BOOYAH!!!: Cyborg/Victor Stone Appreciation 2023

[Robotman]

But he’s not disabled. He’s perfectly blended with technology. He’s not limited. He’s advanced. He has more abilities than the majority of superheroes out there. The way his powers are described he’s the man of the future. The way he’s written is the man in the past.

We look at nanotechnology as the greatest of all tech, like iron man. Yet with Vic, he’s treated like he’s hobbled on one leg with a sling on his arm and a bandage over his left eye. He’s the most advanced human in the dcu.

In NTT his disability was a focus of the character. What helped him accept his new cybernetic body was that he met a group a kids with disabilities and prosthetic limbs and became an inspiration to them.



Keeping some focus on Vic being disabled would have been fine if he remained an auxiliary character in DC and maybe stayed on the Titans forever. But in the New 52 they wanted him to be the most prominent black superhero in the DCU. Helping to found the Justice League and be one of the main faces of the company. At that point they needed to shift him away from being a “freak” character who hates the way they look like Marvel’s The Thing. Instead they doubled down.

One thing that frustrated the hell out of fans was that DC never let him grow past that initial role. It would have been understandable if he struggled at first with his transformation and new body/abilities but then had character progression where he learns to use his powers and transforms into a sleek modern tech god superhero who fits right in with the other beautiful looking members of the JLA. It took them 5 years until they finally allowed someone like David F. Walker to take him in that direction, then of course they quickly changed Vic right back to the tragic mangled freak superhero.

[marhawkman]

Iron Man's not a cyborg

depends on the story, sometimes yes.

[Iconic]

Like what?

Superhuman: strength, stamina, speed, durability
Computer interfacing
Sensors: optic, thermal, motion
Reshaping body parts/cybernetics
Flight

Assuming the future looks like Victor, which is questionable.

We use smartphones/pc’s religiously as an extension of ourselves to interface with the world instantaneously. Cyborg is the embodiment of that. We judge the future by technological achievements.

Iron Man's not a cyborg

As we are all well aware. The point being what nanotechnology is perceived as in the comic universes. Vic can rearrange nanotechnology in his body to nearly any form. He can make blue and red lights appear. He can make boosters pop out of nowhere. He can make some parts of himself darker shades than others. His powers on paper are amazing.

In the comics though? Permanent 3/5ths face, bulky, nanotechnology is unable to change his body to look as normal as his peers, woe is me “am I a man” storylines.

To sum it up: What we’re being told doesn’t line up with what’s being shown.

[dkrook]

Superhuman: strength, stamina, speed, durability
Computer interfacing
Sensors: optic, thermal, motion
Reshaping body parts/cybernetics
Flight





We use smartphones/pc’s religiously as an extension of ourselves to interface with the world instantaneously. Cyborg is the embodiment of that. We judge the future by technological achievements.


As we are all well aware. The point being what nanotechnology is perceived as in the comic universes. Vic can rearrange nanotechnology in his body to nearly any form. He can make blue and red lights appear. He can make boosters pop out of nowhere. He can make some parts of himself darker shades than others. His powers on paper are amazing.

In the comics though? Permanent 3/5ths face, bulky, nanotechnology is unable to change his body to look as normal as his peers, woe is me “am I a man” storylines.

To sum it up: What we’re being told doesn’t line up with what’s being shown.

1000% facts! However some can't reconcile the idea of technological progression with old retrograde perception. There's no way in hell Victor would be relegated to a walking black tin-can man with even his base abilities. DC is THE main culprit in getting in Victor's way to being a great character. Most of Cyborg's JL run was sabotaged by letting/forcing Batman into a lane that should have been Vic's. It was most apparent when Bruce was written to be the God of technology, after that I finally realized DC will never get Victor in the right position.

[the illustrious mr. kenway]

I don't mind the Mother box origin but I see it as a wasted opportunity along similar to tying Beast Boy to the red or the mystical origins of Earth 2. All of them open more doors than DC realized and haven't capitalized on it. It feels like DC is too retro in how it approaches the Man versus Machine theme.

[Jabare]

less is more. I'd rather Victor be written consistently with clear baselines. New 52 tried to make him too powerful. He was just a walking transformer that got chumped out and hacked in far too many stories.

Let's have him be a little more human. A young athlete/ prodigy that was in a terrible accident and saved through advanced cybernetics. Don't Frankenstein him, don't even robocop him. I feel like that's too much. Writers will be less likely to rip him to shreds if he's a little more flesh and blood. More human.

He doesn't need to be a bruiser either. His strength will always be his ability to interface, manipulate and control technology. Thats tremendously powerful by itself. Sure he could throw hands far above any regular human, but on a team he's never going to be Superman, Wonder Woman or even Donna Troy and Starfire in terms of raw strength.

I wouldn't mind if he's a little more agile tho. I don't know if he's got any propulsion on this redesign, but he was a top tier athlete and prospect before his accident. those instincts shouldn't have gone away

[sifighter]

I personally have a headcannon of him being more low tech when he starts out with the Titans but greatly expands once he merges/integrates a mother box into his existing systems. Basically an alien upgrade to his human level tech that boosts his powers.

