ASM # 25/26 teaser- even MORE bad news for Peter coming?

[The BaRoN]

"This whole thing...fucking sucks!"
Gabriel Cash, Tango and Cash (1989)

Great movie.

However, let’s be honest who actually cares anymore what happened with Peter.

The whole run reads like someone stuck in 2008 marvel, someone who thought they were being clever with a mystery box idea then as time went and on they realised the idea SUCKED and now 25 issues later, we’ll just hype it up and kill someone unimportant.

Lowe and wells are a cancer on this book. Thank f@&£ I don’t but it anymore.

[Crazyspideyfan]

I just really want to know what was set up this whole time, maybe there will be a huge payoff that we never expected or saw coming

[Alex_Of_X]

Curious that they list Kaare Andrews on the credits.

It could just be a back-up story or something.

Kaare Andrews, famous of course for drafting Spider-Man: Reign.

From that, we extrapolate that the mystery figure at the end of Beyond is that story's Peter Parker. After warning MJ of where the sharing of fluids with Spider-Man will lead her, he evaporates into radioactive sludge, leaving our heroes disgusted, distraught and forever altered.

Sex, no more.

JK but phew, that homage to Gwen's death! Drama sure is brewing

[Alex_Of_X]

Real ones (Dan Gvozden from the Amazing Spider-Talk) note how the first cover with MJ's face is a homage to Spider-Man: Blue! My, oh, my

Spider-Man-Blue.jpg

[vhm74]

Here we go, a new low incoming
sad_stan.jpg

[Mister Mets]

Real ones (Dan Gvozden from the Amazing Spider-Talk) note how the first cover with MJ's face is a homage to Spider-Man: Blue! My, oh, my

Spider-Man-Blue.jpg

You think the covers are meant to evoke Spider-Man: Blue and Amazing Spider-Man #121?

I'm not sure the visuals are that unique.

[exile001]

Kaare Andrews, famous of course for drafting Spider-Man: Reign.

From that, we extrapolate that the mystery figure at the end of Beyond is that story's Peter Parker. After warning MJ of where the sharing of fluids with Spider-Man will lead her, he evaporates into radioactive sludge, leaving our heroes disgusted, distraught and forever altered.

Sex, no more.

Ha, I love Reign! That thing is hilarious.

it is the most bat-shit insane parody of The Dark Knight Returns I've ever seen.

[rward777]

Ha, I love Reign! That thing is hilarious.

it is the most bat-shit insane parody of The Dark Knight Returns I've ever seen.

Wouldn't be better if issues 21-26 were instead issues 1-6?

[NC_Yankee]

Wouldn't be better if issues 21-26 were instead issues 1-6?

Everything that comes from Marvel concerning Spider-Man has to be taken with skepticism. Why? Think about what Nick Lowe said about Beyond, and in the end instead of Ben doing better then Peter, Ben was turned into a villain. Which is why until the “What did Peter do wrong?” issues actually come out it is not worth getting angry about ( especially because Wells has given enough garbage to be angry about already without anticipating something even worse). My prediction for whatever it is worth, is this is nothing but a Marvel Fake-out and Peter did NOTHING wrong and Paul is Mysterio.

[Daibhidh]

Presumably they intend Peter to be still sympathetic to the reader. (Emphasis on 'intend'.) Also at some point Peter has to reconcile with the rest of the hero community. (Although, you know, it would be reasonably good storytelling if Peter having fallen out with the rest of the superhero community actually made a difference at some point in the run beyond Wolverine casting aspersions.)
So what they're aiming for is probably, ok, it's a mistake and it's understandable that everyone is holding it against Peter but actually it's a bit unfair of them to do so (apart from Mary Jane who is being extremely unfair because we're making her out to be unpleasant).
Whether they are going to hit that target is um... looking at their form in managing the story so far... well, pigs have been transported by air in the past.

[Alex_Of_X]

You think the covers are meant to evoke Spider-Man: Blue and Amazing Spider-Man #121?

I'm not sure the visuals are that unique.

I think so! Structurally they are identical--Spidey swinging while the face of Gwen\MJ occupies the background (and, presumably, his thoughts) and Spidey looking in distress at the faces of the people closest to him. It makes sense to homage both--they are both Gwen stories, of the time when she's the *It* girl. Also, it gives cohesion to the marketing-speak of "most shocking story in 50 years," that being 1973 and Gwen dying.

[Marvel Wars]

I just don't care anymore...
I don't trust Marvel, I'm tired of being taken for a fool.

[NC_Yankee]

I just don't care anymore...
I don't trust Marvel, I'm tired of being taken for a fool.

Exactly my feeling. IF this is the most shocking Spider-Man story since ASM 121 ( Death of Gwen Stacy), why not wait until the issue comes out? Classics that shock people like ASM 121 or the movie Psycho ( Janet Leigh being stabbed in the shower) are ground breaking and special. Why? Because the audience was not expecting what happened to actually happen. There are two and only two possibilities. 1: The Marvel hype is BS ( like Beyond). 2: The story is actually shocking but by hyping it 3 months earlier Marvel lessens it’s impact on the readers.

