Personal Wonder Woman Head-Canon

[Perseus]

Where do you place the Island, cosmologically/geographically speaking? Is it a place you can sail to, or is it somehow disconnected and you can only get there under specific circumstances?

I was always vague on Numenor, having never read the Silmarillion. Hobbit and LotR was enough; Tolkien was a creative genius but so dry a writer even Frank Hurbert looks kinetic. Is it other-dimensional somehow, or was it just really far away?

Interesting question, it's hard to pinpoint imo. I guess if I had it my way it would be a weird sort of in-between. If I had it my way Themyscira would be part of a sort of fantastical divine realm, something like taking an old Greek world map with all the mythical tribes, races, monsters, and cities and expanding it even further. It's still an Island but part of a world map. Something akin to the map of Elden Ring or the current Zelda games (BotW and KotK). It would be this vast cosmic/mythic world that you could explore with Diana and the other wonders without having it bring them into a new city in our world every new run. You could even tie it to another head canon of this divine realm bleeding into the 'real world', like a pressure release system gone broken and now minotaurs are rampaging in Gateway City, for example. However, Themyscira also exists in our world, somewhere on the Mediterranean Sea, but the only way you're going to get there is by proxy i.e. the Gods allowing you to go there or Diana/Nubia being champions or Hippolyta being queen (this is still my head canon where she is) can grant you passage. Maybe a sort of medallion that opens a gateway or a ritual right. Obviously breaking in would be next to impossible via wards placed by the Patrons or even Amazon mages. Point is you can go there, but you're now a part of this fantasy world. It's not really heaven or an afterlife, but it's not the regular world either. The other city-states of the Amazons would work the same.

Edit: The teleport systems on Embassy Island would take you to Themyscira too. Embassy Island should have had more debate and continue to be a contentious point within amazon politics. Even have a short story on it. Because its easy access to their mainland on foreign waters in a world with governments that are wary of the amazons and filled with super-villains and terrorists, while Embassy Island has little defenses.

And to answer on Numenor, it's basically both too Like its a place on a map you could theoretically go to it, but it's also close to basically elven heaven.

[Perseus]

The Amazons have strong relations with the Chothic Gods of the Underworld like Persephone and Charon. Due to Dooms doorway being basically a portal to Tartarus and Nubia having been its champion I would imagine the 'higher ups' of Hades would actually be working with the amazons to prevent escapes and demon rampages not the other way around.

[Ascended]

Interesting question, it's hard to pinpoint imo. I guess if I had it my way it would be a weird sort of in-between.

Not far off from my own head canon. I figure Themyscria has been 'folded' along the edge of the god sphere, so it's a physical place occupying a metaphysical space. The Island is 'there' but not; you're won't see it unless something/someone allows it, much less set foot on it. But it's absolutely a physical location.

I also head canon that Themyscria sits on a convergence of ley lines. Atlantis too, Fate's Tower, any other major points of magical power that I'm too tired to remember right now. I feel like some WW books have said as much but I don't trust my memory at the moment (long week at work). Oh, Bludhaven too. I head canon that when Darkseid entered the physical world in Final Crisis, it warped earth's energy fields, and ley lines were twisted around Bludhaven (ground zero for that invasion).

And to answer on Numenor, it's basically both too Like its a place on a map you could theoretically go to it, but it's also close to basically elven heaven.

Tolkien elves are an odd bunch.

Ever read Sanderson's Stormlight Archive? If you like the big epic mega-series like Wheel of Time or LotR then Stormlight is probably right up your alley.

Oh, I got a Donna head canon that'll annoy some folks. I don't really subscribe to this idea, it's not something I champion or anything, but I do like it as a funny tale. Anyway, my head canon is that Donna is in fact, Young Diana. As everyone probably recalls "Wonder Girl" was originally just young Diana having adventures, sometimes traveling through time. "Donna" was only created because the Titans creators and editors didn't know Wonder Girl was just teen Diana. So in my head (kind of not really) 'Donna' is just an alias Young Diana goes by. Every time Donna's origin changes, it's young Diana changing her story (because she's bad at lying). But DC's Crisis Events and the way they screw with time have a weird reaction to a demigod traveling through history so sometimes Diana actually believes her own stories and truly thinks she's Donna, and timelines make room for 'Donna' to exist. That's why Donna can't have a stable origin, there *is* no Donna, just a universe trying to accommodate a lie told by the time-jumping teenaged goddess of truth.

[marhawkman]

Tolkein had the idea that some places in the world are just inherently special and not "normal". but there's reasons for it, even if mere mortals don't understand the reasons. Valinor is the Elf homeland and has these two trees that basically radiate a light that makes everyone that sees it feel more alive. Well, and also more powerful in terms of ability to wield magic. (Numenor was a Human kingdom that was destroyed long ago)

[Stanlos]

Gotta love those Tolkien names!

I like how Byrne and later Phil had it outside time and space with the ability touch this plane anywhere and anywhen.

[marhawkman]

yeah having themiscyra as a pocket dimension was a cool idea.

