Star Trek TOS - If you could re-write one film...

[Jokerz79]

Does anyone know why Saavik just disappeared from the films?

Unless I missed it, she does not appear after ST IV TVH

She was originally intended to be the Valeris character in VI but it was decided to change it to a new character given the character would be revealed as a traitor.

[caj]

She was originally intended to be the Valeris character in VI but it was decided to change it to a new character given the character would be revealed as a traitor.

Ah, okay. Thanks. I appreciate it.

Yeah, I'm glad they didn't make her a traitor.

[thwhtGuardian]

She was originally intended to be the Valeris character in VI but it was decided to change it to a new character given the character would be revealed as a traitor.

I kind of wish they had met Allie's contract demands, I wonder if the character would have gotten a better showing with a stronger actress.

[ChrisIII]

There's also a deleted subplot from IV. She's pregnant with Spock's baby from the Pon Farr on Genesis. Hence her staying on Vulcan, presumably the trip back to earth would've been a bad idea (Not even factoring in the time travel turbulence the ship goes through twice).


Mentioned it earlier but in the second DC series she becomes Sulu's replacement as helmsman, but she eventually becomes jealous of Spock's new protege Valeris and leaves the ship.


Think some of the novels have her eventually get married to Spock, explaining the odd "son's wedding" reference in TNG's "Sarek".

[MoneySpider]

Strange question, but why didn't Spock and Saavik use some form of birth control? And now that I'm thinking about it, did Spock and the Romulan commander from "The Enterprise Incident" use birth control when they had Pon Farr?

[ChrisIII]

What's even more of a question, what would the Genesis effect have on the baby?

[AnakinFlair]

True.


Kind of wonder how the TOS movies (apart from the Kelvin ones of course which do use a similar design) would've been like with uniforms like the ones seen in the TV series. (There's been a good deal of photoshop fan art done to that effect). The Phase II tests kind of give a bit of that.

Funny thing is there's actually a 70's Shatner TV movie where he wears a yellow shirt somewhat similar to his TOS Kirk look: "Pray for the Wildcats".

There's also the curious mention in Generation that Kirk had retired at some point in the past and went back to starfleet, although I think it's mostly assumed by the "Nine years" that this was between TMP and TWOK (Presumably after he gave up being captain a second time and before he became Admiral a second time).

Kirk never got promoted to Admiral again. He got demoted in Star Trek IV to Captain, and he was still addressed as 'Captain Kirk' in Star Trek: Generations.

Does anyone know why Saavik just disappeared from the films?

Unless I missed it, she does not appear after ST IV TVH

She was originally intended to be the Valeris character in VI but it was decided to change it to a new character given the character would be revealed as a traitor.

I remember reading a story that when the story for Star Trek VI was originally pitched, Gene Roddenberry was the one who put the kibosh on having Saavik be the traitor, which ticked off Nicholas Meyers, who said something like "I created the character, if I want her to be a traitor, she'll be a traitor.' But Roddenberry put his foot down, so they created Valeris as Spock's new protégé.

[ChrisIII]

I was referring to the time gap between TMP and TWOK-In TMP Kirk gives himself the Captain rank again, but by TWOK he's back to Admiral, although in a different position.


Kind of interesting Gene had strong opinions on Saavik, considering he was largely cold towards the post-TMP movies I think, especially TFF.

[Jokerz79]

I just always assumed Kirk was still an Admiral just took command of the Enterprise and possibly took her on another 5-year mission after the events with V'Ger.

TMP took place in 2271 while TWOK took place in 2285 meaning there is a large time gap.

Also, I was always under the assumption that the TMP era was the only time the Enterprise was the Flagship with possibly being the Flagship is the reason Kirk could get away with being an Admiral and keeping the command. But I never got that impression in TOS that she was the Flagship and by TWOK she's a training vessel even in the years between IV and VI I would assume Excelsior was the Flagship.

[caj]

I just always assumed Kirk was still an Admiral just took command of the Enterprise and possibly took her on another 5-year mission after the events with V'Ger.

