Dark Web Finale Preview

[Lukmendes]

spoilers:

Did it? It doesn't feel like it, but then again Wells is writing this so...

end of spoilers

At the very least Duggan's X-Men had Cyke and Jean openly opposing the Quiet Council more, doing their own thing instead of just being Xavier's puppets.

Funnily enough, Wells' own Hellions also had at least Alex opposing the Quiet Council, specifically, QC didn't want to resurrect Madelyne 'cause she's a clone, which made Alex upset.

Eventually the rest of the Five decided they'll resurrect clones anyways and to hell with what the Quiet Council says, it's why they resurrected Gabby in New Mutants vol 4, and also why Madelyne was eventually resurrected (Well, that and Emma apparently pulling some strings).

So basically, there's more opposition to the Quiet Council compared to Hickman's earlier issues, but, yeah, the place is still a mess...

[Matt Rat]

Nick Lowe appears to be stuck on a loop over on Twitter, responding to every dissatisfied customers comments with "sorry you didn't like the book, have a nice day"

Also other people are constantly sending him examples of Peter pirating things in prior stories to counter his "Peter wouldn't steal comics" argument. Delicious.

[Cloneurosis]

You know, I can handle spineless, passive, unfunny, manchild BND Peter, most other writers in different books pay him respect, understanding the meaning of the word "Amazing" and how he's a go-getter from the start.
I can handle MJ being mad over... something... in the most transparent outrage bait attempt Marvel has ever published, with Paul and the kids not even existing as characters and having a voice, popping up exclusively for inflammatory pages, because I know all this idiotic **** is getting reversed at the end of the day.
I can handle mediocre rehashes of classics featuring iconic villains as limp parodies of themselves, dropping shallow references coupled with notes as if these bedtime stories are made more compelling that way, for one day these characters may be paid respect in talented hands.
I can handle all of Peter's supporting cast being removed from him to prop up failed characters, as eventually they'll come back unless their surname is Brock or Thompson.
I can handle Peter Parker's social life being almost entirely gone in favor of Spider-Man's, as I hope one day someone will recall the recipe for ASM.
I can handle the gimmick suit cycle just to fuel merch, for they don't usually overstay their welcome anymore. Usually.
I can handle the thick, tangible cynicism permeating ASM, in hopes it keeps tanking sales and collapses on itself.
I can handle the beatdown sessions with no pay-off or message, for at least JRJR is a good visceral artist.
I can handle the annual Saint Gwendolyne Stacy revival, writers are so bad at nailing her voice I'm unable to register her as a character anymore.

spoilers:

I draw the line at two arc long 'power and responsibility' franchise meets 'historically unaccountable racial cult with a victim complex' franchise event, amounting for 41 issues over roughly 9 months total, which existed solely to present notorious villain Madelyne Pryor who just unleashed a Limbo invasion by herself as some nuanced victim that can't answer for her actions, and brain damaged, desperate, third time in a row heel-turned, inspirational existential dread survivor Ben Reilly as rotten. And Janine, no, I'm sorry, "fan favorite Hallows' Eve" got exhumed exclusively as Reilly's lover, to be rewritten as an unhinged person with violent outbursts that enables Ben completely despite having the whole picture of Beyond's events. She was given a demon's finger and a near body paint suit to wear while starring in several dozen sexy variant covers, because that's what you do to a child abuse victim character. And then the one page hits, the perverse role switch and corruption of the 90's dynamics. Where Ben would lift Peter up at his worst while knowing to be the clone, here Peter acts as sociopath serving disingenuous questions to his incoherent, clearly brain damaged cousin, excusing himself of any responsibility for his recovery. All this happens while Peter is Norman's sugar baby, the guy who financed Warren, orchestrated the entire Clone Saga and killed Ben. But it's okay you see, for Norman puked something and helped Peter with "quite a pickle".

end of spoilers

ASM is nothing but a spite job and I'm done entertaining it, the book has nowhere to go while Lowe is the editor.

[CaptainUniverse]

Nick Lowe appears to be stuck on a loop over on Twitter, responding to every dissatisfied customers comments with "sorry you didn't like the book, have a nice day"

Also other people are constantly sending him examples of Peter pirating things in prior stories to counter his "Peter wouldn't steal comics" argument. Delicious.

