THE definitive Avengers villain?

[Nomads1]

I
With a less inspired writer, sadly, you end up with something like Thane Ector and his merry band of sentient bacteria.

I actually thought that Thane Ector had a lot of potential (and his story did have a nice set-up, I just think it was kind of condensed to fit the sumer six-issue double publishing schedule, and it kind of suffered for that). Think about it. They were not simply sentient bacteria, They were a race of powerful eternals (the most perfect creation of the Celestial Gods) evolved from the worst there is in nature. I think a lot could be done with that.

I've endlessly defended that the Gatherers (from the same period as Thane Ector), in the hands of the right writer, could end up being some of the Avengers most interesting adversaries, but there are plenty of other foes that never amounted to much that I could see rising in status if given a chance. I've already mentioned Graviton and the Zodiac Cartel, but there are others.
- Alkhema - Due to the spy background of her human template, an even more ruthless and unpredictable Ultron, and the living proof that the female is the deadliest of the spieces.
- Lord Templar and Pagan - I never liked much the triune understanding nor Mr Tremont, the third part of this equation, but I always thought that this dichotomy of order and caos personified had potential to cause big trouble for the Avengers. Plus, they were both powerful as hell, which is always a bonus.
- The Thunder Guard - An alternate reality Nazi Avengers from the pages of A-Next. Always wanted to see them face the present day team.
- Count Abyss - This one never faced the Avengers. He was a one-time villain in the pages of the Infinity Watch, but I really liked his name and looks, and the fact that he was more of a cosmic scheemer and manipulator rather than a conqueror, but he still seemed to be pretty powerful.

Peace

[Coin Biter]

I actually thought that Thane Ector had a lot of potential (and his story did have a nice set-up, I just think it was kind of condensed to fit the sumer six-issue double publishing schedule, and it kind of suffered for that). Think about it. They were not simply sentient bacteria, They were a race of powerful eternals (the most perfect creation of the Celestial Gods) evolved from the worst there is in nature. I think a lot could be done with that.

I'll admit I was being a bit mischievous with Thane Ector; he's an easy target because the character's from the 90s and has a slightly silly name. The story's not that bad, although the resolution was pretty poor, with the giant floating brown blobs. And the sentient bacteria spin, in the right hands is potentially a good idea - Morrison did terrific things with Sublime in New X-Men, after all.

I'm sure you're right that the lesser Avengers villains could be interesting if given the right opportunity. All a villain needs is a coherent motivation and the right writer/someone who's interested in the history of the characters. I'll be honest though - personally, I'm a bit fatigued with evil (or for that matter good) Avengers and Justice League analogues. That's probably just because I was reading Multiversity last evening and spent too much time trying to work out the parallels :-)

[stingnewell]

While not the most definitive concept and story wise I always liked The Exemplars. Before The Worthy, these guys were pretty much Juggernaut level beings given powers by beings similar and different to Cyttorak. How they were created to specifically to represent their master to prove who was the greater of the Octessense. I think it has potential for return.

[ed2962]

Like most people I picked Kang. Followed closely by Ultron, then Thanos. Then Masters of Evil. What I always thought was that the Avengers had lots of foes that were good ideas or had potential, but not great follow through or great multiple stories.

For instance, I've always liked the premise of the Zodiac, but there's like what, at least four different versions? Count Nefaria could be great but he doesn't seem to have much motivation or nuance beyond being evil Superman. I thought the best Lethal Legion story was that West Coast Avengers/Vision Scarlet Witch story. I had an idea for an Ultimized revamp of LL, but I guess that ship has sailed. I think a lot more could be done with the Space Phantom people. Maybe cuz the Skrulls have similar powers, folks find them redundant.

I might be in the minority, but I like the idea of the Hood's gang. Despite how I feel about the comics, I like the idea that they're basically an army of two-bit thugs that Hood is trying to get to think more ambitiously. I like the idea of them being a little seedy underworld society. Like they're not always at the master villain's secret high tech lair, most of the time they plan bank jobs in bars and crappy diners and what not.

[tg1982]

Ultron, I think is the Avengers ultimate villain. I picked him. Followed by Kang, then Thanos. As others have said, Thanos is the more powerful villain but he's used too sporadically. Ultron was created by a founding Avenger, who, in turn, created Vision a major Avenger hero, so just in that alone there is some drama and kind of unique history.

[Dabrikishaw]

The Avengers, as popular a team as they are, have never had a really strong rogues gallery, IMHO. Ultron is far and away their ultra villain, with Kang a distant second. AS others have said, after that it gets murky and rather skimpy, too. Most of their bad guys haven't been used often as say, a Red Skull or Dr. Doom type. Just Ultron and Kang. I think that Korvac COULD have become such a villain, but it may have been wise to keep him (mostly) dead after that epic Shooter tale.

Honestly, I know they are trying to hype up Thanos to the Nth degree, but I have never really even thought of him as an "Avengers" villain.

This is my thought on the whole topic.

[Mikekerr3]

First All Scarlet Witch is on this poll really!? The only people who hate her are the X-men and I could care less what those hypocrites think of her.

