T'Challa: The Black Panther Appreciation 2023

[skyvolt2000]

That is the most defense of T'Challa in this entire book and even then Gentle still makes a point of making a backhanded insult.

"I hurt Storm because I chose to believe in T'Challa's cause."

Also Tosin showcases he knows jack shit about anything. Expected from the kid from the secluded hippie village. Real easy to talk of freedom and peace when you come from an isolated place where everyone wants for nothing and gives each other hugs and kisses.

The real world meanwhile requires fucking work to get right, someone Tosin could never understand because he's never worked a day in his life.

Tosin is the black kid who NEVER went anywhere BEYOND his street corner. Along with being around others who are just the same.

He is also THE Christian Walker who know NOTHING but because some of his people insult the man in charge-he does the same.

He's the kid who watches Fox News or BET and then goes out to college says the WRONG thing to a black person and then wonders why he has to find a new college.


It's insulting that a bunch OOC is all T'Challa can get after the black power movement of the previous run.

Where is Prodigy at? Thunderball? Did Coates T'Challa not build up those two way more than the X-Men or Wrecking Crew have ever done?

Both Patriots are doing nothing right now.

Where is Nephew at?

[Mantis-Ray]

Lot to unpack here:

- New bad guy is discount Hunter. I'm not the only one who sees that, right? Was Ridley planning to use Hunter before Falcap's writer called dibs?

- T'Chlla feeling bad out the lost love of some OC who we only saw in this run. May as well have just brought Monica back and made her a spy if you wanted us to feel emotionally invested.

- T'Challa, master planner, tactician, and all-around genius...needs to have learned the power of friendship to overcome this new threat. Seriously.

- Wakandan's continue to sound like they were born and raised in America.

- Tosin talking like every idealist who has no idea how politics or governments actually work.

- Buffalo Soldier feels so tonally out of place.

I doubt Hunter was ever in the works. The recent Black Panther writers are surprisingly averse to using anything that hasn't been in the movies. These last runs have been all new characters for the most part.

Though being a substitute to Hunter is prolly intentional so to have a black character in that role as T'Challa's close brother figure instead of him having an adopted white brother.

It's hilarious that for all of Tosin's bragging about how "wise" his village is, he once again falls into the common trap of those settings. For all their posturing about their intelligence, they are astonishingly ignorant about the outside world showing how little they actually care.

[king of hybrids]

Wepwawet? Brother of Anubis and god of war scouts typically represented with the head of a wolf. The Hyena Clan of Wakanda are nomadic thieves and tinkerers, a deity known for stealth and guile fits well with their theme.

I wonder if a writer has ever thought to find some way to connect the Hyena Clan and the Hatut Zeraze given the shared canine theme. Could be an interesting story.

A Hunter/Jakarra team-up against their cat based siblings then?

More seriously, if the Hyenas are the main organised crime in Wakanda and the main way of moving stuff in and out of Wakanda on its more isolationist days; then it does stand to reason they’d have some relationship with the Hatut Zeraze (as the secret police) and N’Charu Silema (as the intelligence agency)

[Klaue's Mixtape]

Tosin is MoS's new Queen Divine Justice.

[Ezyo1000]

Lot to unpack here:

- New bad guy is discount Hunter. I'm not the only one who sees that, right? Was Ridley planning to use Hunter before Falcap's writer called dibs?

- T'Chlla feeling bad out the lost love of some OC who we only saw in this run. May as well have just brought Monica back and made her a spy if you wanted us to feel emotionally invested.

- T'Challa, master planner, tactician, and all-around genius...needs to have learned the power of friendship to overcome this new threat. Seriously.

- Wakandan's continue to sound like they were born and raised in America.

- Tosin talking like every idealist who has no idea how politics or governments actually work.

- Buffalo Soldier feels so tonally out of place.

The power of friendship part really got me NGL... But otherwise yea like, what exactly is T'Challa supposed to be learning here? What exactly did he do wrong that suggests he needs to be ragged on this hard? He literally did this same thing since Priest, and Hudlin followed it up to. This isn't new, the Avengers knew he spied and continues to spy on them. So what's the "Lesson" T'Challa has to learn? Because right now it's just Ridley seemingly shitting on him out of spite and to push he shit OCs

[Username taken]

I'm honestly not sure what Ridley was trying to say in his BP run.

Ridley is just another writer I'm consigning to my personal "sh!t list". I'm not reading anything he's ever writing again.

He really should have known better. Too many people nowadays acting strange in society these days from the mess in Congress to the idiots defending Tory Lanez to cryptoscams to comic book writers (beyond BP, see what's happening with Hank McCoy in X-Force or Jason Aaron on Avengers, and Tim Drake at DC), too much silliness nowadays.

Maybe Ridley's work is good in other mediums (although that's just an assumption on my part) but in comics particularly at Marvel, it's been complete rubbish.

[Ezyo1000]

I'm honestly not sure what Ridley was trying to say in his BP run.