It's all so good it just has to be fattening. LOL!

[ZeroBG82]

Nick Lowe appears to be stuck on a loop over on Twitter, responding to every dissatisfied customers comments with "sorry you didn't like the book, have a nice day"

Also other people are constantly sending him examples of Peter pirating things in prior stories to counter his "Peter wouldn't steal comics" argument. Delicious.

Sounds like Lowe (and Marvel editorial generally) have gone the route of political partisans. 'If what they are saying supports me it's true. If it doesn't it's illegitimate and malicious.'

But that's ok, Mr Lowe. I'm having a great day saving money by not buying any Marvel comics thanks to you and your team.

[Matt Rat]

It's all so good it just has to be fattening. LOL!

Nick: "Piracy is bad, dating thieves is good"

[CaptainUniverse]

Nick: "Piracy is bad, dating thieves is good"

Talk about a triple bypass burger...

What a hypocrite!

"As long as she dates me its okay if she steals!" Or something like that...

[IamnotJudasTraveller]

This is a positively braindead little tale.

If Madelyne still has a soft spot for Ben -to go as far as suggesting he has a spacious untorture room held up lord knows how in her embassy- then there is absolutely no reason not to give him his missing memories back. Hell, there is even less reason for him not to conceive of the idea when she tells him Jean gave her her memories freely.

Dark Web also seemed like it'd be about exploring Maddie and Ben's impostor syndromes, as opposed to suddenly becoming wacky antics that prioritized Rek-raps and ineffective torture measures to get Peter to break. You'd almost think they could've made the point Ben didn't really mean it and was mostly lashing out in his own way, sort of doing a hyperlaborious sibling tantrum due to how bad his mind got tampered with but that come to the end of it, he didn't want to harm Peter or the people in his periphery. Hell, even the big "King of Limbo" thing is mostly forced on him by Janine as opposed to it being out of his own devices, because if we want to open another can of worms "agency" has been lacking a whole ton for Ben as far as his takeback-of-what's-his' is concerned and its ineffective methods paired with.

I hate to sound like a soundboard, but there isn't really a whole lot else to it than perhaps the daddy of all idiot plots. This story could have only played this way and concluded as thus if no one actually behaved in character or wanting to solve the problems they were even faced with to begin with.

It's also a good thing we've spent those 19+ issues in Beyond but every last thing that could also impact this outcome has been summarily swept under the rug - if you had any interest in Beyond getting come-uppance (let alone Maxine), or the whole superhero division with the Slingers or just what would even Marcus be up to, with no signs in the slightest these will be even approached to begin with. It does seem like Wells wanted to conclude his Madelyne story first and foremost, and Ben was just the handiest device to be able to pull it off in the gig he did land.

[CrimsonEchidna]

I mean this as no slight against Ben Reilly fans. I'm just going to echo what I previously posted; if there was no real long term plans for Ben Reilly, then Nick Lowe never should've given Slott the greenlight to resurrect him and make him be the villain of Clone Conspiracy in the first place. Everything that has happened with the character since has just been one "course correction" after another because its clear they have no idea what to do with the character. Lowe's closing statement in the final issue of Beyond made that crystal clear.

[Sr. Bungle]

This is a positively braindead little tale.

If Madelyne still has a soft spot for Ben -to go as far as suggesting he has a spacious untorture room held up lord knows how in her embassy- then there is absolutely no reason not to give him his missing memories back. Hell, there is even less reason for him not to conceive of the idea when she tells him Jean gave her her memories freely.

Dark Web also seemed like it'd be about exploring Maddie and Ben's impostor syndromes, as opposed to suddenly becoming wacky antics that prioritized Rek-raps and ineffective torture measures to get Peter to break. You'd almost think they could've made the point Ben didn't really mean it and was mostly lashing out in his own way, sort of doing a hyperlaborious sibling tantrum due to how bad his mind got tampered with but that come to the end of it, he didn't want to harm Peter or the people in his periphery. Hell, even the big "King of Limbo" thing is mostly forced on him by Janine as opposed to it being out of his own devices, because if we want to open another can of worms "agency" has been lacking a whole ton for Ben as far as his takeback-of-what's-his' is concerned and its ineffective methods paired with.