Now as to the thread question For me a tie between Kang and Ultron third Baron Helmut Zemo.

Who on the list has murdered more avengers?

[electr1cgoblin]

Who on the list has murdered more avengers?

Well, if you are going by that standard, Korvac should be the Number One because he wiped them all out at once in 1977. Of course they were all resurrected, just as most of those "killed" by the Witch were.

Wanda was only MADE into a villain in the 21st century, approximately 40 years after the Avengers were formed, and even then she was obviously mentally unbalanced after having her mind violated multiple times by evil men. And now she's being reformed by the current writers. To assume she's on an equal footing with villains who have plagued the team for decades, having not experienced those conditions, and who will never reform, is not logical IMO. I know this is comics, but I can't imagine any other character who wouldn't have broken under those conditions.

Her inclusion here is up to the OP, but IMO she has no business here, either.

[JudicatorPrime]

I'd say Ultron, but since the question was who would I pick as the villain for my epic movie, I'd pick Thanos. Give me a truly powerful cosmic villain any day.

[Nomads1]

Well, if you are going by that standard, Korvac should be the Number One because he wiped them all out at once in 1977. Of course they were all resurrected, just as most of those "killed" by the Witch were.

Wanda was only MADE into a villain in the 21st century, approximately 40 years after the Avengers were formed, and even then she was obviously mentally unbalanced after having her mind violated multiple times by evil men. And now she's being reformed by the current writers. To assume she's on an equal footing with villains who have plagued the team for decades, having not experienced those conditions, and who will never reform, is not logical IMO. I know this is comics, but I can't imagine any other character who wouldn't have broken under those conditions.

Her inclusion here is up to the OP, but IMO she has no business here, either.

Perfect. Yes, by that standard, I guess Kang (my choice) is the winner, for Swordsman is still dead (unless you go into the whole Caos War controversy).

And I also always liked the Exemplars, mentioned above, although their motivations are kind of trivial.

Peace

[Ravin' Ray]

Who on the list has murdered more avengers?

The argument could be made that it was closer to homicide than murder since she was not in full control of her faculties and didn't directly (or intentionally) targeted those killed. Certainly in Hawkeye's case he purposefully flew into that faux Kree ship to sacrifice himself so his case was indirect.

[Deniz Camp]

To be the definitive Avengers villain I think that has to be your thing primarily. I can see the argument for Loki, but he's a Thor villain first and foremost. Ditto Dormammu and Strange, or Thanos (who is a villain to Cap Mar-Vell and Adam Warlock or the MU, but never to the Avengers specifically). Empires dont' exactly make deefinitive villains (though I think the Supreme Intelligence might deserve a mention).

Immortals, Squadron Supreme, and SW aren't strictly villains, though they sometimes are. Grandmaster is often a villain, but isn't quite villainous enough. Korvac is all twisted up with the Guardians of the Galaxy.

I think it has to be between Kang and Ultron. And I go with Kang because I prefer him, but if we're being honest it's probably Ultron, whose very origin is tied to the Avengers and who has so often fought them. But I think Kang is a superior villain with superior creative potential/options/diversity of story.

[Coin Biter]

Well, if you are going by that standard, Korvac should be the Number One because he wiped them all out at once in 1977. Of course they were all resurrected, just as most of those "killed" by the Witch were.

Wanda was only MADE into a villain in the 21st century, approximately 40 years after the Avengers were formed, and even then she was obviously mentally unbalanced after having her mind violated multiple times by evil men. And now she's being reformed by the current writers. To assume she's on an equal footing with villains who have plagued the team for decades, having not experienced those conditions, and who will never reform, is not logical IMO. I know this is comics, but I can't imagine any other character who wouldn't have broken under those conditions.

Her inclusion here is up to the OP, but IMO she has no business here, either.

From recollection, Korvac wasn't a villain in the Korvac saga (although he was in his previous appearance)? He was - according to Moondragon, anyway - an attempted saviour of mankind who perished because of the Avengers' misguided heroic zeal. And he, after all, was the one to resurrect the Avengers, practically instantaneously.

It's true that when she wrecked the Avengers, Wanda was mentally unstable. But then that's true of many villains - Graviton, for example, doesn't exactly play with a full deck. And since Wanda warped reality then an obvious point of comparison would be Mad Jim Jaspers - who, as his name suggests, was mad. We don't really know the extent that he would be villainous without his mental instability - although he was a Conservative MP, which in an Alan Moore story, is unlikely to be a good sign

I think Wanda was - during Avengers Disassembled and House of M - pretty much a full-on villain, in a similar sense to many not necessarily wicked but unfortunately unhinged villains of the past. She isn't now, of course, because they decided to try to retcon her actions and feature her as a hero. (Whether they have done this effectively is a matter of opinion.) And that in itself is fair enough - she's too powerful to be an effective repeat villain. Still, she deserves to be on this list in the same way that other reformed villains - Emma Frost, and the many other criminals that have filled out the cast of both the Avengers and X-Men - deserve to be on the list of top villains as well.

[Star_Jammer]

Those who voted Ultron know what's up.

[wunderpanda]

Ultron is the only exclusive Avengers villain on the list, has to be him