The contest being erased.

[Perseus]

Except it seems needlessly comples to give her divine origins (either demi-god status or magical clay) if we then are going to give her powers from a second divine event. If she is just a normal Amazon, she could as easily be Hippolyta's natural child (and via Zeus either).

In my perfect origin it would be Hippolyta sculpting Diana from the clay of paradise and Gaia bringing her to life. Diana would get two moms, but by all means she's just an amazon, special via her creation but naturally just an amazon. She learns and grows into womanhood, have a prophesy about her creation and the start of the amazon's new chapter in their history or something, but its only after winning the contest the gods bless her. She needs to prover herself as best of the best before getting any special gifts. This leaves the possibility that any amazon could have been champion and would explain some amazons (Nubia) being as powerful as her without blood connections.

Diana sculpted from clay is more symbolic of a feminine reinterpretation of the creation of man from the Bible. Instead of man being created from clay and God giving him life, a woman sculpts a girl from clay and a goddess (in my head canon, Gaia the literal embodiment of mother creation) brings her to life. Her title as a goddess is just a title, its meaningless without actions behind it. You want Diana to be a goddess level being? writers/artist just need to treat her as one.

[Primal Slayer]

Except it seems needlessly comples to give her divine origins (either demi-god status or magical clay) if we then are going to give her powers from a second divine event. If she is just a normal Amazon, she could as easily be Hippolyta's natural child (and via Zeus either).

The way I see it, the Goddesses always had big plans for Diana and knew she would become THE champion of the Amazons. They just had to ensure they werent wrong. So it owuldnt be something where any Amazon who won would be blessed. It was always in the plan for Diana to be.

[Phoenixx9]

The way I see it, the Goddesses always had big plans her for Diana and knew she would become THE champion of the Amazons. They just had to ensure they werent wrong. So it owuldnt be something where any Amazon who won would be blessed. It was always in the plan for Diana to be.

I kind of see it your way with a twist:The goddesses may have known just how special Diana was and that she was going to win the Tournament, but I do not believe Diana herself, nor Hippolyta nor any other Amazon knew. Yes, Diana may have trained, but she used the speed, force, strength, etc used against her back on her opponent. This take works for the first Tournament. Now, subsequent ones would be unfair if Diana participated because no other Amazon is even close, except maybe Donna and Nubia.

[Stanlos]

Personally, I favor Diana having her powers/gifts from birth. Otherwise, she's just another Amazon.

I really don't care enough about the "cheating" to take her gifts away from her.

Would the Amazons being their original levels help balance it out? What if they were all strong as Hercules and swift as Mercury while Diana was Stronger Than and Swifter Than?

[greatmetropolitan]

This is a really interesting discussion as it's honing in on what seems to be what people think of as key parts of Diana's origin:

She needs a special origin - moulded from clay. This origin of being brought into the world by women is pretty fundamental, in my opinion.
She needs to prove herself amongst her sisters. What makes her special? Why is she Wonder Woman and no other Amazon?
She need to prove herself independently of her special origin. If she only proves herself because of the circumstances of her birth, she's really not that special.

This is why I came up with my own take on the contest a few pages back, but its a fun little puzzle to solve.

My other solution was to have Diana be actually physically worse than the other Amazons for most of her life. They've had centuries of training and meditation to perfect their bodies and skills and are all Captain America level or something, but Diana doesn't have the benefit of those years of training. So when she wins the contest, it proves more than anything her determination, spirit, willpower. So she gets the gifts of the gods.

Or! The contest is a series of contests, each one bestowing a gift of a god - strength speed, the lasso etc. The twist comes when we find out Diana lost a single challenge, and there's a rogue Amazon out there with the last piece of Diana's full gifts as Wonder Woman.

[WonderScott]

I’m a fan of the Contest. It’s an important part of Diana’s development, Bildungsroman and characterization that she defies her mother’s wishes and sacrifices/risks everything she’s ever known to leave paradise and help the unknown-to-her outside world.

Thematically it fits her character and is part of her hero’s journey.

[marhawkman]

I kind of see it your way with a twist:The goddesses may have known just how special Diana was and that she was going to win the Tournament, but I do not believe Diana herself, nor Hippolyta nor any other Amazon knew. Yes, Diana may have trained, but she used the speed, force, strength, etc used against her back on her opponent. This take works for the first Tournament. Now, subsequent ones would be unfair if Diana participated because no other Amazon is even close, except maybe Donna and Nubia.

One way to look at it is that innate ability was one of the selection criteria. IE: Which Amazon is most powerful? from that PoV if one of them has an "unfair" advantage... that's the point of the test. to find out. Which is seen as a good thing in this context. you want to know who is the strongest. WHY they are strongest is less important.

[Phoenixx9]

One way to look at it is that innate ability was one of the selection criteria. IE: Which Amazon is most powerful? from that PoV if one of them has an "unfair" advantage... that's the point of the test. to find out. Which is seen as a good thing in this context. you want to know who is the strongest. WHY they are strongest is less important.

Why yes, lol, I understand all of that = the reason for the Tournament, but I've never read where all the Amazons are <<about>> Diana's level of strength, speed, agility, durability, senses, wisdom, courage, endurance, skill at bullets/bracelets, etc. And that's the point.