I hate to sound like a soundboard, but there isn't really a whole lot else to it than perhaps the daddy of all idiot plots. This story could have only played this way and concluded as thus if no one actually behaved in character or wanting to solve the problems they were even faced with to begin with.

It's also a good thing we've spent those 19+ issues in Beyond but every last thing that could also impact this outcome has been summarily swept under the rug - if you had any interest in Beyond getting come-uppance (let alone Maxine), or the whole superhero division with the Slingers or just what would even Marcus be up to, with no signs in the slightest these will be even approached to begin with. It does seem like Wells wanted to conclude his Madelyne story first and foremost, and Ben was just the handiest device to be able to pull it off in the gig he did land.

Looks like everyone is getting the idiot ball at the same time (all the time)just to get from point to point

[Vworp Vworp]

I mean this as no slight against Ben Reilly fans. I'm just going to echo what I previously posted; if there was no real long term plans for Ben Reilly, then Nick Lowe never should've given Slott the greenlight to resurrect him and make him be the villain of Clone Conspiracy in the first place. Everything that has happened with the character since has just been one "course correction" after another because its clear they have no idea what to do with the character. Lowe's closing statement in the final issue of Beyond made that crystal clear.

Trust me. As someone who only got into Spider-Man books because of Ben and who still considers that Ben my Spidey, there is nothing in your statement that I would consider a slight. You are 100% correct in everything you said. Before Clone Conspiracy, my memories of Ben were of a character who went out like a hero, dying to save his Brother, so that Peter could go on and live a wonderful life as a husband and a father.

Since then, Marvel have succeeded in making every aspect of Ben's sacrifice utterly pointless. Both for himself and for Peter and MJ.

[JustLuke]

I really want to know how well this event sold.

[Lukmendes]

Nick: "Piracy is bad, dating thieves is good"

Quesada: "Divorce is bad, making deals with the devil is good".

This is a positively braindead little tale.

If Madelyne still has a soft spot for Ben -to go as far as suggesting he has a spacious untorture room held up lord knows how in her embassy- then there is absolutely no reason not to give him his missing memories back. Hell, there is even less reason for him not to conceive of the idea when she tells him Jean gave her her memories freely.

It's even sillier with how the story ends, with Jean right there hanging around at the Limbo embassy lol.

In theory we can say that Spidey wouldn't trust Madelyne to do this kind of thing, but, again, jean is right there...

Honestly the best way to excuse why no one is giving Spidey's memories to Ben is that Ben by being evil would be even more dangerous if he stayed evil and got the memories back on top of it, but that runs into the problem that Ben is evil because he lost the memories in the first place (As stupid as that is, he shouldn't need the idea of uncle Ben to be a hero when he was a hero for a few years anyways), that and it's not even suggested he could just have his memories back casually...

Like, even in Beyond the solution to get the memories back could be done if Ben was willing to be patient, since telepaths are dime a dozen at Marvel, but his lack of patience got in the way, so that was kinda understandable, but now? They're not doing it because they don't want to lol.

Looks like everyone is getting the idiot ball at the same time (all the time)just to get from point to point

Sounds like a crossover alright lol.

I really want to know how well this event sold.

Might've sold decently with how Spidey and X-Men are popular, but who knows...

[bob.schoonover]

I really want to know how well this event sold.

It was a really short event from the date of the first issue to the last - there's barely time at the store level to have reacted to soft sales of the opening issue (if there were soft sales) thru to the conclusion, so we really couldn't see anything much in the sales data (such as it is).

As a purely practical matter of timelines for stories, art, production, the earliest we'd see a course correction based on retailer complaints about Dark Web would be around issue 27 when the flashback arc (or whatever we want to call it) is finished

[Mercwmouth12]

It was a really short event from the date of the first issue to the last - there's barely time at the store level to have reacted to soft sales of the opening issue (if there were soft sales) thru to the conclusion, so we really couldn't see anything much in the sales data (such as it is).

As a purely practical matter of timelines for stories, art, production, the earliest we'd see a course correction based on retailer complaints about Dark Web would be around issue 27 when the flashback arc (or whatever we want to call it) is finished

I mean they could have their own internal data from individual sales and a rumored piece of info was that dark web was selling like 25% below expectations