Legion of Super-Heroes Appreciation 2023

[Robotman]

Never read much Legion comics, but I have a soft spot for the franchise due to having watched the cartoon as a kid. Great stuff.

I have to say, I think the cartoon has some of the best looks for some of the characters compared to how they look in the comics

Like I can't help but find comic Timber Wolf looking kind of bland next to his show self especially since he was one of my favorite characters while it was airing

Timber Wolf was Wolverine before Wolverine.



Artist Dave Cockrum redesigned Timber Wolf in 1973 before he jumped to Marvel and helped give Logan his finished (unmasked) look.

[Uncanny X-Man]

I wish DC would finally get around to getting more Legion in trades. For a while there they were really good then it dropped back to nothing. There is still so much great stuff not collected. Most of the Levitz run has still never been collected in any form.. Of the 63 issues of the Levitz "baxter" series only the first 13 issues were in trades and those came out almost 15 years ago now. So many great stories like Who is Sensor Girl, The Death of Superboy, The Universo Project, Conspiracy, and The Magic Wars never collected. Same with the Reboot era there has to be a good 50 issues uncollected in trades.

This 100%. There's entire generations of readers who basically never got the chance to read the Baxter series, which in my book is the best the classic Legion has ever been, unless they turned to the back-issue bins or piracy. Those 63 issue are all outstanding and have hardly a weak spot or a filler, feature some exquisite art by Giffen, Lightle and Laroque and in my mind belong on the same breath as Wolfman/Perez's New Teen Titans, Claremont's X-Men, Byrne's Fantastic Four, Morrison's Doom Patrol etc when talking about best team books of all time. This truly is a blindspot on DC's part which I hope will get rectified eventually.

[kcekada]

You need to take a second look at the art and writing credits. That period I was talking about--when the book was double-sized--Levitz was the main writer--with others like Shooter, Conway--and Jim Sherman did a lot of the art--with other work from the likes of Mike Grell, Mike Netzer and Jim Starlin. Toward the end there, Joe Staton started to do the art.

Yes, you're correct. I'm thinking primarily of the run with Staton, Janes and Ditko. Writing may have been Conway/Thomas -- not their best work. I loved when Sherman came onto the book, but it was towards the time when I dropped DC to read Marvel exclusively (until the early 80s when New Teen Titans brought me back to DC). I actually preferred him to Grell (whose characters on his run varied from looking very good to looking very posed). But after Sherman left, the book went through a long dry spell -- and didn't become a fan favorite again until Giffen came back.

I disagree about art vs. writing. But I would because I'm totally out of it and don't have an appreciation for that stuff. I mean I like John Forte art. I liked Jim Shooter's writing even when there was no consistent artist. I liked Cary Bates writing.

.

Well, people like what they like -- but I'm saying the book was most popular when it had top tier artists -- at least in the Bronze Age. Don't really know how popular it was when Forte was doing art -- I'm sure it sold well as everything with a member of the Superman family did in those days. Levtiz with Broderick and Laroque wasn't as popular as Levtiz with Giffen and Lightle.[/quote]

[kcekada]

Timber Wolf was Wolverine before Wolverine.

Artist Dave Cockrum redesigned Timber Wolf in 1973 before he jumped to Marvel and helped give Logan his finished (unmasked) look.

Ah yes. I actually put that piece of art together for an article several years ago concerning Legion action figures. For whatever reason, Levtiz dropped the Cockrum designed face -- and thereafter, Timber Wolf only looked feral when he was fighting. It was a mistake on Levtiz's part, IMHO. I think both he and Waid tended to favor the Silver Age characters, but Waid was worse than Levtiz.

Speaking of action figures, Marvel Legends is producing a Fang action figure. For those who don't know -- Fang is Marvel's version of Timber Wolf. He's part of the Imperial Guard created by Dave Cockrum -- with most of its members being based on the 70s Legion.

https://www.reddit.com/r/MarvelLegen..._legends_fang/

[caj]

If you haven't already, you can vote for your favorite version of the Legion of Super Heroes here:

https://community.cbr.com/showthread...-Heroes/page21

[Timber Wolf-By-Night]

Ah yes. I actually put that piece of art together for an article several years ago concerning Legion action figures. For whatever reason, Levtiz dropped the Cockrum designed face -- and thereafter, Timber Wolf only looked feral when he was fighting. It was a mistake on Levtiz's part, IMHO. I think both he and Waid tended to favor the Silver Age characters, but Waid was worse than Levtiz.

