Polaris/Lorna Dane: Queen of Mutants/Mistress of Magnetism Appreciation 2023

[UncannyLZ]

I didn't really feel 90s nostalgia at all with that, I just felt the writing and editing was amateurish.

Even her "generic" look with a recolor looks better than green monochrome, imo...

This looks worse than the all green in my opinion. Not a knock on your coloring skills, I just think Lorna in purple makes her even more “Lady Magneto Jr.”

I 100 percent agree that Lorna’s look should give “Warrior Princess”. Both words truly get to the core of Lorna as a character. Like JMC says in every post they make, Lorna is both at the same time and what makes interesting. She’s both a student of Magneto and Xavier and her look she say that so people will instantly recognize what she’s about. To me, Lorna is both level headed/laid back and the one willing to fight, especially for mutant. The 2021 X-Men look only captured half her personality and the coffee leaned further into that side. The coffee wouldn’t be so bad of her look had more “warrior” elements to it.

I agree that the anka redesign is her best. IMG_0928.jpg IMG_0927.jpg

The updated version this artist did is even better as I think Lorna should not have a cape IMG_4157.jpg Make it sleeveless and add more silver and black, especially on her Happuri so it contrasts better with her green hair and that should be how Polaris’ design should be

[GoingGreen]

I deeply respect the writer for being honest, but I could tell that was early 90s Lorna to a T and he was more then willing to confirm he viewed that version as ‘definitive’.

Keep in mind I like the writer I just believe him to be wrong on this score. I believe in the concept of a definitive take is bad, I believe in the concept of a definitive central thesis on the character to be good, but that was a very 90s thesis with anything outside it feeling very tacked on.

The central thesis of first run PAD Lorna was as a generic heroine whose core identity is around not being mind controlled and winning Alex Summer’s love. That was a bit better then Claremont’s 80s thesis on her, but not by much.

In terms of Lorna and outfits I would generally agree that Lorna needs something that says warrior princess. There has to be a kind of balance in colors her space outfit refused to have and it needs to have more edge then the space outfit.

Lorna's induction into the X-Men was horribly squandered. It should've meant way more, and instead, they just kept doing the same thing they were doing with the O5 and left Lorna (and Alex) on the side. But they couldn't have the foresight to know what the X-Men would one day become, especially as their sales plummet at the time. We got one or two cool moments with Polaris in the 70s. Almost all of the 80s was either possession or power-swap.

Lorna didn't really get any defined character traits UNTIL Peter David's X-Factor. That's what kills me about all these debates. The 90s relaunch was such an exciting time for X-comics, and we really haven't experienced anything like it since until Krakoa. So, I couldn't disagree more that her going to X-Factor in 1991 was a dead-end for her. She was next to nothing prior to that. She was originally on the X-Men for only a handful of issues, which was only expanded upon in a retconned title meant to fill in narrative gaps. The only thing we really knew about her before 90s X-Factor was that she just wanted a normal life. She was kindof a feminist, she was Alex's girlfriend, and she valued her education. That was the first 20 years of her "development". While we all would've loved if she'd have stayed on the main X-Men, whose place should she have taken? Her on X-Factor was significantly better than anything she'd had ages. X-Factor gave her character-autonomy and dedicated development that she just never received before. Her side scenes were not all exclusively about Alex or possession, it was about building relationships with her teammates - she really never had that before. You keep calling her "diet Jean" - and I just totally disagree with that assessment. She was defined as quirky, she got to have some fun, she started to recognize her purpose, she became the unofficial spokesperson for the team and co-leader, and the book / title really belongs to her. While the popularity of the title has plummeted along with all other side-books, in its hay day, I really don't see it as a dead end for her "career"... I really think it was the actual foundation of the character.

I've said this before and I'll say it again, instead of 90s X-Factor being the problem - I think she might be the biggest "victim" of the slow, progressive death of serialized books. Serialization started failing when Marvel started churning out event after event, and former major players started to drop into irrelevancy. But let's be clear, Polaris did not serve on the X-Men from 1970 (1975 if you count the time lost to reprints) until 2002. So... 27-32 years. And had she been on X-Men instead of X-Factor, we have no idea what they would've done with her, but we do know her going to Genosha (Dark Seduction and everything surrounding that) never would've happened, and Genosha is one of the biggest talking points in this thread. And in that same vain, I seriously doubt she ever would've been retconned as part of the House of M, another major talking point.

The Polaris we love exists because she was in X-Factor.

This looks worse than the all green in my opinion. Not a knock on your coloring skills, I just think Lorna in purple makes her even more “Lady Magneto Jr.”

