was a one shot and the next one is limited as well.

[maryjane]

What about no one? If they are not going to use MJ in a Peter comic then why use her at all? We already seen her in Iron Man, that did not work. I know they had the MJ/Felicia team up and that was a success but that was a one shot and the next one is limited as well.

Mj is her own character, she does not exists to give the male character a girlfriend, and so she can go her own way. And anyway, it should be funny to talk about this kind of things, marvel fans do it quite often. Not here apparently. The only things I see here are spoilers (real and not real) and "very unlikely" forecasts for the future based on really nothing. My threads are for guys that have a real passion for marvel comics, that like to talk, to guess, to have fun, that have imagination and use it, both for serious and less serious discussions, but again, apparently not here, where the only threads that seem to be commented are this "appreciation" topics really full of imprecise, if not totally wrong things, commented by guys that seem to be in a challenge between themselves to determine who has the "bigger one".

[Frontier]

This makes me think that MJ's track record of relationships without Peter are as bad as Peter's with relationships that aren't MJ .

[NC_Yankee]

Mj is her own character, she does not exists to give the male character a girlfriend, and so she can go her own way. And anyway, it should be funny to talk about this kind of things, marvel fans do it quite often. Not here apparently. The only things I see here are spoilers (real and not real) and "very unlikely" forecasts for the future based on really nothing. My threads are for guys that have a real passion for marvel comics, that like to talk, to guess, to have fun, that have imagination and use it, both for serious and less serious discussions, but again, apparently not here, where the only threads that seem to be commented are this "appreciation" topics really full of imprecise, if not totally wrong things, commented by guys that seem to be in a challenge between themselves to determine who has the "bigger one".

Let’s be honest how many people are buying a Mary Jane led comic? Spider-Man loves Mary Jane which was tailored for girls only lasted 20 issues. The Black Cat solo which was critically acclaimed did not sell, nor did Silk ( I would be interested in seeing Ghost Spider sales numbers). Why? The overwhelming majority of superhero comic book readers are male. One more point: There are very few superheroes whose civilian identity matters anymore. They are as follow- 1: Matt Murdock: 2: Clint Barton. 3: Miles Morales. 4 : Peter. So what is the purpose in putting her in another comic ( unless Marvel tries to be stupid and give her powers or make another romance comic that will fail again. I still say the answer is Peter or no one.

[TinkerSpider]

Why does she have to be in a relationship? Her career isn't "Superhero Girlfriend" and that's not her purpose; assuming one can just pop her into a relationship with another superhero is rather...ew, like she doesn't get a say and is just some blow up doll to be passed around.

[Confuzzled]

Sunspot would be fun.

[maryjane]

Let’s be honest how many people are buying a Mary Jane led comic? Spider-Man loves Mary Jane which was tailored for girls only lasted 20 issues. The Black Cat solo which was critically acclaimed did not sell, nor did Silk ( I would be interested in seeing Ghost Spider sales numbers). Why? The overwhelming majority of superhero comic book readers are male. One more point: There are very few superheroes whose civilian identity matters anymore. They are as follow- 1: Matt Murdock: 2: Clint Barton. 3: Miles Morales. 4 : Peter. So what is the purpose in putting her in another comic ( unless Marvel tries to be stupid and give her powers or make another romance comic that will fail again. I still say the answer is Peter or no one.

Mary Jane is a normal person, not superpowers, not special training, not special skills, etc. so it's quite obvious that a comic book dedicated to her, in an universe of superheroes, will not work. But she's a good character, probably the best female character, surely the first that was created as a real person and not as the "model of virtue" that a girlfriend must be in male teen agers fantasy. Why ? because she was created to be the antagonist of the designated girlfriend, not the girlfriend. We had Flash Gordon, Buck Rogers, Peter Parker - Dale Arden, Wilma Deering, Gwen Stacy - Aura, Ardala, Mary Jane Watson. And this is one of the greatest things marvel has done, the love of the life of the hero is not the designated girlfriend, but the antagonist. If well written (and it's a big "if") Mj could not work in a comic book with her name, but she can be a good add to every super hero cast (and don't think about Iron Man, Bendis did not even know that she and Tony know each other before that).
And all the fact about the civilian identities could be true, as a matter of fact, but because writers today are often not up to the task. Editors too. So marvel is losing exactly what made marvel the greatest, real life long term subplots. And in my opinion we should not accept this fact so easily.