Ridley is just another writer I'm consigning to my personal "sh!t list". I'm not reading anything he's ever writing again.

He really should have known better. Too many people nowadays acting strange in society these days from the mess in Congress to the idiots defending Tory Lanez to cryptoscams comic book writers (beyond BP, see what's happening with Hank McCoy in X-Force or Jason Aaron on Avengers, and Tim Drake at DC), too much silliness nowadays.

Maybe Ridley's work is good in other mediums (although that's just an assumption on my part) but in comics particularly at Marvel, it's been complete rubbish.

What's going on with Tory Lanez?

[Username taken]

What's going on with Tory Lanez?

Just that whole mess with him shooting Megan Thee Stallion.

Some of the "men's rights" channels were defending him as if Megan lied against him. Only for them to change their tune when the 47 pieces of evidence including a taped recording (which was played in court) where Tory was apologizing profusely for what he did to Megan. It wasn't a civil suit, it was a criminal case brought by the state against Tory based on the evidence they had, Megan's accusations alone wasn't what got Tory charged.

I expected some of the people covering the case to really know better than to take any sides in the case without any evidence disclosure. Then again, a lot of people are just doing stuff for clicks and money, common sense seems to have gone out the window.

EDIT: I edited my original comment because I left out a couple of phrases that muddled it a bit. I also don't want to derail the thread by going this deep into the topic.

[XJlock]

.... Gentle the real bro lololol

I take back all the times I made fun of him!

Gentle is Ride or Die!

Do you think a mutant telepath was needed to extract the knowledge of T'Challa's deception from Gentle's mind or he simply admitted the truth of the matter once Ororo began to question him?

[LastManStanding]

Do you think a mutant telepath was needed to extract the knowledge of T'Challa's deception from Gentle's mind or he simply admitted the truth of the matter once Ororo began to question him?

IMO no telepaths were required because Ororo and Gentle's bond was 'explored' in Storm's mini series Worlds Apart. However T'Challa admonished detractors of Gentle in Wakanda so that was how the kid became loyal to BP.

P.S these stories were written by Christopher Yost.

[chief12d]

IMO no telepaths were required because Ororo and Gentle's bond was 'explored' in Storm's mini series Worlds Apart. However T'Challa admonished detractors of Gentle in Wakanda so that was how the kid became loyal to BP.

P.S these stories were written by Christopher Yost.

You’re right, it was also established in Worlds Apart that T’Challa originally brought Gentle into the royal palace as his ward. While I dislike the retcons Ridley has made, the Gentle one makes a good amount of sense. In books like the OG X-Men Red and even X-Men: Divided We Stand, Gentle is shown to spend time with T’Challa when not with the X-Men.

He’s a bit like T’Challa’s Dick Grayson, a young boy he raises and brings into his world. T’Challa obviously cares about the kid, but he also drafts him into his personal war to keep Wakanda safe, just like how Bruce makes Dick one of his soldiers in his war on crime. It’s a complicated relationship but given how close Gentle has always been shown to be to T’Challa, him being a spy is an interesting wrinkle to his character. It gives him agency. Because he has split loyalties in terms of being rejected by his biological family, but embraced by his king, finding a community in the X-Men while still feeling loyal to the first man to ever give him a chance. It also says something cool about T’Challa because (and this is headcannon) he probably saw a piece of himself in Gentle’s shitty circumstances. He also lost his dad at a young age and was raised by a woman who faced rejection from the Wakandan people, since Ramonda was a foreigner.

It also plays right into T’Challa’s playbook when it comes to the superhero community. In his first appearance he had contingencies against the Fantastic Four. It was later revealed he joined the Avengers to spy on them and collect information. It makes perfect sense he’d have a Wakandan mutant join the X-Men to keep tabs on them.

[Mantis-Ray]

Who is Gentle exactly?

I'm unfamiliar with that character's history.

[Agent Z]

I suspect the Wakandan Empire concept is going to be scrapped after this. Empire has too many negative connotations these days and will more than likely give T'Challa the image of a colonizer.

[LastManStanding]

I suspect the Wakandan Empire concept is going to be scrapped after this. Empire has too many negative connotations these days and will more than likely give T'Challa the image of a colonizer.

Simply rename the empire to the Commonwealth or Realm....new paint on old wood.

[MindofShadow]

Tosin hating T’Challa or hating what he represents is a distinction without a difference at this point in time. T’Challa is a nobleman raised to rule, he’s an individual but he is inseparable from the ruling class Tosin hates by both blood and duty. There’s nothing inherently wrong with disliking him on that account, for the reasons Toonstrack explained. The ruling class and mainstream Wakanda lack the same amount of spiritual reverence for vibranium that his tribe does and use it for tech. That’s a fine basis for disagreement, it’s honestly quite original and in the hands of a Hickman or Redjack would be compelling. What people take issue with is the way it’s expressed.

