So...the first mcu X-men picture will be 2026

[Bunch of Coconuts]

I thought as much.

I’m not going to do financial leg work for someone who

A) has this information available to view as well

B) isn’t offering ANYTHING to the counter point. Zip. Nada. Zilch.

I don’t play those games, sorry.

[PolarIceFire]

I’d say those are fairly consistent numbers. With an outlier for Loki and Ms. Marvel. And the the viewership for She-Hulk isnt as bad as previously insinuated.

Not if the objective is growth, which is what the investors and shareholders would want to see. Do you have one that shows subscriber increases corroborating this?

[Bunch of Coconuts]

Not if the objective is growth, which is what the investors and shareholders would want to see. Do you have one that shows subscriber increases corroborating this?

I already commented about Disney+ growth with regard to the MCU products specifically.

But a lack of growth does not always equal a growing disinterest.

[PolarIceFire]

I’m not going to do financial leg work for someone who

A) has this information available to view as well

B) isn’t offering ANYTHING to the counter point. Zip. Nada. Zilch.

I don’t play those games, sorry.

I understand, turning a blind eye and a deaf ear can often help maintain a false sense of security, that some like to cling to in desperation.

[Bunch of Coconuts]

I understand, turning a blind eye and a deaf ear can often help maintain a false sense of security, that some like to cling to in desperation.

Yeah a noticed that a long time ago discussing this matter with folks who can’t provide any evidence for their claims. Thanks for reminding me.

Ironic, this thread started out that way.

[PolarIceFire]

Yeah a noticed that a long time ago discussing this matter with folks who can’t provide any evidence for their claims. Thanks for reminding me.

Ironic, this thread started out that way.

Yeah, for you it must be like seeing your own reflection, and then...

[Isaac Lawrence]

Did you, or the casual movie goer, know at the end of the first Avengers film (the end of Phase 1) that there would eventually be Infinity War and Endgame?

Well, they did tease Thanos at the end of the first Avengers movie, didn't they?

So they didn't say exactly what was coming, but teased that something was coming.

And I guess that was enough. A teaser of what's to come.

Marvel has created a bit of a double edged sword. Some fans expect “well it MUST ALL BE LINKED! or it’s not worth it.” Some fans prefer things to not be so connected so that they can skip an MCU outing that they’re not particularly interested in.

Yeah, connecting it all was the brilliant thing, because it makes you feel that you almost have to see everything.

And yeah, the flip-side, just tell a good story, whether it's connected or not isn't that important.

Marvel obviously goes with the former. And DC does a little of the latter with things like The Batman and the Joker.

Of course, connecting it all is hard, because everything has to hit. And when you have things that miss, then you're kind of in a little trouble.

Marvel has planted the seeds for future movies. Some of that involves the films, some involves the Disney+ shows. What’s the harm in waiting to see where it leads, instead of immediately needing to know?

Just as a casual observer who has no interest in seeing any of this stuff, it just seems a lot more complicated this time around. And not really for the better.

The first time around I didn't watch any of the movies because I simply wasn't interested in any of the characters, but it was pretty clear from the outside looking in: they're building up to fight Thanos. Okay, pretty simple. Pretty straight forward. Everyone and anyone can understand that.

This time around... the multiverse. Okay and... ? I should be excited why... ?

So it just seems like this time around if you're a hardcore person then you might be really into this. If you're not though, why would the casual person care about the multiverse.

And all of this stuff that came in the last phase, some of it I guess is tied to what's coming, and some of it isn't?

And I'm sure it'll all make sense in the end, but the journey is a little bit more rocky this time.

And I guess Kevin Feige said...

As we’re nearing the end of Phase 4, I think people will start to see where this next saga is going.

I think there have been many clues already, that are at least apparent to me, of where this whole saga is going. But we’ll be a little more direct about that in the coming months, to set a plan, so audiences who want to see the bigger picture can see a tiny, tiny, tiny bit more of the roadmap.

And so it will eventually all make sense, but it seems like you have to really want to be on that journey this time.

Hopefully they're taking notes and don't repeat this when they get to the X-Men.

Just keep it simple, don't overcomplicate it.

[Jackraow21]

Focusing on your last statements, I personally am less interested in Hugh Jackman Wolverine, as that has already been played out for two full trilogies plus Days of Future's Past and other cameos.

