Jean Grey / Phoenix Appreciation 2023: “A Red Dragon”

[Mercury]

It may be nothing, but Gillen liked this tweet…

(I quoted it here: https://twitter.com/Jean_RED_Grey/st...36570372358379)

[nightw1ng]

Yep, that's right, this incident is what caused Jean to leave the Mansion and go abroad to find some peace. My error.

As to why Jean did not search for them, I think her TP was cut down by the dampers she had placed on them. Her powers failed her when she faced Magneto and she could only get Hank and herself to the surface.

I used to hear people say why didn't Jean save everyone. She could not. Only Hank was close enough as she used a TK force bubble to escape to the surface. I also think Jean was weakened from her ordeal of being held prisoner, then her powers cutting out just when she needed them most against Magneto, blasting miles to the surface, nearly dying from the cold and snow (as noted by Hank) and then the sudden awakening and shock of the X-Men really being gone. I think Jean herself believed they died as there was no way for them to escape. Who knew the Savage Land was so close by? But even the X-Men arriving there were exhausted if I remember correctly.

Another possible explanation along with Jean's exhausted state is that you could say some of the materials and machinery of Magneto's lair had the same TP blocking properties as his helmet. (It would make sense for Magneto to incorporate that tech into his lairs, so he could stay hidden from Prof X.) Perhaps not everything was destroyed in the lava/explosion, and thus the X-Men's thoughts from below the lair were shielded from Jean's scans from above.

[Omega_DCD]

"We are in a place of primal creativity...of ideas made flesh"

The Phoenix is a creature of primal passion....Fire made flesh

Jean created the Phoenix from within the White Hot Room

It may be nothing, but Gillen liked this tweet…

(I quoted it here: https://twitter.com/Jean_RED_Grey/st...36570372358379)

I clocked that specific wording as soon as I read it...I hope KG liking the tweet bodes well :-)

[Phoenixx9]

Another possible explanation along with Jean's exhausted state is that you could say some of the materials and machinery of Magneto's lair had the same TP blocking properties as his helmet. (It would make sense for Magneto to incorporate that tech into his lairs, so he could stay hidden from Prof X.) Perhaps not everything was destroyed in the lava/explosion, and thus the X-Men's thoughts from below the lair were shielded from Jean's scans from above.

Hey, that is a great idea, nightw1ng!! I really like it!

It would make considerable sense that old Mags would incorporate anti-telepathy machinery into his home base, especially since he walks around with an anti-telepahic helmet on his head 99% of the time.

[Soulsword323]

It's such an exciting time to be a Jean fan. All this focus and development is great to see.

I do wish we hadn't lost Werneck for art duties on Immortal though. The art isn't bad by any means, but I wish Werneck could still have been around for these issues spotlighting Jean.

[Mercury]

Could Jean have created Phoenix…? Let me just put this here:

Discussion: https://www.reddit.com/r/xmen/s/O4o03wCogg

Tweet: https://twitter.com/Jean_RED_Grey/st...95662109614546

[Phoenixx9]

Could Jean have created Phoenix…? Let me just put this here:

Discussion: https://www.reddit.com/r/xmen/s/O4o03wCogg

Tweet: https://twitter.com/Jean_RED_Grey/st...95662109614546

Yes, after first reading this X-Men story many years ago and seeing that poster, plus the story from #43? where Jean as a child telepathically reads Scott far away while Xavier could not, and Jean first shows Phoenix Raptors there, I questioned if this was not Jean utilizing/visualizing her power.....as a child, she knew the power was so great, that she gave it an image. As an adult, Jean had the poster in her apartment of the "Phoenix and the Carpet". It could not have been a coincidence.

It is still Jean's power, as Mercury said Jean catalyzing her power increase into a super-heroic form and taking charge at so dire at time the X-Men had not experienced up to that time (The Solor Flare/Space Shuttle incident). Jean is so powerful as Phoenix, that she could give others some Phoenix powers.

[Mercury]

Frankly, I'm overwhelmed. "Jean Grey is the house where I live--and I am the house where Jean Grey Lives. The White Hot Room is where the Phoenix lives. You'll learn more about me, boys, in time! I hope I wasn't too rough..."

[loke13]

Frankly, I'm overwhelmed. "Jean Grey is the house where I live--and I am the house where Jean Grey Lives. The White Hot Room is where the Phoenix lives. You'll learn more about me, boys, in time! I hope I wasn't too rough..."

This issue on Wednesday is going to be amazing.

[Exodus]

Frankly, I'm overwhelmed. "Jean Grey is the house where I live--and I am the house where Jean Grey Lives. The White Hot Room is where the Phoenix lives. You'll learn more about me, boys, in time! I hope I wasn't too rough..."

Omg!!! I cannot wait. Hope we get answers and a status quo shift for Jean‘s relationship to the white hot room!!

[Omega_DCD]

I'm gagging that my headcanon of Jean's truer/deeper connection being to the White Hot Room may actually come to fruition

https://community.cbr.com/showthread...=1#post5776393



“Headcanon...Jean's mutation goes beyond just telepathy/telekinesis...even beyond the Phoenix Force, and deep down she can link directly to the M'Kraan Crystal/White Hot Room...it's why Jean/Phoenix had such a deep, empathic connection with the Crystal in the original Saga, it's why Destiny goes future-blind in her vicinity, calling Jean a nexus of probabilities, it's why she inadvertently crossed over to the Heroes Reborn reality, it's why she goes beyond any other Phoenix host to being actually merged with it and ascends to the White Phoenix of the Crown...and after the Phoenix Force "killed" teen Jean, she eventually realized where she was (the white hot room) and was able to manipulate the environment she was in."