TMP took place in 2271 while TWOK took place in 2285 meaning there is a large time gap.

Also, I was always under the assumption that the TMP era was the only time the Enterprise was the Flagship with possibly being the Flagship is the reason Kirk could get away with being an Admiral and keeping the command. But I never got that impression in TOS that she was the Flagship and by TWOK she's a training vessel even in the years between IV and VI I would assume Excelsior was the Flagship.

All very good points.

[ChrisIII]

Kirk is addressed as Captain throughout most of TMP, first I think after Scotty's "Untried captain" remark about Decker.

[Jokerz79]

Personally, from best to worst I rank the films based on my enjoyment like this The Wrath of Khan, Undiscovered Country, First Contact, Voyage Home, Beyond, Search for Spock, The Motion Picture, 2009, Generations, Nemesis, Final Frontier, Into Darkness, & Insurrection.

But ranking the Directors on the Filmmaking of the movies my ranking goes as follows this takes into account pacing/editing, lighting, set design/effects, sound, & costumes.

1: Nicholas Meyer his revamp of the film series with Wrath of Khan was Fantastic and the pacing, editing, set designs, and costumes were all great. With editing and pacing he built real tension in TWOK.

2: JJ Abrams for all his flaws had great set designs, costumes, lighting (Even with lens flares), & pacing within their story.

3: Jonathan Frakes for First Contact everything was great, and the Borg scenes were menacing right out of a zombie film. Insurrection looked like a cheap tv movie.

4: Leonard Nimoy: He didn't nothing amazing with the film series but with Voyage Home he got comedic performances out of actors who weren't comedic actors and handled real outdoor filming great something no other Trek direct had to do on any equal level.

5: Justin Lin most of his esthetics were carry overs from Abrams but he was better at pacing and editing for a Star Trek story than Abrams and Yorktown Station's design left me speechless at the time.

6: Robert Wise easily the best director on the list but his entry into Trek had massive pacing issues while being visual spectacle. I love TMP but also admit while it looks great it also is very slow paced.

7: David Carson Generations wasn't anything special, but it had some awesome set designs like the Enterprise Bridges for both the B and D. It also had amazing lighting like when Enterprise is at the Space Observatory and how he had the lighting shining on Enterprise and coming thru the windows. The ship's exterior was light great too.

8: Stuart Baird he did a fine job just nothing noteworthy.

9: William Shatner he did a serviceable job, but everything across the board was mediocre from set designs, costumes, & effects. Also, much like Insurrection it looked like a high end Direct to Video release not a theatrical release.

[caj]

Personally, from best to worst I rank the films based on my enjoyment like this The Wrath of Khan, Undiscovered Country, First Contact, Voyage Home, Beyond, Search for Spock, The Motion Picture, 2009, Generations, Nemesis, Final Frontier, Into Darkness, & Insurrection.

But ranking the Directors on the Filmmaking of the movies my ranking goes as follows this takes into account pacing/editing, lighting, set design/effects, sound, & costumes.

1: Nicholas Meyer his revamp of the film series with Wrath of Khan was Fantastic and the pacing, editing, set designs, and costumes were all great. With editing and pacing he built real tension in TWOK.

2: JJ Abrams for all his flaws had great set designs, costumes, lighting (Even with lens flares), & pacing within their story.

3: Jonathan Frakes for First Contact everything was great, and the Borg scenes were menacing right out of a zombie film. Insurrection looked like a cheap tv movie.

4: Leonard Nimoy: He didn't nothing amazing with the film series but with Voyage Home he got comedic performances out of actors who weren't comedic actors and handled real outdoor filming great something no other Trek direct had to do on any equal level.

5: Justin Lin most of his esthetics were carry overs from Abrams but he was better at pacing and editing for a Star Trek story than Abrams and Yorktown Station's design left me speechless at the time.

6: Robert Wise easily the best director on the list but his entry into Trek had massive pacing issues while being visual spectacle. I love TMP but also admit while it looks great it also is very slow paced.

