Tim Drake: Robin, Red Robin, Appreciation 2023

[Crabble]

Tim is on life support.

Overdramatic much?

[CPSparkles]

He stop being the "dark ex-robin" after the first big arc. By the end of his series he was just a mini-bruce.

I also think that making him more and more like Bruce kinda took a toll on his appeal. He was supposed to be the relatable Robin, but at the of the Red Robin book he was a rich kid with great intelect making a hit list and with his own "bat cave". They even gave him a Catwoman type love interest.

But that's not entirely on the Red Robin book, which i like, that was a course that DC put him on since Infinite Crisis.

don't forget he was also majority share holder of WE stocks and was on the covers of Magazines.

Tim went to the everyman relatable Robin to billionaire Teen 'CEo' and super genius Tim Wayne who took down the LOA and is so exceptional that powerful immortal Ra's singled him out to be his heir and sent one of his own to steal tim's seed.

Tim does have a niche. He is the wish fulfilment Robin that combines everything that found in the other Robins and batman.

He is an Isekai protagonist complete with Harem [at least he had a harem in RR]

[Crabble]

don't forget he was also majority share holder of WE stocks and was on the covers of Magazines.

Tim went to the everyman relatable Robin to billionaire Teen 'CEo' and super genius Tim Wayne who took down the LOA and is so exceptional that powerful immortal Ra's singled him out to be his heir and sent one of his own to steal tim's seed.

Tim does have a niche. He is the wish fulfilment Robin that combines everything that found in the other Robins and batman.

He is an Isekai protagonist complete with Harem [at least he had a harem in RR]

And that makes it Tim's fault how? Y'know what? Good for Tim. I don't care.

[CPSparkles]

Overdramatic much?

Not over dramatic simply the truth. what would you call a character that DC is so desperate to make appealing that they not only race bent him [he's African/Asian in the Titans tv show], They push him out of the closet in the comics, They shove into their best selling titles to give him a boost.

When companies get desperate they resort to gimmicks. DC is desperate.

[CPSparkles]

And that makes it Tim's fault how?

What are you talking about? I don't think you understood. Where are you getting fault from.

[Crabble]

Not over dramatic simply the truth. what would you call a character that DC is so desperate to make appealing that they not only race bent him [he's African/Asian in the Titans tv show], They push him out of the closet in the comics, They shove into their best selling titles to give him a boost.

When companies get desperate they resort to gimmicks. DC is desperate.

To you, maybe. So what? Lana Lang and Pete Ross were race bent in Smallville.

[Drako]

don't forget he was also majority share holder of WE stocks and was on the covers of Magazines.

Tim went to the everyman relatable Robin to billionaire Teen 'CEo' and super genius Tim Wayne who took down the LOA and is so exceptional that powerful immortal Ra's singled him out to be his heir and sent one of his own to steal tim's seed.

Tim does have a niche. He is the wish fulfilment Robin that combines everything that found in the other Robins and batman.

He is an Isekai protagonist complete with Harem [at least he had a harem in RR]

I forgot he was being called Tim Wayne too.
But to be clear, i don't think the Red Robin era was his downfall, but a sign of what DC was trying to turn him into and what the New 52 actually did to the character.

[Aahz]

I really doubt "balance his normal life with Superhero stuff" was a so important trait for the character popularity.

But the Teen Age Highschool drama stuff was at least something that made him differnt from they type of stories they are telling with Dick.

I mean in what ever Identity are putting him now, unless they find some kind of unique direction (which is maybe what they tried now by turning him bi) he is either a secondary Robin or a secondary Nightwing. And I think by continuously shrinking the age gab between Tim's and Damian's generation (I mean Wallace and Emiko seem to now to be the same age as Tim's genration) it becomes worse, and not only for Tim but also the rest of his generation.

[Frontier]

And what would that be? Break up the
I've seen you make this argument before. Since Damian became we don't get Batman and Robin team ups which is a deliberate distortion of the truth.