He calls T’Challa a jackboot and oppressor. He thinks he’s no better than Killmonger, an actual warlord who’s slaughtered Wakandans in pursuit of world domination. So absurdly blinded by hatred he wanted to help Akili, a rebel fascist, kill T’Challa in the middle of a duel. The hatred he has is laughably extreme and unreasonable. And it has not improved in a satisfactory way across 12 issues.

Outside what can only be described as a wildly out of character moment by that hack Coates, T’Challa hasn’t demonstrated jackboot tendencies and is not nearly as power hungry or cruel as the villains he’s fought. Tosin’s criticisms seem paper thin and alien to what we’ve seen of the lead’s character. Even in-universe, someone coming to this conclusion is outrageous and dumb, with little to justify it.

And the pushback he’s gotten has been minimal. Outside Shuri being a bit bewildered by his statements, which I imagine is supposed to reflect the reader’s own surprise, no one has done any compelling defense for the character Tosin constantly criticizes. That’s not “interesting”, it’s annoying. And it has not improved, there’s been no introspection, no reevaluation. And that’s because we’re in a status quo where T’Challa and him aren’t communicating regularly and working through their disagreements. The plot is moving too slowly and in a run that has done little other than say what a bad person T’Challa is, Tosin’s presence is particularly grating. When taken with the overall direction of the run, he makes for a poor element to include.

It’s not surprising fans don’t like him. Who likes to a see a character you enjoy constantly shat on by some new guy with accusations that have no basis in reality while no one, not even the character being criticized, is strongly opposing him? And this isn’t getting into the constant push of Tosin as the future and T’Challa as something to be done away with. When taking into account T’Challa’s piss poor trajectory in the MCU it’s hard not to think Tosin’s existence is more sinister than just being a new supporting character, he’s actively being propped up at T’Challa’s expense.

If t'challa was 1/3 as bad as Tosin acts, he would have crushed the Mute Zone long ago and figured out how they make superhumans with vibranium

Do you think a mutant telepath was needed to extract the knowledge of T'Challa's deception from Gentle's mind or he simply admitted the truth of the matter once Ororo began to question him?

IMO no telepaths were required because Ororo and Gentle's bond was 'explored' in Storm's mini series Worlds Apart. However T'Challa admonished detractors of Gentle in Wakanda so that was how the kid became loyal to BP.

P.S these stories were written by Christopher Yost.

You’re right, it was also established in Worlds Apart that T’Challa originally brought Gentle into the royal palace as his ward. While I dislike the retcons Ridley has made, the Gentle one makes a good amount of sense. In books like the OG X-Men Red and even X-Men: Divided We Stand, Gentle is shown to spend time with T’Challa when not with the X-Men.

He’s a bit like T’Challa’s Dick Grayson, a young boy he raises and brings into his world. T’Challa obviously cares about the kid, but he also drafts him into his personal war to keep Wakanda safe, just like how Bruce makes Dick one of his soldiers in his war on crime. It’s a complicated relationship but given how close Gentle has always been shown to be to T’Challa, him being a spy is an interesting wrinkle to his character. It gives him agency. Because he has split loyalties in terms of being rejected by his biological family, but embraced by his king, finding a community in the X-Men while still feeling loyal to the first man to ever give him a chance. It also says something cool about T’Challa because (and this is headcannon) he probably saw a piece of himself in Gentle’s shitty circumstances. He also lost his dad at a young age and was raised by a woman who faced rejection from the Wakandan people, since Ramonda was a foreigner.

It also plays right into T’Challa’s playbook when it comes to the superhero community. In his first appearance he had contingencies against the Fantastic Four. It was later revealed he joined the Avengers to spy on them and collect information. It makes perfect sense he’d have a Wakandan mutant join the X-Men to keep tabs on them.

Yeah, Gentle is the only "old" character to benefit from Ridley's writing.

But, knowing the X office, they will ignore it when they see fit like usual

Who is Gentle exactly?

I'm unfamiliar with that character's history.

He has a wakandan mom and a white russian dad. He inhertied the X gene from his dad.

Long story short, everyone hated him and picked on him, including his mom. He was basically abused. I *think* he was picked on for being a mutant more so than biracial but I can't remember.

T'challa basically took him in and raised him in the palace. Also, they used vibranium to control his mutant powers so he wouldn't kill himself using them (his abuse made it said he had mental trauma or something).

Storm convinced tchalla to send him to the Xavier school to control his powers.

Recently, in xmen red I think, Jean Grey finally taught him ho wto control his powers without killing himself.


So basically, he is loyal to both T'challa and Storm due to them both trying to help him when basically no one else would. He was used by the X office to talk shit more than anything but he had decent moments here and there. His name has always rubbed BP fans the wrong name but he's never been a "bad" enough character that people hated or anything, a lot of us just wanted more out of him than "oh no my powers are killing me, wakandans hate me, my name is gentle the large black guy"

X-men read and Ridley have actually given him some character development finally. I'm not sure if he's been used recently in the X books or not though.