Speaking of action figures, Marvel Legends is producing a Fang action figure. For those who don't know -- Fang is Marvel's version of Timber Wolf. He's part of the Imperial Guard created by Dave Cockrum -- with most of its members being based on the 70s Legion.

https://www.reddit.com/r/MarvelLegen..._legends_fang/

Ah, yes. The beginning of Levitz's years-long commitment to portraying Timber Wolf as a weak-willed pathetic loser who was looked down upon by most the rest of the Legion for, alternately, either being considered the least intelligent Legionnaire ever or for letting Ayla Ranzz break up with him and leave while he stayed behind with the Legion. To the point that even the letters that Levitz published in the letter column started complaining about it until he finally put the spotlight back on him with LSH (Baxter series) #13 (the trip to planet Lythyl to fulfill Val Armorr's last will and testament).

Weirdly enough, after that he started portraying Ultra Boy, whom he'd previously portrayed as a reasonably intelligent and competent Legionnaire, as a muscle-bound doofus. To the point that the Bierbaums, whose writing I don't care for normally, dedicated the first Five Years Later Legion Annual to retconning his portrayal of Ultra Boy to being an act on Jo's part.

I've never understood why Levitz decided to do that to either character. Maybe he'd been bullied as a kid by a musclebound brunette?

[kcekada]

It just goes to show that even on good runs -- writers have made mistakes, and Levitz was no exception. That baxter issue spotlighting Timber Wolf is one of the best of that series -- towards the end of Lightle's. The character went through some pretty bad outifts during Giffen's run - but Lightle corrected a lot of Giffen's bad costume changes.

[j9ac9k]

It just goes to show that even on good runs -- writers have made mistakes, and Levitz was no exception. That baxter issue spotlighting Timber Wolf is one of the best of that series -- towards the end of Lightle's. The character went through some pretty bad outifts during Giffen's run - but Lightle corrected a lot of Giffen's bad costume changes.

Ohhh, that "deep, deep V" that went down to his belt buckle. So much chest hair.... was that one of Giffen's?

[M@Bowers2014]

Ohhh, that "deep, deep V" that went down to his belt buckle. So much chest hair.... was that one of Giffen's?

I actually think George Perez designed that one even though Timber Wolf first wore it during Giffen's run. That design first appeared in DC Blue Ribbon Digest that featured character "pin-ups" by Perez in the back. Some of these "pin-ups" had brand new costume designs. Specifically Timber Wolf, Blok (his "gladiator" costume) and slight re-designs for Princess Projectra, Shadow Lass and Phantom Girl.

Legion.jpg

https://www.bing.com/images/search?v...t=0&ajaxserp=0

[Jim Kelly]

Maybe for guys like Paul Levitz and Jim Shooter, Timber Wolf hadn't made enough of an impression on them as kids, when they first got into the Legion of Super-Heroes, since Brin Londo wasn't such a big deal at that time.

Paul Levitz became interested in the L.S.H. during their early run in ADVENTURE COMICS--he recalls issue 310 (July 1963) as his first issue, when he would have been six years old (see LEGION COMPANION, 2003). That was when Edmond Hamilton and Jerry Siegel were the writers and John Forte was the artist. Forte had an odd pencilling style, but he was a great inker (one of the best to ink Curt Swan).

In 1971, when Paul Levitz was fourteen he began publishing fanzines with his friend, Paul Kupperberg, who was fifteen--THE COMIC READER and ETCETERA. And Levitz became a key player in Legion fandom and I expect his allegiances to certain characters were already set in concrete.

Back in 1965, when Jim Shooter was fourteen, he had begun writing and drawing the Legion (other artists would finish the art based on Shooter's drawings). Mort Weisinger offered him the job, after Jim had mailed his own home-made comic books to Mort.

Timber Wolf first appeared in ADVENTURE COMICS 327 (December 1964)--1st story, "The Lone Wolf Legionnaire" by Hamilton and Forte. This was reprinted in SUPERBOY 178 (October 1971)--which is where I first read the story. And when I read it, I thought it was one of the best written and illustrated stories I'd seen. I always remember how it made me feel to read the tragic tale of Brin Londo.

Yet the Lone Wolf didn't return until ADVENTURE COMICS 372 (September 1968)--"School for Super-Villains" by Shooter, Swan and Abel. In the intervening four years, apparently, he had been at the Legion Academy. Timber Wolf was present in a handful of stories after that, but then in SUPERBOY 197 (September 1973)--1st story, "Timber Wolf Dead Hero, Live Executioner" by Bates and Cockrum--Brin Londo returned from the dead?!!??

