T'Challa: The Black Panther Appreciation 2023

[Mantis-Ray]

Hsu was nominated. Curtis arguably gave the least deserving performance (not that she wasn't good, just not as good as the others, imo). It's all subjective and not based in merit. Once Curtis surprised at SAG, I figured she had it. Still disappointing though.

It is kinda funny that even Everything Everywhere All at Once's fans also agree that JML's role wasn't really good enough to warrant being nominated.

Her winning is clearly due to her veteran status as an actor more than anything.

[Mantis-Ray]

Honestly sometimes being a BP fan feels like I'm walking in a normalized crazy universe. I don't understand how any person with a working brain views Folsade positively.

I love how right at the end, Ommola who gave endless **** to T'Challa for making her a spy and assassin, immediately agrees to become Folsade's wetworks agent essentially continuing the lifestyle she was apparently so critical of.

Everyone in this story is a gross hypocrite.

[Dboi654]

I know we’re all sour about WF around these parts, but Jaime Lee Curtis winning over Angela Bassett is ridiculous.

Part of me feels bad for Angela Basset especially when you see her face as soon as JLC name was called. The other part though......

[MindofShadow]

Marvel lost their chance to make "Wakanda" work with Coates.

He had every opportunity served on a perfect platter.

A long absence of BP solo book to grow anticipation + 5 years of Hickman using the character in the forefront in one of the biggest cross over stories Marvel has done + CW movie + BP movie + MCU at its peak popularity...

He had a chance to skip DECADES of slow development of Wakanda and its supporting characters just based on pure hype.

And frankly, in regards to building the franchise and/or Wakanda, he blew it. Completely. A combination of being an uncreative, neophyte fiction writer + pessimistic personality that bleeds into his writing + anti-masculinity thoughts that also bleeds into his writing in a medium that demands almost hyper masculinity...

Dude had free reign and a large leash. Big enough to even pull in his acquaintances who were also brand new comic writers with their own prejudices.

We can argue if his stories in a vacuum at "good" or not, but their is no argument the franchise was worse off after 5 years of Coates than when he had it.

then the MCU and Ridley pile drived the franchise into the ground and lit it on fire.

[BlackClaw]

Part of me feels bad for Angela Basset especially when you see her face as soon as JLC name was called. The other part though......

And then white people on Twitter having the gall to lash out at her for feeling this way when JLC did the exact same fucking thing at the golden globes when Angela won and nobody blinked.

[Mantis-Ray]

The whole exploration of Wakanda concept is dumb, it's stupid, and its writers the phrase as buzzwords to cover up their lack of ideas of what to do with the T'Challa. It's funny how other writers on other titles build up characters beyond their initial premises into something grander without breaking down the entire concept of the character. Look at what Cates, Ram V, and Ewing have done on Venom, he was just a one-note Spider-man villain for a long time but now the title is a time-traveling, action epic storyline about family with Eddie Brock now being the King in Black. Marvel should get a writer that can build up T'Challa and not spend any more time deconstructing and stripping away everything that made the character and the franchise unique.

Oh yeah don't forget Rick Remender and Cullen Bunn. Their work on Agent Venom with Flash Thompson's tenure as the character is what transitioned Venom from being a monster previously with Mac Gargan to a very complex and well-written anti-hero/hero due to the very compelling character drama and characterization for Flash as he became a full superhero.

Interestingly Bunn's run introduced Andi Benton/Mania who proved to be a popular character in the fandom despite being an admitably derivative concept, being essentially a mini girl Venom. Though she became well received due to a great design, likable character, and a cute dynamic with Flash.

I mean compare to Ommola who has a pretty dull costume (its a simple-ass black bodysuit with only the skull mask for detail) and an extremally negative relationship with T'Challa. Like unlike Flash and Andi, Ommola is so constantly negative to T'Challa that there's nothing to develop there because you can't be invested in their friendship or anything. I mean the book constantly goes on about how she was a childhood friend in T'Challa but aside from a couple flashbacks, nothing about her paints her as being particularly close to him since she spends all her screentime disparaging him with no moments of closeness.

Marvel lost their chance to make "Wakanda" work with Coates.

He had every opportunity served on a perfect platter.

A long absence of BP solo book to grow anticipation + 5 years of Hickman using the character in the forefront in one of the biggest cross over stories Marvel has done + CW movie + BP movie + MCU at its peak popularity...

He had a chance to skip DECADES of slow development of Wakanda and its supporting characters just based on pure hype.

And frankly, in regards to building the franchise and/or Wakanda, he blew it. Completely. A combination of being an uncreative, neophyte fiction writer + pessimistic personality that bleeds into his writing + anti-masculinity thoughts that also bleeds into his writing in a medium that demands almost hyper masculinity...

Dude had free reign and a large leash. Big enough to even pull in his acquaintances who were also brand new comic writers with their own prejudices.

We can argue if his stories in a vacuum at "good" or not, but their is no argument the franchise was worse off after 5 years of Coates than when he had it.

then the MCU and Ridley pile drived the franchise into the ground and lit it on fire.

Its funny to think how different the BP line must look compared to the rest of Marvel. While the rest of the books are generally written by comic creators and general fiction writers, Black Panther is near entirely written by these sort of literary and journalist nonfiction writers. Though some fairness to John Ridley he at least has prior experience in fiction writing.