[sifighter]

You know I’ll be real here I’ve always wanted a miniseries that streamlined Cyborgs history.

Starts with his accident, then joining the titans, he begins his hero career and rises in fame, gets Mother box powers, joins the Justice League, but still makes time for his now adult friends the Titans.

[Jabare]

if characters were allowed to age the Titans would just supplant the Justice League. Outside of Superman they pretty much have every other role covered.

Starfire and Raven are no slouches. I know Martian Manhunter is that other pillar often left unaccounted for but he jobs so much I don't rank him as highly as others do.

Also given how the New 52 went I think I'd take him with a competently written Titans team that's allowed to win for once

[marhawkman]

if characters were allowed to age the Titans would just supplant the Justice League. Outside of Superman they pretty much have every other role covered.

Starfire and Raven are no slouches. I know Martian Manhunter is that other pillar often left unaccounted for but he jobs so much I don't rank him as highly as others do.

Also given how the New 52 went I think I'd take him with a competently written Titans team that's allowed to win for once

M'gann M'Orzz is actually an adult if you measure her age using Earth time which, yes, she also ends up jobbing a lot.

[Agent Z]

Superhuman: strength, stamina, speed, durability
Computer interfacing
Sensors: optic, thermal, motion
Reshaping body parts/cybernetics
Flight

Most of these are abilities extremely common in DC to the point it's practically a running gag. Two of Victor's teammates on the Titans have most of these powers.

We use smartphones/pc’s religiously as an extension of ourselves to interface with the world instantaneously. Cyborg is the embodiment of that. We judge the future by technological achievements.

People aren't fusing smartphones into their bodies. When people get injured like Victor did in his origin, the result is not a super cyborg.

As we are all well aware. The point being what nanotechnology is perceived as in the comic universes. Vic can rearrange nanotechnology in his body to nearly any form. He can make blue and red lights appear. He can make boosters pop out of nowhere. He can make some parts of himself darker shades than others. His powers on paper are amazing.

In the comics though? Permanent 3/5ths face, bulky, nanotechnology is unable to change his body to look as normal as his peers, woe is me “am I a man” storylines.

To sum it up: What we’re being told doesn’t line up with what’s being shown.

You're talking as if Victor could always do this. I'm not even sure if he still has these powers anymore. Either way, my point is that people can see Victor however they want and that is fine. Him being seen as disabled by others shouldn't take anything away from you unless you want it to.

[Iconic]

Most of these are abilities extremely common in DC to the point it's practically a running gag. Two of Victor's teammates on the Titans have most of these powers.

The context of that list wasn’t about his powers being exclusive. It was in reference to him not being disabled, but a more advanced human. Is the Million Dollar Man or the Bionic Woman perceived as disabled after their augmentation? No. We look at them as advanced & superhuman. Also, no other original Titan morphs weapons, boosters, has sensors or interfaces with tech like Vic.

People aren't fusing smartphones into their bodies. When people get injured like Victor did in his origin, the result is not a super cyborg.

When people get struck by lightning they don’t get super speed either. Also, between earbuds, smart watches, smart rings, AI we talk to, we are striving to reach Cyborg levels everyday.

You're talking as if Victor could always do this. I'm not even sure if he still has these powers anymore. Either way, my point is that people can see Victor however they want and that is fine. Him being seen as disabled by others shouldn't take anything away from you unless you want it to.

Yes. See him how you want. I’m judging him by how DC says his powers operate. It just doesn’t line up with what they show. If he’s made with advanced alien tech, then it should show is all I think. Technology continually advances.

Remember, when Superman started, all he could do was leap tall buildings and be strong. As time went on they advanced the character to what he is today.

[Frontier]

Whatever the case I like the vibe I'm getting from the mini from the art to what the writer seems to be going for.

Hopefully Taylor writes him decently as well.

[Riv86672]

less is more. I'd rather Victor be written consistently with clear baselines. New 52 tried to make him too powerful. He was just a walking transformer that got chumped out and hacked in far too many stories.

Let's have him be a little more human. A young athlete/ prodigy that was in a terrible accident and saved through advanced cybernetics. Don't Frankenstein him, don't even robocop him. I feel like that's too much. Writers will be less likely to rip him to shreds if he's a little more flesh and blood. More human.

He doesn't need to be a bruiser either. His strength will always be his ability to interface, manipulate and control technology. Thats tremendously powerful by itself. Sure he could throw hands far above any regular human, but on a team he's never going to be Superman, Wonder Woman or even Donna Troy and Starfire in terms of raw strength.

I wouldn't mind if he's a little more agile tho. I don't know if he's got any propulsion on this redesign, but he was a top tier athlete and prospect before his accident. those instincts shouldn't have gone away

^^^Nailed it! Upvote.

[Iconic]

Yeah… Looking at those DC swimsuit variants… This ain’t it. All those beautiful superheroes and then there’s Vic. He sticks out so badly in those covers.

He’s your one non-legacy, black male hero that has any notable appearances and this is as good as it gets. I actually held out hope that he might be able to show more flesh. Oh well.