But all this is NOT the argoument of this thread. This thread was meant to be a funny thing, not a serious one. About couples, about sex, about which characters would be good, funny, exiciting together... in a not too serious way...

[Jman27]

Ben Reilly

[Confuzzled]

Let’s be honest how many people are buying a Mary Jane led comic? Spider-Man loves Mary Jane which was tailored for girls only lasted 20 issues.

It came out at a different time. A current comic of a similar type, one that was maybe direct market like DC's Young Adult graphic novels and also was available digitally, would be much more successful.

It would help a lot though if MCU MJ was a little more comics faithful.

[Lukmendes]

This makes me think that MJ's track record of relationships without Peter are as bad as Peter's with relationships that aren't MJ .

I'd say Spidey has it worse, MJ's non-Spidey relationships are generally just superficial and irrelevant, Spidey tends to suffer more when he's with anyone else lol.

Let’s be honest how many people are buying a Mary Jane led comic? Spider-Man loves Mary Jane which was tailored for girls only lasted 20 issues.

To be fair, it's an alternate universe comic, and those don't tend to sell well, with a civilian protagonist, and those also don't tend to sell well, fact that it lasted for as long as it did is impressive.

The Black Cat solo which was critically acclaimed did not sell, nor did Silk ( I would be interested in seeing Ghost Spider sales numbers). Why? The overwhelming majority of superhero comic book readers are male.

Non-classic names also tend to struggle in general to sell, and while Felicia is an old name, she had a comic very few times.

I'll also say that MacKay's Black Cat has boring stories even with fun enough characterization, and Cindy was just boring lol.

Sunspot would be fun.

That immediately reminded me of that "women are from Mars" saying lol.

It came out at a different time. A current comic of a similar type, one that was maybe direct market like DC's Young Adult graphic novels and also was available digitally, would be much more successful.

I get the feeling it'd sell even less now though, comics are really a dying medium lol.

It would help a lot though if MCU MJ was a little more comics faithful.

She would be a fun character if that was the case (Well, if they were faithful to MJ when she's written well).

What I saw of Zendaya on interviews, it's baffling they didn't just write a script around her personality, instead we got a boring girlfriend.

[NC_Yankee]

I'd say Spidey has it worse, MJ's non-Spidey relationships are generally just superficial and irrelevant, Spidey tends to suffer more when he's with anyone else lol.



To be fair, it's an alternate universe comic, and those don't tend to sell well, with a civilian protagonist, and those also don't tend to sell well, fact that it lasted for as long as it did is impressive.



Non-classic names also tend to struggle in general to sell, and while Felicia is an old name, she had a comic very few times.

I'll also say that MacKay's Black Cat has boring stories even with fun enough characterization, and Cindy was just boring lol.



That immediately reminded me of that "women are from Mars" saying lol.



I get the feeling it'd sell even less now though, comics are really a dying medium lol.



She would be a fun character if that was the case (Well, if they were faithful to MJ when she's written well).

What I saw of Zendaya on interviews, it's baffling they didn't just write a script around her personality, instead we got a boring girlfriend.

I happen to agree that comics are a dying breed, because if for no other reasons price and people do not read as much as in the past. The biggest problem will be when people get tired of superhero movies. We are starting to see a decline at the Box Office ( Although I think there will be a demand for Spider-Man and Batman when the stories are done well. However stuff that is D-List characters ( like Eternals), total crap and has a narrow demographic target ( such as Harley Quinn on all three counts , are not selling tickets). As for MJ I agree Zendaya did not really portray the comics MJ ( and to be fair Kristen Dunst did not either). My pick for the best MJ was Zoe Kravitz in Into The Spider Verse. She showed the best of MJ. Fiery, feisty and fierce, while still being devoted and loving. I wish Wells or Slott would watch that film… They can learn from it.

[Lukmendes]

I happen to agree that comics are a dying breed, because if for no other reasons price and people do not read as much as in the past.

Oh the price are grossly high and the stories really don't have enough content to have such a high price, it really doesn't do comics any favors lol.

The biggest problem will be when people get tired of superhero movies. We are starting to see a decline at the Box Office ( Although I think there will be a demand for Spider-Man and Batman when the stories are done well. However stuff that is D-List characters ( like Eternals), total crap and has a narrow demographic target ( such as Harley Quinn on all three counts , are not selling tickets).

I really don't think people getting tired of super-hero movies is a bad thing, they're over saturared and mostly really mediocre, and it's gross how much money they make.

As for MJ I agree Zendaya did not really portray the comics MJ ( and to be fair Kristen Dunst did not either).