[Gaius]

My view of the island's location is it's also shifting it's location. One year it could be in the Mediterranean and then in the next the South Pacific, it's environment being maintained by the God's magic and shielding that hid it from the world prior to Steve's arrival/Diana leaving.

[Ascended]

Here's another.

I'm not terribly picky about which goddesses gave life to Diana, as long as they're goddesses (no dudes required here). But I prefer the god/s who first brought the Amazons to the Island to be the same one/s to give Diana life.

Don't recall off the top of my head if this has ever *not* been the case but if so, I mildly disagree with the notion.

[SiegePerilous02]

Here's another.

I'm not terribly picky about which goddesses gave life to Diana, as long as they're goddesses (no dudes required here). But I prefer the god/s who first brought the Amazons to the Island to be the same one/s to give Diana life.

Don't recall off the top of my head if this has ever *not* been the case but if so, I mildly disagree with the notion.

It's played with in a very interesting way in "Historia"

[Perseus]

I actually think the amazons would build temples to some of the male deities. Asclepius for one, being a god of medicine and healing. Hephaestus for building and crafts. They'd have something for both Persephone and Hades. Probably minor Hermes statues to mark important sites or grounds.

I honestly think this 'no men allowed' stuff is childish. Like I get not wanting Zeus or Hades or really any of the Gods to be Diana's dad. But to have no Gods be allies of the Amazons is just very bad optically to me. I feel the same way about how some people react when a dude walks around Themyscira and it's met with harshness. Like it really is just Men vs Women, Us vs Them type stuff, it just feels like a bad 80's or 90's boys vs girls sitcom episode. There is no nuance or discussion going down this path, you just place half the population as antagonistic/un-welcomed. It's setting the world up for easy bad criticism and there is no defense against it, because they'd frankly be right.

I'm all for Diana being sculpted from clay, I probably wouldn't have any of the Gods give her life. But I also want Hippolyta and her 3 sisters to be daughters of Ares. And I also believe that Hermes should be the one to give her speed and flight.

[WonderScott]

I think of Themyscira like Otherworld or the Fae Realm, where it overlaps the our world in its location but it’s not easy to access under normal means.

I really liked Perez’s depiction of the chaos storm that manifests when you approach it and does not allow you to find it. I’d do the same with ships sailing on the surface if the water, underwater currents and turbulence if you approach that way, or shifting earth and mud if you tried to dig your way to it from underground.

The goddesses can allow access, if they see fit to. (E.G. Steve Trevor as part of the prophecy to propel Diana forward to stop Ares.) After revealing themselves to the world, Amazons have the ability to navigate to and from the island - up until then, only Donna and Diana were coming to and from the island. Amazon scientists developed technology for portals to the island, currently the only one being in the Amazon embassy in Patriarch’s World. Another way to the island is traveling through Hades and the underworld to that side of Doom’s Doorway and breaking through it.

The chaos effect affects everyone excluding the Olympians and it’s harder of the gods who aren’t the matrons of the island to access it. Teleporters and boom tubes or other technology (Angle Man’s angler) cannot traverse the chaos effect unless it’s weakened or dropped. There are a number of smaller islands offshore in the Themyscira archipelago and they are all protected by the chaos effect.

[Ascended]

I actually think the amazons would build temples to some of the male deities.

I agree that Amazons don't exclude the male gods from their worship. But I don't think they view the divine hierarchy the same way we do. I feel like the Amazons would view the male gods as....I don't want to say 'secondary' or 'lesser' but....I can't find the right word. I think they give thanks to the male gods and prayers when it's appropriate, but its the goddesses that get the majority of worship, holidays, etc. Hera's temple is *way* nicer than Zeus'. And I'd think that whatever god/s led the Amazons to the Island, they'd have a special place in Amazonian faith.

If Zeus or some other male god walked onto Themyscria, I think he'd certainly be allowed and welcomed (excluding any running conflict, as sometimes happens). He might not equal Hera or Athena or whoever in their eyes but he's still one of their gods. But I think it'd be seen as being in poor taste? And past the male gods and their servants I don't think any man should be allowed to set foot on the Island. Steve's the exception in my mind, but that's not a place where I need to be allowed, y'know? If I get to have my man cave, then my wife should get her Themyscria.

Although...I do favor there being harpies and satyrs and cyclopes and other mythical creatures on the Island that aren't necessarily immortal, so I suppose there has to be some males. Just not human ones?

I think of Themyscira like Otherworld or the Fae Realm, where it overlaps the our world in its location but it’s not easy to access under normal means.

....yes, that's it exactly. Nice.

[Perseus]

I agree that Amazons don't exclude the male gods from their worship. But I don't think they view the divine hierarchy the same way we do. I feel like the Amazons would view the male gods as....I don't want to say 'secondary' or 'lesser' but....I can't find the right word. I think they give thanks to the male gods and prayers when it's appropriate, but its the goddesses that get the majority of worship, holidays, etc. Hera's temple is *way* nicer than Zeus'. And I'd think that whatever god/s led the Amazons to the Island, they'd have a special place in Amazonian faith.