I 100 percent agree that Lorna’s look should give “Warrior Princess”. Both words truly get to the core of Lorna as a character. Like JMC says in every post they make, Lorna is both at the same time and what makes interesting. She’s both a student of Magneto and Xavier and her look she say that so people will instantly recognize what she’s about. To me, Lorna is both level headed/laid back and the one willing to fight, especially for mutant. The 2021 X-Men look only captured half her personality and the coffee leaned further into that side. The coffee wouldn’t be so bad of her look had more “warrior” elements to it.

I agree that the anka redesign is her best. IMG_0928.jpg IMG_0927.jpg

The updated version this artist did is even better as I think Lorna should not have a cape IMG_4157.jpg Make it sleeveless and add more silver and black, especially on her Happuri so it contrasts better with her green hair and that should be how Polaris’ design should be

No worries, that took me all of 5 minutes, hahah. Appreciate the opinion.

See, personally, I think that design reads way more as "Magneto Jr." Which, I should voice - I personally don't mind when Lorna adopts elements that reminds people she is in the House of M. Her not allowed to wear colors her father happens to wear has always been weird to me. Magneto wears the same colors as sentinels, no one freaks out about that hahaha.

However, all the bright green monochrome designs tend to feel a little campy, to me. They don't feel like some level-headed political leader and mutant powerhouse. Similarly, I detest the green lipstick. I have NEVER understood why artists love to do that to her face. Like "Don't let the readers forget about the green! Does she have enough green on? Add some green eyeshadow. Give her a green lip." For me, the hair and the power signature are enough.

[jmc247]

The Polaris we love exists because she was in X-Factor.

First run PAD was not her creator. It was an important developmental step for the character, but sorry I know you hate me critiquing it, but I am only doing so because uber fanboy writers of that era keep treating that era as ‘her definitive take’ rather then it being an evolutionary step in her development.

As for why I call her Jean lite. PAD himself said that he was getting ready to write Jean and Scott along with the rest of the 05 until editorial handed him a new cast and many members fell into the roles he was going for. For Lorna you can say her dialogue was different then Jean’s and it was, but the core idea for the characters pathos was the same with mind control replacing the much more interesting Phoenix stuff and a different Summers brother she was trying to win over.

That isn’t to shit on the past, I do have respect for what came before, but it’s to recognize that 90s X-Factor was not definitive and it’s been hobbling her that some writers can’t at all see beyond that era for her.

The 90s Uber X-Factor fanboy writers have not shown me they understand or accept her post X-Factor developments and it’s not having a ‘bad dad’ that matters here. Its her worldview no longer being will Havok love me or not and will I be possessed again tomorrow or not.

I didn’t actually turn against Havolaris until it became clear to me during her space arc that writers were not seeing past their nostalgia with the relationship to build something better. Nostalgia is fine as long as its not blind to the flaws of the past.

You can’t really write Lorna well unless one respects both her X-Factor history and her Genosha history. Her X-Factor history includes working with the U.S. government and being in relationship with Havok. Her Genosha history changed her into something that at least in terms of mutant rights ideology and using force was no longer in line with Jean.

Lorna’s story felt like it was on a continual journey in the 90s thru to the mid 2000s. What happened in my view was she was dumped in space and it became one writer after another of recycling nostagia for previous eras (most typically the early 90s) then onto another writer recycling nostalgia.

Duggan’s run with Lorna even with its flaws didn’t feel like recycled nostalgia.

[GoingGreen]

First run PAD was not her creator. It was an important developmental step for the character, but sorry I know you hate me shitting on it, but I am only doing so because uber fanboy writers of that era keep treating that era as ‘her definitive take’ rather then it being an evolutionary step in her development.

As for why I call her Jean lite. PAD himself said that he was getting ready to write Jean and Scott along with the rest of the 05 until editorial handed him a new cast and many members fell into the roles he was going for. For Lorna you can say her dialogue was different then Jean’s and it was, but the core idea for the characters pathos was the same with mind control replacing the much more interesting Phoenix stuff and a different Summers brother she was trying to win over.

That isn’t to shit on the past, I do have respect for what came before, but it’s to recognize that 90s X-Factor was not definitive and it’s been hobbling her that writers like Bunn and Alex S. can’t at all see beyond that era for her.

The 90s Uber X-Factor fanboy writers have not shown me they understand or accept her post X-Factor developments and it’s not having a ‘bad dad’ that matters here. Its her worldview no longer being will Havok love me or not and will I be possessed again tomorrow or not.

I didn’t actually turn against Havolaris until it became clear to me during her space arc that writers were not seeing past their nostalgia with the relationship to build something better. Nostalgia is fine as long as its not blind to the flaws of the past.

This is all fair, and I totally respect your perspective on the matter. I agree, no one should think X-Factor defines her. The only nostalgia I need is that it's an important notch on her resume, and any look-backs should remind readers who she was before Genosha.

