Did Black Lightning completely miss his chance to become an A-list character?

[lemonpeace]

I evoke the power of Nekron, and command this dead thread to...


so I thought this is an intriguing thread, i haven't read the old posts but I'm interested to see how people feel about Jeff's odds now; half a decade after this thread's inception.

[j9ac9k]

Considering he has a tv show, I don't think one could say that "he's completely missed his chance" at A-List. Outsiders just ended, (which I would have much preferred to be his book with only a bit of Batman, but of course the Bat was all over it) so hopefully he'll get another book of some kind. I hope the show picks up creatively now that they're part of Earth Prime and builds his exposure. I'm hoping they lean more into super heroing now that the seige of Freeland is over, but the future of any show is uncertain with covid causing all kinds of problems. I know there's a contingent out there that gets butthurt when comics dare to promote diversity, but if DC is going to do anything to put their money where their mouth is on this issue, it would be silly to not give BL a title -- again, he has a tv show!

[Iconic]

I’d love to see his star elevated with DC’s new direction in 2021. Looking back I feel his “turning down” the league back in the day was a misstep. Had that happened, nostalgia would have driven so much in terms of where he would have stood by now.

[Dred]

I don't think any older iteration character is ever becoming A-list again. The only time it's happened in the last 20 years is through Batman association (Harley Quinn).

[Samm]

Honestly no, he hasn’t missed his chance, he could have been there already but all that drama between his creator and DC prevented it. Right now he’s in a good position, he has his own tv show, was a main character on season 3 of YJ and was a skin for Raiden in Injustice 2. Becoming A-list doesn’t happen over night, it requires years and years to build up and backing form the company. Right now he isn’t A-list but he is on a good path towards achieving that, he just needs his own solo comic, his show to continue on, be playable in Injustice 3, and appear in DC animation constantly however I do feel a big screen adaption would instantly make him A-list

[The no face guy]

Yes in that they should have pushed him more because he is a popular original character, and original heroes always have a better chance of developing (Black Panther, Blade, Luke Cage) because they are not duplicates in someone else's shadow. (Ie John Stewart, Kendra Saunders) ect,

Unfortunately, the latter is DC's preference, which is why Marvel has the better name brand recognition when it comes to African American heroes, but the Black Lightning tv show has been successful, something to build on.

[married guy]

I don't believe it has.
I think the TV is consistently EXCELLENT. If DC could find a way to transition the viewers into readers it'd be a smash.
I will say he gets VERY little love in the DCU.
It was great when he was a member of the Justice League - it was a shame it was when the book wasn't particularly good. The numbers for his last mini series were pretty dreadful, and this was written by Tony Isabella!

116 Black Lightning Cold Dead Hands 1 $3.99 DC 18,750
166 Black Lightning Cold Dead Hands 2 $3.99 12/06/17 DC 10,510
189 Black Lightning Cold Dead Hands 3 $3.99 01/03/18 DC 9,014
190 Black Lightning Cold Dead Hands 4 $3.99 02/07/18 DC 8,277
196 Black Lightning Cold Dead Hands 5 $3.99 03/07/18 DC 8,113
210 Black Lightning Cold Dead Hands 6 $3.99 04/04/18 DC 7,824

[4sake Baned]

One of the reasons that last miniseries sold so poorly. Worth it presented a version of the character that the vast majority of black lightning fan base weather comics or non-comic Worth it presented a version of the character that the vast majority of black lightning fan base weather comics or non-comic fans didn’t want to read. They did absolutely nothing to move him forward in any single way unlike the outsiders book that ending soon. It was a mix of random nostalgia and random new ideas that no one even considered or has asked for. Written by his cocreator who’s going on the record several times to hate almost all of the add-ons/changes that have happened in Black lightning since he originally first stop writing him. Do you preferred to present a version of the character that he must like and also a very small group fans of BL like.