If Zeus or some other male god walked onto Themyscria, I think he'd certainly be allowed and welcomed (excluding any running conflict, as sometimes happens). He might not equal Hera or Athena or whoever in their eyes but he's still one of their gods. But I think it'd be seen as being in poor taste? And past the male gods and their servants I don't think any man should be allowed to set foot on the Island. Steve's the exception in my mind, but that's not a place where I need to be allowed, y'know? If I get to have my man cave, then my wife should get her Themyscria.

Although...I do favor there being harpies and satyrs and cyclopes and other mythical creatures on the Island that aren't necessarily immortal, so I suppose there has to be some males. Just not human ones?

You know the Temple of Olympian Zeus in Athens? How massive and glorious it was, when it was finally finished? I imagine that the amazons have something similar but ONLY for Hera. On the contrary to the Male Gods having temples though. While I do think that Hermes would get minor statues and Asclepius, Hephaestus, and even Hades w/ Persephone would get temples I don't think for a second that Zeus, Poseidon, Apollo, or say Pan would get a temple. They aren't allies, why build something dedicated to them? Temples were built in cities to say 'this god has a home here' and Zeus etc... would not have one. Even Dionysus would have a theater or two that also serves as a temple.

Instead of Poseidon I can see the Amazons worshiping his wife. Aphrodite can also pull double duty as a goddess to worship the seas. I ironically think Ares would have a temple though, a very small one specifically in the royal palace due to fathering Hippolyta and her sisters, but that would be the only one. Demeter and Artemis would probably share a sacred grove or woods on top of a temple or two. Gaia would have her own thing and so on.

I do agree that 'male' animals both real and mythic should be on the island, that seems a bit too arbitrary of the 'no men allowed' rule, since animals aren't human. But, I just don't get the hissy fit when someone with a peepee steps on the island. It was actually really cringe when in the Nu52 the amazons joked about castrating Hermes and talked about 'smelling his musk', I found it pedantic, I would like to think others did too. The 'no men' rule gives us amazons like Aresia from the animated JL, who had her whole world view turned around when she found out *gasp* a MAN saved her life. It builds caricatures not characters. Have the amazons be wary of outsiders, have them be cautious of some men, but they're on an island where they truly believe no one else but a god can enter, having a rule that says 'no men allowed' seems a bit pointless.

Lets say Zeus wants to visit Themyscira, he would have the right of hospitality on his side so the amazons would treat him with courtesy. But it's still uneasy, right, because why would he want to, he doesn't like them so there is always the ulterior motive. It would be a pretty tense situation, if well written could be a great scene in a story.

I don't like the idea of Themyscira as being the woman equivalent to a man-cave, I don't like man-caves in general. If you want a personal space to call your own, it's a customized office, not a man/woman cave. Themyscira is also a city and cities don't function as man-caves either. Diana is supposed to challenge norms and traditions that are antithetical to a better world. To break the wheel, so to speak. That means reflecting on Themyscira too and an isolated city, is not a healthy one. Does the patriarch's world have anything to offer the amazons? No. But you need to have some relations so as not to breed fear, mistrust, anger, and contempt that could lead to nationalism or worse.

Another head canon of mine is that the amazons were/are star explorers, they worship the night sky and are somewhat guided by it like fate. So with advanced tech they build spaceships and made contact with other aliens (the ones that Diana and her verse mostly interact with). This is where the alien kangas come in and maybe alien plants/wildlife that the amazons saved from extinction. The royal palace would have a sacred garden filled with alien wildlife that they care for but special gardeners called caretakers, worshipers of Demeter.

[Stanlos]

Another head canon of mine is that the amazons were/are star explorers, they worship the night sky and are somewhat guided by it like fate. So with advanced tech they build spaceships and made contact with other aliens (the ones that Diana and her verse mostly interact with). This is where the alien kangas come in and maybe alien plants/wildlife that the amazons saved from extinction. The royal palace would have a sacred garden filled with alien wildlife that they care for but special gardeners called caretakers, worshipers of Demeter.

I also see this but in my headcannon it is not space. They did that eons ago in their past as they developed. I am thinking they explore other realms and planes and are known to all pantheons as kind of cosmic ombudsmen and peace keepers. Sort of like blending that Joe Kelly Valhalla story and the vision that Phil had for the Floating Paradise Isles.

[Perseus]

I also see this but in my headcannon it is not space. They did that eons ago in their past as they developed. I am thinking they explore other realms and planes and are known to all pantheons as kind of cosmic ombudsmen and peace keepers. Sort of like blending that Joe Kelly Valhalla story and the vision that Phil had for the Floating Paradise Isles.

You know that could work with both. In Skyrim lore the sky above isn't just a sky but a different plane of existence that holds other realms. There are still stars and all but say for example that one big planet looking thing isn't actually a planet but a portal to the realm of giants or something. If we also keep the head canon of Themyscira being in a different plane of existence too of course.

I just like Diana being in that mix between syfy and fantasy. I mean she was doing things that He-man and classic Thor were doing before those two were even thoughts.