As for Havok - I just loathe him as a character in general. The only time I like reading him is when he's Maddy's little bitch-boy. Other than that, he's an aggressively whiny, abusive man. Polaris and Havok spent just as much time trying to kill each other for on reason or another as they did in an actual relationship, and I have dozens of screenshots I could share on the matter. Havok is a terrible romantic partner, and I can't recall a time his leadership did anything wildly impressive. I've always felt Lorna made a better leader when she got the chances (she subbed in and ran a country, for example). And this isn't me saying that because I'm a Polaris fan. I'm a Polaris fan because I felt that way when I read the comics. Havok recruited to Uncanny Avengers was such a quiet gift for Polaris fans.

[rhaenylis]

This is all fair, and I totally respect your perspective on the matter. I agree, no one should think X-Factor defines her. The only nostalgia I need is that it's an important notch on her resume, and any look-backs should remind readers who she was before Genosha.

As for Havok - I just loathe him as a character in general. The only time I like reading him is when he's Maddy's little bitch-boy. Other than that, he's an aggressively whiny, abusive man. Polaris and Havok spent just as much time trying to kill each other for on reason or another as they did in an actual relationship, and I have dozens of screenshots I could share on the matter. Havok is a terrible romantic partner, and I can't recall a time his leadership did anything wildly impressive. I've always felt Lorna made a better leader when she got the chances (she subbed in and ran a country, for example). And this isn't me saying that because I'm a Polaris fan. I'm a Polaris fan because I felt that way when I read the comics. Havok recruited to Uncanny Avengers was such a quiet gift for Polaris fans.

In my opinion DeMatteis' run is the only one that portrays Havolaris as an almost healthy relationship

Although Claremont's run should have definitely spelled the end of that relationship

[jmc247]

As for Havok - I just loathe him as a character in general. The only time I like reading him is when he's Maddy's little bitch-boy. Other than that, he's an aggressively whiny, abusive man. Polaris and Havok spent just as much time trying to kill each other for on reason or another as they did in an actual relationship, and I have dozens of screenshots I could share on the matter. Havok is a terrible romantic partner, and I can't recall a time his leadership did anything wildly impressive. I've always felt Lorna made a better leader when she got the chances (she subbed in and ran a country, for example). And this isn't me saying that because I'm a Polaris fan. I'm a Polaris fan because I felt that way when I read the comics. Havok recruited to Uncanny Avengers was such a quiet gift for Polaris fans.

I started reading X-Factor in the late 05 era and into the early PAD X-Factor era when I was young. I felt Havok lacked many of the basics that made his brother a much stronger and more interesting character. I also felt he was more dominating over his girlfriend then Scott was at the time and a fair bit of that was because Lorna let him.

DeMatteis did better then most as rhaenylis said as she was allowed her seperate political ideology which most writers don’t let her have though he refused to believe or accept she had a different one then Xavier.




In the late Austen/Milligan era I thought they could go forward together finally and perhaps not regress to what their relationship was in the 80s or 90s, but then came the space arc.

[jmc247]

This is all fair, and I totally respect your perspective on the matter. I agree, no one should think X-Factor defines her. The only nostalgia I need is that it's an important notch on her resume, and any look-backs should remind readers who she was before Genosha.

Duggan wrote the character with some of her Genosha era concepts and developments in mind without bringing anything up per say. One could see some elements of many versions of Lorna there including Austen, Genosha, and the 90s including his own ideas.

I do still watch what fans are saying on social media about the character and her development.

[Havok83]

That wasnt an attempt at genocide. It was genocide

[Cubbyboo]

I didn't really feel 90s nostalgia at all with that, I just felt the writing and editing was amateurish.

Even her "generic" look with a recolor looks better than green monochrome, imo...

Hi. What issue / comic is this from?? Thx

[kcekada]

Where is that Anka design from? Have to say -- not a fan, but I have yet to see anything from Anka that I like.

The purple with green doesn't work for me with Lorna. I like purple with green-- and like Lorna in the Shi'ar purple (actually preferred when it was colored green -- probably by mistake), but mashing the two colors together looks off brand for her.

[GoingGreen]

Hi. What issue / comic is this from?? Thx

2017 X-Men Blue #8, written by Cullen Bunn.

Here's the original color:

[salarta]

Okay, here we go.

The 90s are a cup of coffee. They served a purpose. That purpose has passed. Refusing to move on from it and using it in place of anything meaningful to current events, progressive in thinking and deeply relevant to Lorna does nothing but hurt both Lorna specifically and the broader fictional universe as a whole.