[Phoenixx9]

I'm gagging that my headcanon of Jean's truer/deeper connection being to the White Hot Room may actually come to fruition

https://community.cbr.com/showthread...=1#post5776393



“Headcanon...Jean's mutation goes beyond just telepathy/telekinesis...even beyond the Phoenix Force, and deep down she can link directly to the M'Kraan Crystal/White Hot Room...it's why Jean/Phoenix had such a deep, empathic connection with the Crystal in the original Saga, it's why Destiny goes future-blind in her vicinity, calling Jean a nexus of probabilities, it's why she inadvertently crossed over to the Heroes Reborn reality, it's why she goes beyond any other Phoenix host to being actually merged with it and ascends to the White Phoenix of the Crown...and after the Phoenix Force "killed" teen Jean, she eventually realized where she was (the white hot room) and was able to manipulate the environment she was in."

Yes......and as I have stated before, Jean Phoenix in the OG Phoenix Saga, instantly and instinctively knew what the WHR was when all of the X-Men entered it. While Cyclops and the rest were questioning about what it was and where they were, Jean knew. She even hushed Scott to tell them where they were. This lead me to believe that there was a deeper tie with Jean than simply being a Phoenix host.

[Omega_DCD]

Yes......and as I have stated before, Jean Phoenix in the OG Phoenix Saga, instantly and instinctively knew what the WHR was when all of the X-Men entered it. While Cyclops and the rest were questioning about what it was and where they were, Jean knew. She even hushed Scott to tell them where they were. This lead me to believe that there was a deeper tie with Jean than simply being a Phoenix host.

100% agreed

*Edit*

Wonder if they'll push things even further and go ahead and confirm that Jean created/sent Hope via the WHR to rekindle mutantkind, while Jean was still doing other stuff...as Jean said in NXM #128, "It's not a place, it's how it feels to be the last Hope...and know you'll win against the odds"...also in X-Treme X-Men #9, in regards to Destiny's Diaries, Jean says to Ororo, "Not knowing the future, I'm free to Hope...I choose to believe that's what makes me Phoenix!

Hope has been thematically linked to both Jean and the Phoenix for quite some time...and Jean using Hope as an proxy literally just happened in JG #4

[Icefanatic]

For a long time I felt that Bobby(and by extension Jean) were, to borrow from Doctor Who, 'Bad Wolves'. The Doctor's companion, Rose Tyler, at one point looks into the heart of the Doctor's TARDIS and directly into the Time Vortex and becomes the 'Bad Wolf'. She then uses her temporal powers to create herself as that backwards and forwards through time. I don't believe that is true for Jean or Bobby anymore.

I think as fans we are locked into a false binary. We first encounter Jean and Bobby as Jean and Bobby, they are who we became attached to. So it's understandable to want them to be the chickens that lays the eggs. To be the architect of the cosmic beings they seem destined to become rather than simply hosts along for the ride.

I don't think it's either of those things. I think the Creator created the Phoenix and the Dragon, and Jean and Bobby are the mortal manifestations of those beings, near-gods made flesh.

I come back to the Book of Revelations...

Revelation 12:7-17
King James Version

7 And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels,

8 And prevailed not; neither was their place found any more in heaven.

9 And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.

If we play with that a little bit, Marvel-ize it, you could get...

The Phoenix and her angels fought against the Dragon; and the Dragon fought and his angels also, and their war rent the heavens.
They prevailed not; neither was their place found any more in heaven.
And the Phoenix and the Dragon were cast down unto the earth...

The Phoenix doesn't come from Jean's imagination, but from her MEMORY.

[Phoenixx9]

For a long time I felt that Bobby(and by extension Jean) were, to borrow from Doctor Who, 'Bad Wolves'. The Doctor's companion, Rose Tyler, at one point looks into the heart of the Doctor's TARDIS and directly into the Time Vortex and becomes the 'Bad Wolf'. She then uses her temporal powers to create herself as that backwards and forwards through time. I don't believe that is true for Jean or Bobby anymore.

I think as fans we are locked into a false binary. We first encounter Jean and Bobby as Jean and Bobby, they are who we became attached to. So it's understandable to want them to be the chickens that lays the eggs. To be the architect of the cosmic beings they seem destined to become rather than simply hosts along for the ride.

I don't think it's either of those things. I think the Creator created the Phoenix and the Dragon, and Jean and Bobby are the mortal manifestations of those beings, near-gods made flesh.

I come back to the Book of Revelations...



If we play with that a little bit, Marvel-ize it, you could get...

The Phoenix and her angels fought against the Dragon; and the Dragon fought and his angels also, and their war rent the heavens.
They prevailed not; neither was their place found any more in heaven.
And the Phoenix and the Dragon were cast down unto the earth...

The Phoenix doesn't come from Jean's imagination, but from her MEMORY.

Well, you could also say that bobby is not the dragon.

The Dragon could be The Dragon of the Moon and his angel is Moondragon.