Ben Reilly: Spider-Man/Scarlet Spider Appreciation 2023

[Jman27]

Yeah, I haven't been here lately because I've been dead for a long time . I've also been taking care of other things, like life itself, even so I've already seen the other forums and to be clear there's not much to highlight except the typical justified complaints with everything that's going on with Spider-Man comics, which is fair enough but repeating it too much can be very tiring and not very healthy in the long run.

It’s the norm here unfortunately

[The Black Death]

It’s the norm here unfortunately

I know, which is very sad, but that's the way things are now unfortunately, at least we can agree on that.

[CaptainUniverse]

So...they don't want Ben to be Spider-Man but no one likes Chasm...so, what if they just give Ben the mantle of Captain Universe? It could open up a whole new world for Ben and Marvel wouldn't have to really worry about what to do because they can just send him on cosmic adventures in space with...Cosmic Ghost Rider and Janine. That would actually be pretty cool, ride or die in space!

[Refrax5]

It makes sense from a pop psychological standpoint. Whether it makes sense in real life... no: I don't think it does. Most abuse survivors do not go on to abuse other people. As I understand it, people like Janine are not the kind of people who in real life snap and become villains. The people who snap and lash out randomly are those who have an aggrieved sense of over-entitlement.

A lot of abusers have abuse in their background. Obviously that isn't true of everybody who was abused, but it's a very true that damaged people damage people. People who were abused to the extent she was, only to try and do the right thing and end up abused again, only to think she's being given a new life and be betrayed again...I can see somebody like that having severe anger issues and a contempt for society. In real life most people don't become maniacal supervillains, but comic books are very much an exaggerated version of reality.

[Refrax5]

Interesting ethical debate we've been having here. I have my own thoughts on the matter, such as they are, though in a comic book universe, it'd be relatively easy to later blame Janine's actions as Hallows' Eve on that demonic essence Madelyne implanted inside her through S'ym's severed finger amplifying her (understandable, possibly justifiable) bitterness and anger towards a world that rejected and scorned her and a system that punished her for defending herself from her heinously, hideously abusive father (thus responsible for the first betrayal of trust and shattering of innocence she experienced in her backstory prior to meeting Ben) and turning those embers into an infernal conflagration of hate and spite. Hell, we could blame the fruits from the trees of Limbo for doing the same thing to The Chasm Formerly Known as Ben Reilly, and since he was pretty far gone already due to having his memories thoroughly f***ed with by Beyond and then that psycho-reactive quantum-shifting polymeric goo he fell into at the end of that saga . . .

A good point about Janine and that finger. I still think you can make a good argument that something similar happened to Ben when he ate that piece of Limbo fruit Madelyn gave him.

But even outside of that, they established in Beyond that tampering with artificial clone memories was a lot more dangerous than a normal person's and even before he went full Chasm, he was still acting cold and weird. Once his mind started collapsing, he was hallucinating, confused, and unstable, so it's clearly not just amnesia. He has some kind of brain damage/insanity that can give them a pretty easy out for any eventual redemption arc.

[Refrax5]

I wouldn't worry 2099 has been shown as super bulky and large

Edit: seems to be the same height as spiderman

https://assets.target.com.au/transfo...peg&quality=80

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/374466077...3A1%3Bchoc%3A1

https://www.hasbro.com/common/produc...21288a8419.jpg

He looks bulkier than Miles but close in height. I'll be so crushed if it isn't Ben under there.

[JustLuke]

He looks bulkier than Miles but close in height. I'll be so crushed if it isn't Ben under there.

Hobbie is around the same height too right? I wonder if they maybe aged Ben down. It might seem weird but considering they raceswapped Jessica Drew, completely redesigned Spider-Man India, genderswapped Cyborg Spider-Man (and Liefelding her up lol) it wouldn't be that out of question. Besides there is some precedent for doing it. In issue 30 of What If Vol 1 "What if Spider-Man's Clone Lived?", the Spider-Clone is actually three years younger than the real Spider-Man. And there was a black Spider-Woman in Spidey Super-Stories a year before the debut of Jessica Drew (although she only emulated Spider-Powers instead of actually having them), so there's precedent for that too. Either that or the toy is just a little off. I don't think it won't be Ben tbh, especially considering how they went out of their way to make him look as comic accurate as possible.

[Refrax5]

Hobbie is around the same height too right? I wonder if they maybe aged Ben down. It might seem weird but considering they raceswapped Jessica Drew, completely redesigned Spider-Man India, genderswapped Cyborg Spider-Man (and Liefelding her up lol) it wouldn't be that out of question. Besides there is some precedent for doing it. In issue 30 of What If Vol 1 "What if Spider-Man's Clone Lived?", the Spider-Clone is actually three years younger than the real Spider-Man. And there was a black Spider-Woman in Spidey Super-Stories a year before the debut of Jessica Drew (although she only emulated Spider-Powers instead of actually having them), so there's precedent for that too. Either that or the toy is just a little off. I don't think it won't be Ben tbh, especially considering how they went out of their way to make him look as comic accurate as possible.

Yeah, hopefully!

[The BaRoN]

The back tracking by Lowe on Ben who plays a part in across the spider verse is going to be hilarious this summer.

Hopefully Wells is gone by then.

[Kurolegacy]

A good point about Janine and that finger. I still think you can make a good argument that something similar happened to Ben when he ate that piece of Limbo fruit Madelyn gave him.

But even outside of that, they established in Beyond that tampering with artificial clone memories was a lot more dangerous than a normal person's and even before he went full Chasm, he was still acting cold and weird. Once his mind started collapsing, he was hallucinating, confused, and unstable, so it's clearly not just amnesia. He has some kind of brain damage/insanity that can give them a pretty easy out for any eventual redemption arc.

I’d say that that plot point would have worked better if it was established prior to the story in which they screwed up his mind. The way that they did it it felt more like they were trying to make a contrived justification on why it affected Ben in such a radically insane way to Peter despite having plot points in the past where Peter lost his memory but remained true to who he is.

[Pav]

I've decided that the only thing that can make Ben-as-Chasm work is having Kaine bond with the Sleeper symbiote, pairing the Bros up, and sending them on the weirdest, most psychedelic adventures possible.

But, you'd still need Ben to sound and act like Ben.

-Pav, who wonders what symbiote others might like to see bond with Kaine...

[CaptainUniverse]

Reject Chasm. Return to...



...SPIDER-CARNAGE!

[Refrax5]

I’d say that that plot point would have worked better if it was established prior to the story in which they screwed up his mind. The way that they did it it felt more like they were trying to make a contrived justification on why it affected Ben in such a radically insane way to Peter despite having plot points in the past where Peter lost his memory but remained true to who he is.

I don't disagree, but I guess its not any different than any other kind of random asspull comic writers do. It's not the kind of thing that would have really come up prior to that story anyway. That aspect didn't really bother me so much. We knew Ben's core memories were artificially implanted, so the idea that they might not work the same way as a regular person's didn't feel too out there to me. I have big problems with the storyline, but that particular aspect didn't really bother me.

[Matt Rat]

Reject Chasm. Return to...



...SPIDER-CARNAGE!

Multiple Spider-Verse stories in comics, tv and film and he's still the best villain out of all the baddies involved in them

[HypnoHustler]

Reject Chasm. Return to...



...SPIDER-CARNAGE!

Probably Ben’s most memorable non-clone related storyline. And I agree… if he fell to Carnage’s corruption, at least it would make more sense from a storyline perspective. Could go for a few years like when Mac Gargan hosted the Venom symbiote. Maybe Ben’s innate goodness eventually wins over the Carnage symbiote. A lot of storytelling potential there.