Fox's X-Men is its own thing, and I feel the need to re-use these actors/actresses seems like it will limit what the MCU can do with them. For example, Hugh Jackman's Wolverine couldn't be a brainwashed Horseman of Apocalypse as fans would riot. A new unknown actor as Wolverine though, can.

There is already interest in the X-men in and of themselves; I don't really see the need for the 'nostalgic safety net' of using the same performers.

It would frankly be amazing if MCU were able to focus on Sunspot or other New Mutants (a new cast, and not the one from the failed movie). If Hugh Jackman is in the picture, then they would never have a chance to break out.

I totally get that, and it’s a sentiment you see a lot amongst comic fans. You’re certainly not alone.

But amongst the broader movie-consuming public I think you’ll find the general consensus to be that not only was Hugh Jackman not the problem with the FOX-men films, but rather he was quite beloved in the role. I mean, I kind of felt sorry for the Rock and Henry Cavill, who desperately leaked the Superman cameo in Black Adam to try and promote the film around the same time that Ryan Reynolds made the announcement with Jackman about his return as Logan in Deadpool 3… because the latter completely freakin’ eclipsed the former! It was kind of sad. But it would seem from the reaction online, and just amongst people I know who aren’t even comic fans, that the vast majority of folks are quite excited about him returning to the role, whether it’s a “nostalgia safety net” (in your view) or a chance to capitalize on an iconic depiction of the character in the MCU (which is my view on it).

And as for whether they can do different things with Jackman as Wolverine, why not? I don’t think there’s anything stopping them from doing Enemy of the State or making him a Horseman of Death and pitting him against the MCU heroes if they wanted to… and now I really kind of want to see it.

[Bunch of Coconuts]

Well, they did tease Thanos at the end of the first Avengers movie, didn't they?

So they didn't say exactly what was coming, but teased that something was coming.

And I guess that was enough. A teaser of what's to come.

Did you miss the Kang teaser? He's also a major player in the next film to be released.

The incursions teaser?

Not to mention all the other things that are probably smaller plots to be followed up on.

Just as a casual observer who has no interest in seeing any of this stuff, it just seems a lot more complicated this time around. And not really for the better.

The first time around I didn't watch any of the movies because I simply wasn't interested in any of the characters, but it was pretty clear from the outside looking in: they're building up to fight Thanos. Okay, pretty simple. Pretty straight forward. Everyone and anyone can understand that.

This time around... the multiverse. Okay and... ? I should be excited why... ?

So it just seems like this time around if you're a hardcore person then you might be really into this. If you're not though, why would the casual person care about the multiverse.

And all of this stuff that came in the last phase, some of it I guess is tied to what's coming, and some of it isn't?

And I'm sure it'll all make sense in the end, but the journey is a little bit more rocky this time.

And I guess Kevin Feige said...



And so it will eventually all make sense, but it seems like you have to really want to be on that journey this time.

Hopefully they're taking notes and don't repeat this when they get to the X-Men.

Just keep it simple, don't overcomplicate it.

Why should anyone, especially the casual observer, have cared about Thanos appearing at the end of the Avengers?

[Isaac Lawrence]

Did you miss the Kang teaser? He's also a major player in the next film to be released.

The incursions teaser?

Not to mention all the other things that are probably smaller plots to be followed up on.

I've watched clips of some of it, and read a few things, and after my eyes stopped glazing over I ultimately came away thinking "this is the big plan?"

And I really shouldn't get into this discussion because I so do not care about any of it, and so can't really discuss it in a way other than "I don't like any of this because I've never liked these kind of stories in the comics."

But no, universes on a collision course is kind of the thing this time around, as I understand it.

And that's fine in and of itself, but it is kind of nebulous. There's not a whole lot to grab onto.

Because if you ask, "Who are they fighting this time?" The answer is kind of complicated.

And if they have some type of Beyonders or whatever that doesn't make it any better in my book, because I was never a fan of any of that anyway.

(Yes, I'm bad at talking about things that I don't really like.)

Why should anyone, especially the casual observer, have cared about Thanos appearing at the end of the Avengers?

Yeah, it was not so much the who but the what. Everyone was going to fight this big guy. Simple. Done. Easy to understand, easy to explain.

I would assume Kevin Feige is going to get back to that with the X-Men.

Back to simpler to understand concepts. Which obviously can be done in a compelling way.

