What do you think about Joss Whedon's influence on the MCU films?

[krazijoe]

Never thought about it...Ok, I just did and meh.

[80sbaby]

Yeah, I think Kirby101's got the seminal take on this one. Whedon's Avengers took the excitement the first five films had built and ramped it up several notches. It wasn't just him, but the film proved the multi-franchise model would work.

That's not the type of "influence" the TC means. They're talking about the whole "MCU humor," specifically.

[Frontier]

I'm tired of the constant quips and jokes to deflate tension.

[Scott Taylor]

No, his influence hasn't lasted.

I kind of wish some of it had, though. His two Avengers movies had some sense of danger and some nice dramatic moments as well as the goofy stuff. Like there were real stakes and that the team is on the verge of failure and falling apart due to the characters being individuals. Much of what came afterwards, by the Russo's, etc., has still been good but it has felt a little too easy on the character-driven drama and more like there is no danger, no real stakes and like the characters are just riding the rails of the story. Even when they disagree, you get a sense that its no big deal.

In Civil War, the ending is Tony getting a cell phone from Cap and allowing him to free the prisoners. So much was going on in Infinity War and Endgame, there wasn't time for true character arcs. Tony is super mad at cap, then he just gets over it off screen and we don't know why other than a quip. Can't think of other dramatic arcs even in those movies.

With the Russo's there are character moments still. I'm not saying there aren't. But I liked the feel with them that Whedon created over the much more "safe" feel the Russo's movies had.

[Frontier]

No, his influence hasn't lasted.

I kind of wish some of it had, though. His two Avengers movies had some sense of danger and some nice dramatic moments as well as the goofy stuff. Like there were real stakes and that the team is on the verge of failure and falling apart due to the characters being individuals. Much of what came afterwards, by the Russo's, etc., has still been good but it has felt a little too easy on the character-driven drama and more like there is no danger, no real stakes and like the characters are just riding the rails of the story. Even when they disagree, you get a sense that its no big deal.

In Civil War, the ending is Tony getting a cell phone from Cap and allowing him to free the prisoners. So much was going on in Infinity War and Endgame, there wasn't time for true character arcs. Tony is super mad at cap, then he just gets over it off screen and we don't know why other than a quip. Can't think of other dramatic arcs even in those movies.

With the Russo's there are character moments still. I'm not saying there aren't. But I liked the feel with them that Whedon created over the much more "safe" feel the Russo's movies had.

I get what you're saying even if I think he delivered probably one of the weaker versions of Ultron.

[Thezmage]

That's not the type of "influence" the TC means. They're talking about the whole "MCU humor," specifically.

If people's styles and influence could be so easily broken down into discrete bits, the world would be a different place.

[phonogram12]

I honestly think his influence was a big reason for the MCU's success. One of his big strengths is injecting humor into dramatic and even horrific storylines to make the experience fun. Without him I think it would have ended up more like the DCU... and probably given up as a failed experiment by the end of Phase One.

While I generally think for the most part he just took Favreau's ball and ran with it, I absolutely see your point. I think we definitely have both Favreau and Whedon to thank for preventing what could have been a DCEU-sized disaster.

And say what you will about AOU, but (at least for the time, anyway) Whedon was the only one who could've made the first Avengers movie as successful as it was.

[AndrewCrossett]

While I generally think for the most part he just took Favreau's ball and ran with it, I absolutely see your point. I think we definitely have both Favreau and Whedon to thank for preventing what could have been a DCEU-sized disaster.

And say what you will about AOU, but (at least for the time, anyway) Whedon was the only one who could've made the first Avengers movie as successful as it was.

The first Avengers is still my favorite MCU movie. Age of Ultron had its moments, but wasn't up to the standards of the first.

[phonogram12]

The first Avengers is still my favorite MCU movie.

I mean, it was absolutely groundbreaking. I didn't think a superhero battle scene like that could ever be captured on film, but there it was in all it's cinematic glory.

[Frontier]

I will say Whedon handled certain characters better than the Russo's did, like not trying to write out Hulk and Vision as much as they possibly could.

[HollowSage]

I will say Whedon handled certain characters better than the Russo's did, like not trying to write out Hulk and Vision as much as they possibly could.

Really? Vision isn’t even in Avengers and AoU is his origin story. It’s a weird comparison to make since Infinity War and Endgame deal with so many more characters. Not everyone is going to get the same amount of screen time although both Hulk and Vision play pivotal roles in the story so there is that.

[Scott Taylor]

I thought the Hulk and Black Widow relationship that was starting out under Whedon was interesting.

[Frobisher]

I will say Whedon handled certain characters better than the Russo's did, like not trying to write out Hulk and Vision as much as they possibly could.

Didn’t know they wrote as well as directed those films.

[Frontier]

Really? Vision isn’t even in Avengers and AoU is his origin story. It’s a weird comparison to make since Infinity War and Endgame deal with so many more characters. Not everyone is going to get the same amount of screen time although both Hulk and Vision play pivotal roles in the story so there is that.

But we got to see Vision actually fight in AoU compared to IW where they immediately nerfed him like they did with Hulk.

Russo's just didn't seem comfortable having Hulk or Vision with their full powerset or fighting ability active in the movies.

I thought the Hulk and Black Widow relationship that was starting out under Whedon was interesting.

The Betty erasue bothered the heck out of me.

Didn’t know they wrote as well as directed those films.

I know they had screenwriters but are they not heavily involved in that stage as well? Same with Feige.

[Rincewind]

I will say Whedon handled certain characters better than the Russo's did, like not trying to write out Hulk and Vision as much as they possibly could.

Whedon also handled certain characters worse than the Russos did. Whedon has trouble with idealistic characters like Steve Rogers. His Black Widow was oversexualized with the reviled line about being a monster. Hawkeye was mostly wasted in Whedon's Avengers. And we never got to see the Russos handle Coulson or Quicksilver because Whedon didn't have anything better to do than kill them off.