7: David Carson Generations wasn't anything special, but it had some awesome set designs like the Enterprise Bridges for both the B and D. It also had amazing lighting like when Enterprise is at the Space Observatory and how he had the lighting shining on Enterprise and coming thru the windows. The ship's exterior was light great too.

8: Stuart Baird he did a fine job just nothing noteworthy.

9: William Shatner he did a serviceable job, but everything across the board was mediocre from set designs, costumes, & effects. Also, much like Insurrection it looked like a high end Direct to Video release not a theatrical release.

Nice breakdown. Appreciated.

[ChrisIII]

Most of the sets from TWOK are recycled TMP sets but with very different lighting and decorations. Kirk's quarters for example are mostly identical but have a more lived in look with more wall decorations and so on (makes sense since the TMP version was right out of dock). Bridge set-also used for Reliant and the simulation is also the same but with the stations moved around and somewhat smaller looking giving it more of a TOS feel-Spock's science station for example is in it's more traditional place. TFF's stuff was iffy I agree. Although it looks more like TOS the shuttle bay got a massive downgrade from TMP, where it seems to cover a huge chunk of the secondary hull. The bridge set was kind of neat though, sort of a transition to the more "comfy" TNG look.

[nx01a]

The most egregious offender: V - The Final Frontier!
*Lose the humour... except Row Row Row Your Boat.
*Have Sybok put each of the main cast through the same psychic inquest as Spock and McCoy. Kirk can still refuse since we know his moment would have been David's death... and it's in his character to refuse some psychic quick fix.
*Have God be more insidious, its Heaven far more inviting, its offer to spread such peace and beauty across the galaxy more enticing. Make Kirk have to really work to figure out what God wants with a starship.

As for the others...
VII - Generations
*A more epic battle between the Ent D and a modern Klingon capital ship like a Vorcha class attack cruiser. The crash is perfect so the battle leading to the death of the 1701 D needs to match that.

IX - Insurrection
*The Ent E starts out having an epic battle (see where my mind goes? :P ) against the Jem'Hadar for control of Betazed, setting the film firmly in the midst of the Dominion War and giving Deanna something to do. After that, they realize the Dominion is using the Son'a to make ketracel white, a key part of the war effort, which indirectly leads them to the Briar Patch where they discover Starfleet's rogue action to steal the Baku plantet's immortality particle ring thingies. Starfleet orders them to leave, they don't, and the rest of the movie proceeds as before.

X - Nemesis
*I'm honestly not sure how to salvage this one but I'll try.
*No B4. No temporal DNA. No telepathic rape.
*Shinzon can still be a clone but one specifically trained and raised by the Romulans to be their version of Picard, not discarded on Remus. His Romulan upbringing by Sela doubled with his innate capacities lead him to carry out a coup with Sela, killing the Senate and taking over the Romulan Star Empire. Surprisingly, Sela and Shinzon request the Ent E come to Romulus for a diplomatic meeting. It's obviously a trap but the Federation needs to get some Intel. Shinzon and Sela figure the Ent E is the biggest obstacle to them deploying the Scimitar to annihilate Earth so they try to keep the crew busy with diplomacy while the Scimitar launches. A Romulan defector reveals the truth, and the Ent E and a small joint Romulan-Federarion fleet engage the Scimitar in that green nebula. Data sacrifices himself to save Picard and destroy the Scimitar and Shinzon, and Sela becomes a prisoner of war.
*Hell, have the entire Ent E crew cloned so everyone gets a chance to see their evil younger selves. And have Sela and Shinzon steal and reactivate Lore for extra shits and giggles. Have Mirror La Forge create the perfect cloak, Mirror Worf be at the Scimitar's tactical, and Mirror Beverly cook up bioweapons for use against Federation and the Klingons or have to harvest the originals for replacement organs or somesuch. That's the closest I'll go to the needing anyone's DNA. Maybe Mirror Deanna has a thing for Riker and tries to do bad things to him and the rest of the crew telepathically, and our Deanna gets to be the one to battle her mentally as well as locate her aboard the cloaked Scimitar for Worf to fire at.

There ya go. All my rewrite fanfic ideas. :P