In a previously undisclosed adventure, Clark thought Timber Wolf had died in a planetoid explosion and was wracked with grief over the loss of his friend. Thus Superboy's relief when he sees Brin Londo in fighting trim. In the Legion adventure just prior--SUPERBOY 195 (June 1973)--ERG-1 (Drake Burroughs) had sacrificed his life and was presumed dead--Cary Bates seemed determined to kill off at least one of the Legionnaires for good. "Timber Wolf Dead Hero…" is also the tale where Cockrum gave Brin his new look--perhaps his death experience had something to do with that. But none of the Legionnaires comment on the change (maybe in the 30th century such alterations aren't even worth noting).

Paul Levitz, now working as an editorial assistant at National Periodicals, talked up the Bates and Cockrum L.S.H. in the "Behind the Scenes" column, in the November 1973 issues. Still, while the rest of us might have thought this new Timber Wolf was cool, by then Levitz was probably too busy balancing work and education to have formed an attachment.

[kcekada]

That purple/violet combination was weird, but it was re-colored as orange/tan and black/gray when it debuted. It didn't bother me as much as Brin looking so normal. Brin could have (should have) been a breakout star after Cockrum redesigned him and Bates featured him in the first full-length Superboy & the Legion issue. But he rarely got used well after that.

I hate the next costume Brin wore -- looked like orange and gray pajamas (no black/shadowing). Lightle's redesign was a big improvement -- but still preferred feral Brin.

[M@Bowers2014]

I always assumed that the purple/violet combo for that Brin costume was a coloring mistake but who knows? I'll always prefer Brin with his Cockrum design but that is also how I was introduced to the character. Having said that I didn't hate what Levitz did with him even though he lost his feral look. At least it fleshed out his character more and he got used a lot more during that era than before. Honestly though I hope we see a return of the Cockrum look when the Legion returns under Geoff Johns.

[kcekada]

Even though he's a good artist, Gary Frank's designs for most of the retroboot Legion did not help make the team look dyamic as Cockrum's designs did back in the day. Frank also seemed more influenced by the Silver Age -- but added a lot of crap in an attempt to make them look edgy.

[M@Bowers2014]

Even though he's a good artist, Gary Frank's designs for most of the retroboot Legion did not help make the team look dyamic as Cockrum's designs did back in the day. Frank also seemed more influenced by the Silver Age -- but added a lot of crap in an attempt to make them look edgy.

I agree even though I love Frank's work overall. I didn't hate his Legion designs but I didn't love them either. I'd be happy for most of them to be ignored if we get the Retroboot version of the team back again. I also hope Ayla gets a better design if she is Lightning Lass again. I haven't liked any of her Lightning Lass looks. But honestly I hope she is Light Lass/Gossamer again instead with a design inspired by her 1970's look.

[Nomads1]

I've been reading Legion since the early-mid 70's. My first Legion story was the return of Timber Wolf by Bates and Cockrum (SatLSH 196, if I'm not mistaken) in a brazilian version of the book. Eventually, I got to read everything since that issue and before it, falling in love with the concept. As with the original Star Trek, what I most liked about it was the positive outlook of the future, a reason why I think the 5YL direction was a mistake, with it's grittier and darker tone. Gone was the shinning, positive future. Heck, they even destroyed the Earth. And that is why I liked so much the Post-Zero Hour reboot. It brought back the fun to the book. It gave the characters more distinctive personalities, it brought in new and strange members such as Gates (a favorite), it gave us an update on many of the super-heroes names, distancing a bit from the "eveything girl, boy, kid, lad, lass", which, while it had it's charms, IMHO, needed to go. It gave us more depth on the heroes and the villains backstories. The first two years are awsome. Then, it slows down a bit, especially after the team is split in two, with half being strandered in the past. I prefered Legionnaries during that period (even if I was not much of a fan of Moy's art. I think the cuttie art was a huge impedment for the book to really become a hit.), probably due to Roger Stern's writing, always a favorite of mine. After the team was reunited and split again into an Earth based team and an Outpost team, IMHO, the stories started to become dull and repeatative (I hated the Brianiac 5.1 update). DnA taking over the team with more edgy art and more mature stories was, IMHO, great. Then came the Threebot, unexplainably ending this great era. I never understood why, with some small tweaking, Waid and Kitson couldn't have told their story with the Reboot Legion. Such a waste.

If your looking for a good start to the Reboot era there are two thick trades that collect the first few years. I wish they would do at least one more since the upcoming stuff was so good.

Yes, a third volume would have featured the conclusion of the Fatal Five/the Big Conspiracy storyline, rounding up the first two years of stories, IMHO, the best of the Reboot.

Peace