So we got random things like lien being British for some reason, daughters being random new cousins, and if I recall correctly his sister and his cousins ( her kids ) nowhere to be found. Which once again isn’t shocking because that majority of those characters which overall health black lightning are supporting characters were not created by Tony. So he presents those characters in ways in which they can be ignored or not use So he presents those characters in ways in which they can be ignored or not use way that best overall. If you want to make changes to Lynn make her an accomplice science test and a genius or super genius & or reveal she is John Stewart sister ( something that has been in an ad in an interview or two over the years ). You want to make changes to his daughters then you introduce them as a his preteen / teens Daughters Instead of adults as they were before the new timeline & etc. Do you want to change his family dynamic at general. Well you decide if you’re going to go with the show version and he’s an only child or Go with how it was an old Community where he had a sister. Also you can decide now if you want to introduce a version of gravedigger that’s related to him. Those are things that build up the character and not put them in a stagnant place.

Nostalgia in itself isn’t inherently bad we get remakes of older thing almost every year a great example is ducktails reboot overall is wonderful and a vast improvement over the original. See if you are a fan of black lightning who doesn’t read comics and you watch the TV show are you watching last season of young justice or you watch the DC nation short. And decide you know what I want to read comments about that version of the characters do you get to the comics and you can find almost nothing like that Currently what do you do you spend your money on something else mcurrently what do you do you spend your money on something else lol. But hopefully some of that is correct in the series John R is doing. In our interview or two he’s mention Lightning and thunderbLightning and thunder will i’ll tear in it and they have been referred to as black lightning’s daughters, So hopefully when they make it a page that what they will be referred ass so hopefully when they make it a page that what they will be referred as to be not random cousins smh. And from there you need a writer ( Not Tony, for the love of everything keep Tony far away from black lightning as possible ) to do an overall on his myths & build the character up even further.

[Besouro]

this (even from a banned guy).

Wanna make any DC (or otherwise) character A-list? Put a superstar creative team on him, then give him a blockbuster, well-crafted movie. I.e. the Guardians of the Galaxy strategy.

For Black Lightning? Give him an ongoing by Geoff Johns & Greg Capullo, make their run last 2~3 years while producing a movie directed by Guillermo del Toro or Pete Travis, starring Idris Elba or David Oyelowo as Black Lightning, Kerry Washington or Paula Patton as his wife, any of the various hot, up-and-coming young black actresses for his daughters, etc, maybe throw in a cameo by Superman or something...

Voila, Black Lightning should be A-list.

I don't want GJ anywhere near BL...GJ has a pattern of making black characters supeefluously meaningless and non-contributivw to advancement of plot and the character itself.

Look at how he wrote GLJS/GL John Stewart when he was in charge of the GL books

Look at what he did with Cyborg when he wrote the JL books

Look at what he did with Black Rorsarch when he wrote that Watchmen Doom clock limited series.

Online rumors say it was GJ who was pushing to get GLJS killed off in new 52 to make way from his creations Baz and Cruz.....fans rebelled and he still FORCED his new GLs anyway which no one wanted. They should have been members of any of the other corps he created instead he brought further sub-division and in-fighting in the GL fanbase.

He created black aqualad and did nothing real with the character....thank goodness for small favors the YJ animation team picked him up.

At this point I want Bryan Hill (whatever name the writer who's doing the current outsiders) or Gene Yang (the terrifics) to write the BP solo.

But I do support Greg Cappulo on art.

[Besouro]

While we are on going BL solo....what are y'all thoughts on the BL tv series?

It has had 3 seasons so far and will be returning for a 4th next year.

Please give a review rating ..../10 for the show over all and if u can...also share pros and cons in your opinion about the tv show so far as well as what you would like to change, remove and/or add for the next season.

[Aahz]

Honestly I don't think he came ever even remotely close to being an A-List character.

More than 30 years after his creation he has just 36 solo issues and those were published in 4 different series, with often more than a decade between these series.
And as far as I can tell non of these were particularly highly regarded or even iconic. And even when it comes to the team books he has been in, I can't really think of an really great or iconic Black Lighting stories.