I loved FF4. It's among my favorite games. I'm not gonna say character types and RPG stories need to be replicas of FF4. In fact, I would expect a true continuation (not After Years which was trash) to recognize the bad parts were bad and do better to flesh out characters. For example, people often mistakenly think Rosa is a weak damsel in distress that only exists to cling onto Cecil. They quickly forget things like Rosa giving Rydia the support she needs to cast Fire, or how she only got kidnapped because she offered herself to avoid everyone else dying. They also don't notice she traveled across at least a desert all by herself and survived with only an illness. A proper representation of Rosa in this scenario would demonstrate her caring nature, her willingness to put the greater good before her own needs, and her tenacity and bravery to face obstacles alone head-on to get things done. The X-Men 90s nostalgia equivalent would be Rosa hanging on Cecil's every wish and stupidly doing whatever would most please him.

There's a key difference here in what I just talked about. When I talk about these things with Rosa, I'm talking about qualities she possessed in her original story and how a proper sequel telling should be faithful to them. Writing of Lorna in the 90s is not her original story. It's an idea of her developed after roughly two decades of misrepresentation, still lacking the core themes from when she was introduced.

I'm not saying the 90s had nothing to offer. But they're like the "get off the ship" Big Whale scene of FF4. The scene I'm talking about had Cecil ordering Rosa and Rydia off the space ship as the men headed off to find the big bad purely because they're women. Rosa pretends to go along with it, Rydia argues a bit more but then does too, only for the two women to reveal they stowed away once the ship lands. A scene like that may have been cutting edge progressive in video games for its time in dealing with sexism. Today, it just comes off as insultingly tone-deaf.

It's accurate to say the 90s were a step up for Lorna from the Claremont era, and it did things she needed within its time. Recognizing that does not require holding the character hostage to nostalgia, or pretending she didn't exist before then. Doing that is like so much spilled coffee for Lorna to whine about while standing on the site of a genocide she survived.

Gonna read more now. Add posts if relevant.

[salarta]

About Lorna's costume color, I increasingly think she really should stick with being mostly green. She's easily recognizable because of it in the same way Wanda and Emma are. Moving away from that reduces her visual footprint.

I think a hefty component of the "she has too much green on" mentality is based in hardcore fandom thinking, not casual fan thinking. Hardcore fans have seen her typical looks ad nauseum, have no trouble at all recognizing her, but feel "sick" of her well-known looks. Casual fans really don't mind or care. But they also won't recognize it's her any more than they would recognize Emma in black or Wanda in green. So while the only risk with hardcore fans is them not liking it, the risk with casual fans is not even knowing it's her.

This is why I don't suggest a radical revision. Just her typical costume with meaningful tweaks to coincide with her personality, history and powers. Hardcore fans can say all day how much they prefer her in purple, or without a cape, or wearing a jacket or sunglasses, but at the end of the day, it's not hardcore fans who most need the visual cues.

Havok recruited to Uncanny Avengers was such a quiet gift for Polaris fans.

It was definitely a positive, and I noted it as such when it happened. I did have one criticism though during this period, I think well-deserved. When Lorna did stuff and led ANXF, the books she was in felt it absolutely necessary to remind everyone how she was Havok's ex. But then you look over at Uncanny Avengers, and Lorna never comes up. The closest it comes is referring to Lorna as an unnamed ex while Havok got with Wasp. It was a vivid example of the double standard in treatment of Lorna compared to Havok.

[jmc247]

It was definitely a positive, and I noted it as such when it happened. I did have one criticism though during this period, I think well-deserved. When Lorna did stuff and led ANXF, the books she was in felt it absolutely necessary to remind everyone how she was Havok's ex. But then you look over at Uncanny Avengers, and Lorna never comes up. The closest it comes is referring to Lorna as an unnamed ex while Havok got with Wasp. It was a vivid example of the double standard in treatment of Lorna compared to Havok.

The 90s as the coffee cup notion is a good modern example of the same idea. Something that had is moment, but it’s past time to move on from.

In terms of PAD on second run X-Factor and ANXF it was a step up from the 90s in some ways in that he allowed her to be more aggressive. That came off well when he wrote it as cold-blooded aggression, not so well when it was unthinking boneheaded aggression.

PAD's second and third runs with Lorna while better than the first in overall concept didn't quite succeed the way I think Marvel had hoped because ultimately, he could only shift his views in writing her so far from what it had been when he was writing her before.

Accepting her as Magneto's daughter was only half the battle. The other half was accepting her change in worldview on mutants and Magneto from that of the early 90s and that was too big a leap for someone who already had a preset frame of reference for her.

Though I had more sympathy for his struggle on the matter then your blog standard comic writer who never wrote her before, but loves his 90s nostalgia.

The core problem Lorna ran into that I am hoping her upcoming arc helps to move forward is how her life experiences shape her vision on mutants now.

[Cubbyboo]

2017 X-Men Blue #8, written by Cullen Bunn.

Here's the original color:

Thx so so much!!