Its like getting The Power of the Dog or Belfast writers to write comics, its weird or at least kinda try hard especially to the extent they are doing with BP.

[Ezyo1000]

Marvel lost their chance to make "Wakanda" work with Coates.

He had every opportunity served on a perfect platter.

A long absence of BP solo book to grow anticipation + 5 years of Hickman using the character in the forefront in one of the biggest cross over stories Marvel has done + CW movie + BP movie + MCU at its peak popularity...

He had a chance to skip DECADES of slow development of Wakanda and its supporting characters just based on pure hype.

And frankly, in regards to building the franchise and/or Wakanda, he blew it. Completely. A combination of being an uncreative, neophyte fiction writer + pessimistic personality that bleeds into his writing + anti-masculinity thoughts that also bleeds into his writing in a medium that demands almost hyper masculinity...

Dude had free reign and a large leash. Big enough to even pull in his acquaintances who were also brand new comic writers with their own prejudices.

We can argue if his stories in a vacuum at "good" or not, but their is no argument the franchise was worse off after 5 years of Coates than when he had it.

then the MCU and Ridley pile drived the franchise into the ground and lit it on fire.

There's no argument about his run in a vacuum. Even IF we took T'Challa out of it, and this was a complete OC driven story by Coates own mind, it still bad from a story standpoint. Best comparison is The Last Jedi. Having characters acting completely idiotic for plot purposes, dumbing them down adb weakening them to artificially inflate "stakes" and the story itself is just bad from a movie standpoint, like it's neither a good starwars movie or a "space sci-fi opera" movie. Same with Coates run.

He completely **** on the franchise, and TBH I don't know how long it will be till the franchise can get another chance at punching fully into A list status... I really wish Redjack got the give instead of Coates.

[Frontier]

And then white people on Twitter having the gall to lash out at her for feeling this way when JLC did the exact same fucking thing at the golden globes when Angela won and nobody blinked.

I'm sensing a rivalry brewing...

[Overhazard]

There's no argument about his run in a vacuum. Even IF we took T'Challa out of it, and this was a complete OC driven story by Coates own mind, it still bad from a story standpoint. Best comparison is The Last Jedi. Having characters acting completely idiotic for plot purposes, dumbing them down adb weakening them to artificially inflate "stakes" and the story itself is just bad from a movie standpoint, like it's neither a good starwars movie or a "space sci-fi opera" movie. Same with Coates run.

He completely **** on the franchise, and TBH I don't know how long it will be till the franchise can get another chance at punching fully into A list status... I really wish Redjack got the give instead of Coates.

Don't forget the fact that Finn, the former brainwashed child soldier needed to be told that war and slavery is bad, on top of the fact that he went through the same character arc that he did in the first movie, they took Boyega's love of Star Wars and threw it back in his face. That, and as much as I like the Mandalorian, star wars just doesn't feel special anymore. I mean, I know it was always about merchandise and selling toys, but still. Transformers was at least up front about it.

[Ezyo1000]

Don't forget the fact that Finn, the former brainwashed child soldier needed to be told that war and slavery is bad, on top of the fact that he went through the same character arc that he did in the first movie, they took Boyega's love of Star Wars and threw it back in his face. That, and as much as I like the Mandalorian, star wars just doesn't feel special anymore. I mean, I know it was always about merchandise and selling toys, but still. Transformers was at least up front about it.

Finn was a travesty. Seriously the potential for him was a slam dunk waiting to happen. Former brainwashed child soldier turned Jedi, his character arc was far more compelling. Going from being apart of the first order and a deadly member at that, and going through a journey of redemption and to eventually become the hero of the rebel- resistance is far more compelling than Rey, the marooned orphan on tatoo- I mean Jakku, whom spent her entire life there yet somehow knew how to not only pilot the millennium falcon, but perform complex maneuvers with it, so naturally gifted in the force, she could perform high tier abilities such as the mind trick by simply hearing the word force, who also defeated Kylo (yes he was injured but he was also Injured when he kicked Finn's ass) by again, hearing "the force" who was related to palatine despite it being clear he didn't have a lover or children on the entire time we saw him.

Bad writing is bad writing. And unfortunately T'Challa had been shackled with such garbage as well

[Chesterfield]

And then white people on Twitter having the gall to lash out at her for feeling this way when JLC did the exact same fucking thing at the golden globes when Angela won and nobody blinked.

Do you have proof of this? I'm gonna need it before I go in on these haters.

[Ezyo1000]

Part of me feels bad for Angela Basset especially when you see her face as soon as JLC name was called. The other part though......

I mean I guess I just feel indifferent to the whole thing. When being called a racist (lol), sexist, misogynists and they are going to laugh at my "tears" at WF hits a billy all because I say they shouldn't use a RL black man's death to sell tickets and profit off him... Meh. Oscars are dumb as hell and I don't know why people out so much stock into them. It's not as though they personally win as well with these actors.

[Pulp Fiction]

Don’t care about wakanda forever or the MCU in general. /shrug

[Ekie]

Less awards the better. Means less "justification" by the studio and tertiary fans of the franchise.

Angela is goated with or without.

[Vanguard]

Don’t care about wakanda forever or the MCU in general. /shrug

Me either. Not until TChalla’s back in it.