It would frankly be amazing if MCU were able to focus on Sunspot or other New Mutants (a new cast, and not the one from the failed movie)...

That's the way I feel too.

Because while I have no interest in the C and D-list Marvel characters, I do more than anything want to see the C and D-list and lesser known X-Men characters.

I want to see them instead of the traditional main characters.

I want to see Astrid Bloom be one of the main characters in this MCU X-Men.

I want to see Xi'an Coy Manh. I wonder can they do Warlock. I want to see Noriko Ashida. And Dr. Cecilia Reyes. Dust, Sooraya Qadir, I want to see her. And of course Monet St. Croix.

The argument is the MCU can take lesser known characters and make them household names. Okay, do it for the X-Men then. Do it for these lesser known X-Men characters and make everyone know who they are...

I'm considering seeing The Marvels because I am curious about what they're going to do with Kamala Khan.

And maybe like Kamala Khan they can slowly introduce these lesser known X-Men characters and make them known by the time the X-Men movie gets here.

[Bunch of Coconuts]

I've watched clips of some of it, and read a few things, and after my eyes stopped glazing over I ultimately came away thinking "this is the big plan?"

And I really shouldn't get into this discussion because I so do not care about any of it, and so can't really discuss it in a way other than "I don't like any of this because I've never liked these kind of stories in the comics."

But no, universes on a collision course is kind of the thing this time around, as I understand it.

And that's fine in and of itself, but it is kind of nebulous. There's not a whole lot to grab onto.

Because if you ask, "Who are they fighting this time?" The answer is kind of complicated.

And if they have some type of Beyonders or whatever that doesn't make it any better in my book, because I was never a fan of any of that anyway.

(Yes, I'm bad at talking about things that I don't really like.)

What was there to grab onto with Thanos just turning around and smiling?

Remember, you're comparing the Thanos tease as the "great big tease that told everyone the plan for the MCU" versus what's been shown so far in Phase 4.

Yeah, it was not so much the who but the what. Everyone was going to fight this big guy. Simple. Done. Easy to understand, easy to explain.

I would assume Kevin Feige is going to get back to that with the X-Men.

Back to simpler to understand concepts. Which obviously can be done in a compelling way.

Wait, is your assumption that Kang isn't going to be fought?

[Isaac Lawrence]

What was there to grab onto with Thanos just turning around and smiling?

Remember, you're comparing the Thanos tease as the "great big tease that told everyone the plan for the MCU" versus what's been shown so far in Phase 4.

Well, first, my exact words were:

So they didn't say exactly what was coming, but teased that something was coming.

And I guess that was enough. A teaser of what's to come.

To what you're asking, when I said this:

Yeah, it was not so much the who but the what. Everyone was going to fight this big guy. Simple. Done. Easy to understand, easy to explain.

So for people who knew who he was: "Oh, they're going to fight Thanos." And for people who didn't know who he was: "Oh, they're going to fight this big guy."

That's what everyone I assumed grabbed onto, something very simple and direct like that.

Wait, is your assumption that Kang isn't going to be fought?

Yeah, he may be the main threat or the misdirect. Does it really matter either way?

I assume they will make all of this more compelling, but that goes back to what I said before, it seems like you really have to want to be onboard with the journey this time around.

And again, I really shouldn't have gotten into this, because I can't look at it objectively. Because everything that they're doing is stupid and uninteresting to me. So I'm a horrible person to talk to about any of this.

[Bunch of Coconuts]

And again, I really shouldn't have gotten into this, because I can't look at it objectively. Because everything that they're doing is stupid and uninteresting to me. So I'm a horrible person to talk to about any of this.

Well there we go.

[Rift]

You guys going to kiss or what?

[Sutekh]

The weird thing for me about this is that I have always been a fan of Kang, and never liked Thanos at all, since stories about Thanos tend to be all about shiny McGuffins and plot device level cosmic entities (and, frankly, he's always felt like a second-rate Darkseid to me).

So, if the teaser of Thanos in his chair was supposed to get me all hyped, it didn't, while a teaser about Kang has me quietly excited.

Plus the CGI mook battles should be an upgrade. Thanos sends armies of same-same-y Chitauri or whatever. Boring. Kang sends a mixed force of dinosaurs, post-apocalyptic mutant cyborgs, futuristic spacemen with jet-packs and ray guns and Mongol archers on horseback. Maybe the occasional cyborg dinosaur, just to mash genres!