Oh, Dunst's MJ is boring too lol.

Like seriously, at her very basic, MJ has two things that make her interesting, she's a fun character and a pretty good love interest with nice chemistry with Spidey, Raimi's MJ had neither of these things.

After watching Spidey Home 1, I thought Michelle was just a bad character, in Spidey Home 3 she, uh, exists I guess, maybe she's better than Raimi's MJ, but that's not a compliment.

My pick for the best MJ was Zoe Kravitz in Into The Spider Verse. She showed the best of MJ. Fiery, feisty and fierce, while still being devoted and loving.

My pick is Spectacular MJ, she basically captures the spirit of early Romita MJ by being a fun, easygoing character, it's too bad the cartoon ended before she could develop more.

I wish Wells or Slott would watch that film… They can learn from it.

Slott likely watched it, and honestly, if he didn't, watching it would make little difference.

Slott is a nerd, he knows a lot about Spidey and probably has forgotten more trivial info about Spidey than many of us ever learned, but thing is, he knows a lot, but he doesn't understand a lot.

Like Big Time has a scene where Randy refuses to share an apartment with Peter, and he mentions a piece of cheese that Peter called "Kevin" and that's used to be an excuse to be an asshole to him, when in the context of the story where that piece of cheese showed up, Randy didn't mind it:





(Peter Parker: Spider-Man#21)



(Amazing Spider-Man#648)

And if cases like this were isolated, it'd be fine, but those aren't isolated cases, despite knowing so much about trivial info, he doesn't understand the world as much, combine that with how his writing style is "plot over character", then we can have characters suddenly changing personalities to be fitting for the story, so he can write an MJ who's okay as a love interest and maybe even get her personality right, or he'll make her into an incompetent dumbass, it depends on what point he's making for that story, if a character is required to be an asshole, they may be an asshole.

So yeah, what difference would it make for him to watch the Spider-Verse movie in case he didn't? The way he handles characters is a writing issue, and that affects even characters he likes, 'cause if Otto doesn't escape that, what are the chances of anyone else escaping that?

[WebLurker]

in the last years they have separated Peter and Mj a few times (mephisto ecc.), recently they seemed back together and then separated again... suppose in one of these periods, she ends up in a relationship (romantic, or sexual ecc.) with another superhero, which one would be perfect with her ??
(this shoud be a poll, but I don't know how to add choices... )
1 - Daredevil
2 - Johnny Storm
3 - Luke Cage
4 - Gambit
5 - Hawkeye
6 - Tony Stark
7 - Black Panther
8 - Wolverine
9 - Namor
10 - some other (write the name in the comments)

Not sure any of them really fit (esp. Luke Cage, who's married). Not sure that womanizers like Tony, Wolverine, or Namor would do much good either (I guess they could do MJ having a fling while she's a free agent, but I'm not sure I trust the writers to handle it with any grace or respect). Course, it does depend on what the point of MJ seeing someone else would be (showing her moving on until the inevitable reconciliation, making a point that Peter's the only one for her by showing that she can't move on like that, etc.?).

I guess at this point, Mary Jane and Peter being a couple is too engrained into the DNA of the franchise for anything else to really work. Granted, my first Spider-Man stuff was the Raimi movies and Ultimate comics, where it was made clear that Peter was the only person she ever truly loved, so there is that. Just about anything could work with the right setup, but I can't really think of any on my own.

Black Cat.

While I have a sneaking feeling that it would get hella fetishized in the execution, I could almost see that working. They have had personal connections and having both been Peter's lover on different occasions certainly provides plenty of storytelling fodder and narrative possibilities down the road (What kind of self-discovery does MJ go on navigating her first known relationship with another woman? How does Black Cat take it when MJ inevitably goes back to Peter? How does this double love triangle where everyone has feelings for everyone else play out?). Thing is, as noted before, I'm deeply suspicious that the execution and reception would boil down to: "Cool; two hot gals making out!" rather than anything substantial. I'm pretty sure it would also trigger discussion about Peter, MJ, and Black Cat having a threesome and/or a throuple, which I'm not in favor of (think Black Cat works best as the amicable ex). There's also the detail that Black Cat as never expressed interest in MJ of a romantic or sexual nature and, so far as we know, MJ is straight (of course, it would be easy to have Black Cat's feelings change and MJ reveal that she was always bisexual or discover that herself with a few clicks of a keyboard, but, given how much the Big Two hate change, it would be quite the thing to stuff back in the bottle).