If something killed his chance of becoming a bigger character it was probably the DC implosion, that ended his first series after less than a year.


There is of course allways a chance for character to suddenly become big, but that requires usually really great memorable stories and those are rare in today's comics.

[skyvolt2000]

Honestly I don't think he came ever even remotely close to being an A-List character.

More than 30 years after his creation he has just 36 solo issues and those were published in 4 different series, with often more than a decade between these series.
And as far as I can tell non of these were particularly highly regarded or even iconic. And even when it comes to the team books he has been in, I can't really think of an really great or iconic Black Lighting stories.

If something killed his chance of becoming a bigger character it was probably the DC implosion, that ended his first series after less than a year.


There is of course allways a chance for character to suddenly become big, but that requires usually really great memorable stories and those are rare in today's comics.

What great and memorable stories did the following have?

Rocket Raccoon
Squirrel Girl
Groot
Miles Morales
Supergirl
John Stewart
Star Girl

Yet folks found movies and tv shows and novels outside of comics to put them in.

And who decides what story is great or memorable?

Because for folks who LOOK like Black Lightning-their stories get dismissed as inferior. Mainly by those who don't want them around in the first place.

Sales are not a barometer-since we have seen folks support trash because Batman or Superman was in it.

[Will Evans]

Build up his rogues gallery. Bring back his daughters. Have him be be a superhero/principal in his own city (Freeman) like the show.

[Timber Wolf-By-Night]

Question about the daughters: Before the New 52, were there any stories showing them together with Jefferson, or having any actual relationship with him at all? Let alone with each other?

For the first 25-30 years of Black Lightning's existence, it was established fact that he and his ex-wife never, ever, had kids. Not even a mention. Then somebody brought Lightning into the main DCU as one of, IMO, too many crossover characters or concepts from Kingdom Come, and then Winick introduced Thunder in his Outsiders series with an instant origin story (she's Black Lightning's daughter! Who was never, ever mentioned before! EVER! Seriously, did nobody even challenge this?) instead of actually putting in the work to create an original background for her. It always felt like, to me at least, people were trying to graft their own creations onto Black Lightning to use him as background (and push him further into the background) for their creations instead of using Black Lightning himself (at least until Meltzer started using him in his brief JLA run). As much as I like them on the show, in the comics the daughters have always felt like, I guess, unearned addititions to Black Lightning. Not that he didn't earn them, but that they didn't earn being his daughters. Like, after decades of Black Lightning having no children, they were just created as fully formed young adults and tacked onto him like toilet paper on the bottom of his shoe. They didn't add to his legacy, they were created to leech off of it.

[Dark Falz]

Yet folks found movies and tv shows and novels outside of comics to put them in.

And who decides what story is great or memorable?

Because for folks who LOOK like Black Lightning-their stories get dismissed as inferior. Mainly by those who don't want them around in the first place.

Sales are not a barometer-since we have seen folks support trash because Batman or Superman was in it.

People support Batman and Superman because they have been in memorable stories in all kinds of different media. Lois and Clark, Arkham video game series, the Superman movies, Batman: The Animated Series, Batman: Year One, Silver Age Superman, Triangle Era Superman...all of those things have lots of fans, and the list goes on well beyond those examples.

The fact that people support trash with Batman and Superman in it only speaks to the strength of the bond those people have formed with those characters. They sell on name alone. A character doesn't just get there because they're white. They get there from building relationships with fans through stories, games, toys, and whatnot.

I believe what Aahz said is true. I don't think Black Lightning has ever been close to A-list, because none of his content has ever been regarded well enough. This doesn't have to do with racism, his stories just haven't clicked with readers/viewers. If anything, I think Black Lightning's race has been his main claim to fame, because it definitely hasn't been his stories. His race has only worked to his benefit. Without it, I suspect there's not much reason for a lot of people to pay attention to the character, because, again, his stories have never been widely considered to be great. With his race, he's basically DC's only original lead character that is black, or at least the first one. That counts for something.