Diana is not just a "smidge" above all the others in her abilities, Diana is a multitude of times higher. Almost always it is stated or implied that the Amazons have the strength of about 6-10 humans. Diana is far stronger than 600 humans! Even Donna cannot win against Diana. Nubia, if her old abilities still apply at the same level, is supposed to be her equal.

I did state that originally, no one knew about Amazon discrepancies. So the first Tournament where Diana competed was fine. But the Tournament showed that they did exist. I am saying that going forward, a second, third or fourth Tournament would not be fair to include Diana, unless there were many other Wonder Women competing against her.

[marhawkman]

Why yes, lol, I understand all of that = the reason for the Tournament, but I've never read where all the Amazons are <<about>> Diana's level of strength, speed, agility, durability, senses, wisdom, courage, endurance, skill at bullets/bracelets, etc. And that's the point.

Diana is not just a "smidge" above all the others in her abilities, Diana is a multitude of times higher. Almost always it is stated or implied that the Amazons have the strength of about 6-10 humans. Diana is far stronger than 600 humans! Even Donna cannot win against Diana. Nubia, if her old abilities still apply at the same level, is supposed to be her equal.

I did state that originally, no one knew about Amazon discrepancies. So the first Tournament where Diana competed was fine. But the Tournament showed that they did exist. I am saying that going forward, a second, third or fourth Tournament would not be fair to include Diana, unless there were many other Wonder Women competing against her.

It's a good point that it seems questionable to have a contest where one entrant is an obvious favorite, for obvious reasons. but that assumes everyone knows the stats of the contestants. so if it's a foregone conclusion, why even have a contest?

[Phoenixx9]

It's a good point that it seems questionable to have a contest where one entrant is an obvious favorite, for obvious reasons. but that assumes everyone knows the stats of the contestants. so if it's a foregone conclusion, why even have a contest?

Not what I am saying.

All of the other Amazons (minus the few I already mentioned and perhaps a few others like Hippolyta, Artemis, etc) are like humans: they are all in the same basic ballpark range, but there are still many various differences that exist.

For instance, measure your physical abilities to those of your parents, siblings, cousins, neighbors, etc. There may be one that is a true athlete, being stronger, faster, more courageous, nimble, etc, than all of the others. Another example is if you watch the TV show Survivor, there is usually 1 person per season who is the best at physical and mental challenges, the one that can do all of the challenges, even though they may not appear to be the one that would excel.

That is what the Tournament is for and what it is seeking: the best Amazon. No one on Paradise knows who that is out of all of the Amazons. But everyone NOW knows what Diana can do. That is why I say to have a New Tournament now with Diana in it is not really fair at all.

Or...are you saying Diana is not the best Amazon? That all of her sisters are at her level of abilities? That Diana won but someone else could have?

[marhawkman]

Not what I am saying.

All of the other Amazons (minus the few I already mentioned and perhaps a few others like Hippolyta, Artemis, etc) are like humans: they are all in the same basic ballpark range, but there are still many various differences that exist.

For instance, measure your physical abilities to those of your parents, siblings, cousins, neighbors, etc. There may be one that is a true athlete, being stronger, faster, more courageous, nimble, etc, than all of the others. Another example is if you watch the TV show Survivor, there is usually 1 person per season who is the best at physical and mental challenges, the one that can do all of the challenges, even though they may not appear to be the one that would excel.

That is what the Tournament is for and what it is seeking: the best Amazon. No one on Paradise knows who that is out of all of the Amazons. But everyone NOW knows what Diana can do. That is why I say to have a New Tournament now with Diana in it is not really fair at all.

Or...are you saying Diana is not the best Amazon? That all of her sisters are at her level of abilities? That Diana won but someone else could have?

Well, I was suggesting that the concept of the contest makes more sense if you don't have a clear winner already determined before the contest starts.

[Phoenixx9]

Well, I was suggesting that the concept of the contest makes more sense if you don't have a clear winner already determined before the contest starts.

Yes, there is no clear winner already determined before the contest starts.

[marhawkman]

Yes, there is no clear winner already determined before the contest starts.

Yeah, but my point was that having a contest NEEDS doubt as to who should hold the title of champion. you're doing it to find out who is the champion.

[Phoenixx9]

Yeah, but my point was that having a contest NEEDS doubt as to who should hold the title of champion. you're doing it to find out who is the champion.

Yes, I understand WHY the Tournament was held, lol.

The Amazons were trying to find the best and most capable Amazon to be The Champion of the Amazons to the outside world.

[Jon Clark]

Yes, I understand WHY the Tournament was held, lol.

The Amazons were trying to find the best and most capable Amazon to be The Champion of the Amazons to the outside world.

The thing is if Diana is on Superman's level (or even above it) from childhood then is there any "doubt"? Would you really think the contest made sense if you had a team of track and field stars racing Wally West?

Is there any point to a contest when one (and only one) of the people is regularly performing at a 20 on a scale that stops at 10, and every other member is performing on their best day at a 10 in maybe two areas being tested?