You are a Batman fan so I bet you have the runs from the 90's. Therefore you more than most know for a fact that when Tim came around was when Batman stopped having Batman and Robin working together as a pair.

Damian's introduction brought the dynamic duo as a team working together, regularly in the same title.
Tim's intro split them apart and Damian's intro brought them back together.

I know you know this so what are we doing?

Tim past been redundant years ago. These days he exists in this strange place of limbo where he doesn't age, he's unable to evolve and despite all attempts to make him thrive/grow he just keeps declining.

Tim is on life support.

They didn't have a dedicated Batman and Robin book but I read a lot of stories with Bruce and Tim together.

Generally writers don't seem as interested in featuring Batman and Robin together as a dynamic duo for one reason or another, though while I think Bruce and Damian could work even Morrison seemed to think Tim matched Bruce better than Damian did compared to the DickxDamian duo. Even if I think there can be more to Tim than being Bruce's partner.

[godisawesome]

I think some people are forgetting that even the Red Robin solo still had Tim dealing with some “civilian life” issues and maintained his old “voice” under Dixon, with Tim carrying this odd but intriguing mix of resentment towards what life had turned him into but also some glee.

And I”d argue that the method and operating procedure Nicieza gave him was distinct enough from Dick and Bruce to standout.

In general, I think the clash between him trying to find an equilibrium he could enjoy between a social life, a super hero life, and a tendency to try and Chessmaster his way through everything worked very, very well - particularly since part of Nicieza’s portrayal was to have him try being proactive in ways both positive and negative in a way that most writers didn’t even do with Bruce (because they tend to only spring him being proactive as a surprise to the audience, rather than as part of the usual, issue-to-issue procedure.)

[Aahz]

I think some people are forgetting that even the Red Robin solo still had Tim dealing with some “civilian life” issues and maintained his old “voice” under Dixon, with Tim carrying this odd but intriguing mix of resentment towards what life had turned him into but also some glee.

But with him dropping out of school, and his parents dead (or what ever happend to Dana) it was drasticly reduced, and since flashpoint it is completely missing.

[the illustrious mr. kenway]

Tim can get it back by just exploring life outside of being a superhero. It's similar to the current Captain America run where Steve has a circle of friends outside of his superhero connections.

[godisawesome]

But with him dropping out of school, and his parents dead (or what ever happend to Dana) it was drasticly reduced, and since flashpoint it is completely missing.

Yeah... but at the same time, I think it's important to recognize that the end of the Robin run and Red Robin run increased the importance of his "non-work hours" compared to the doldrums before them, *and* that a decent chunk of the Post-Dixon civilian stuff was poorly written compared to what came before it before than as well. *And* Scott Lobdell and Will Pfeiffer were ostensibly trying to have some "non-work hours" storytelling in Teen Titans... and generally sucked at it, especially compared to other books where they seemed far, far better at it.

Civilian life hijinks are to Tim what romantic interests are to Dick - absolutely fantastic and a key ingredient when done well... but a drag or even worse when done badly.

Nicieza and Yost did not have a civilian life that reflected Dixon's early work, but they still wrote it better than many of Tim's other writers post-Dixon, and the Red Robin series reflected that. Watching Tim and Tam have an awkward cheeseburger date while discussing Neon Knights was better than having Tim deal with Darla or anything under Adam Beechen.

[Digifiend]

But with him dropping out of school, and his parents dead (or what ever happend to Dana) it was drasticly reduced, and since flashpoint it is completely missing.

Wasn't Dana in Bludhaven when it was nuked? That event no longer happened in current continuity, so she ought to still be alive. However, was the place in Bludhaven she was at a mental hospice? If she was deemed unfit to look after her stepson it still makes sense that Tim ended up adopted by Bruce.

[NOCTPHOENIX]

It appears Tim's solo is outside the top 200

https://www.comicbookrevolution.com/...k-sales-chart/