[TinkerSpider]

Yeah, I’m out, too (the entire board breathes a sigh of relief and runs to nail the door shut LOL)

This is a grab for outrage in the hopes they get money from onlookers who preorder this thinking it will rise in value like ASL 121-122 someday. There is nothing original or creative, this is purely playing off nostalgia, fear (MJ fans will buy it to see if something happens to their girl) and shipper wars (the fans of other love interests are already celebrating the idea of MJ being taken off the board so their preferred girl object can decorate Peter’s arm).

But Wells isn’t trying to say something new. The only emotion Wells and Lowe want out of the reader is anger (or to make MJ haters happy) and provoke readers as buyers. They demonstrably could not care less about the reading experience and generating emotion because we identify with the characters.

The care, empathy and identification the reader has for MJ and other characters at this point is only because we read better, more involving stories in the past.

Wells has done zero to make the reader care about Mary Jane. She is just a zombie object, dead-eyed and expressionless except when she’s given flashes of anger solely to make Peter feel bad about himself. We don’t know Paul’s last name. We don’t know the boy’s name. The girl’s name has been mentioned only once. We have no idea if MJ is deliriously happy and head over heels in love with Paul or if she settled and is making the best of a bad situation. We didn’t even know MJ and Paul were supposed to be married - neither of them have been depicted wearing a wedding ring - until we find out in a recap page, demontrasting just how little Wells and Lowe care if we engage with the characters. Knowing MJ is married puts Peter’s stalking - now that it’s been confirmed on page he is indeed a stalker - into a whole new light that would have been helpful context to have earlier, but Lowe and Wells Just. Didn’t. Care. And that is a very fair thing to day because *gestures at the recaps that tell us about character turning points instead of showing us, including Peter’s relationship “heating up” with Felicia when Felicia was absent from the story for eight issues).

And now we’re supposed to gasp and clutch our throats because the story is “heartbreaking” and the iconography is deliberating evoking the death of Gwen Stacy and it’s tied to the 50th anniversary of her death?! When MJ disappeared from the book from ASM 9 to ASM 19 and is only used as something to make Peter, in the words of Felicia, “spiral?” She’s not a character. We don’t even know if she’s working or has decided to be a full time mom, because turning one of Marvel’s few career-minded Silver Age female characters - MJ announced in her first full appearance she was an actress, she was taking drama lessons and invited Peter to see her perform, we saw her study and work toward her goal - and turning her into a sexist stereotyped housewife mommy is par for the Wells course when it comes to writing women. (Being a full time mother is terrific if that is the person’s choice and they have the resources to do so. But MJ never sought to have kids, she ran from helping Gayle with hers, she told Peter on multiple occasions both before and after the accidental pregnancy with May that she wasn’t ready to have kids. Being a full time mother has never been depicted as MJ’s ideal life; even in RYV and Spider-Girl MJ worked outside the home.)

I have two middle fingers, and they are extended in the direction of 1290 Avenue of the Americas, NYC.

I think someone pointed this out earlier, but it is so incredibly cynical and nihilistic to celebrate the death of Gwen Stacy in the first place - it’s an important story and one I will argue goes beyond a simple fridging, but maybe celebrate Gwen’s life instead? - and then to celebrate it by threatening to fridge another love interest, even if the iconography is a misdirection. Cynical and sexist and speaks to all the worst tendencies in modern comics and especially in Wells’s comic book bibliography to date.

Name one original story Wells has done in his first year, 20 or so issue run to date. One.

Tombstone was a graphic remix of Conway stories.

Vulture, with an angry Vulture dropping a Peter without webshooters from up high, is a remix of JMD’s Funeral Arrangements

The Hellfire Gala tie-in was a pale, tepid remix of Spidey & Wolverine team ups, with an explicit callback to Spider-Man vs. Wolverine that wasn’t followed up on, just a callback to nostalgia bait.

Judgement Day was more flanderizing of St. Gwen.

Hobgoblin was a thin attempt to remix Stern.

Dark Web took all the silly excesses of Inferno and turned them into a wet clown gassy emission.

Now he’s apparently remixing the Death of Gwen Stacy (and probably OMIT as well, I smell MJ being “angry” - or at least as angry as that cardboard cutout who bears no resemblance to the actual Mary Jane Watson if one removes her physical appearance can muster - that Peter takes away her agency, which is hi-larious considering Wells has refused to give any female character except maybe Maddie any agency - and that was also forced, as all of a sudden Maddie realizes, “Wait! I have powers after all! Too bad I could have stopped this pointless fight wasting valuable pages at the start, but better late than never I suppose”).

I guess one could argue Chasm is a new concept, but we’ve seen evil Ben before. Maybe Queen Goblin, although that’s just spitting on a JMD character. Spencer took away Norman’s sins, and we’ve seen Peter be a corporate stooge far too many times before, this is just a thin rehash of Horizon Labs with a dash of Parker Industries after the latest development in Gold Goblin.

I never want to read another Slott run on ASM ever again, but I will give him credit for at least coming up with original ideas and not just tired, pale Xeroxes of better stories written by far more talented writers.

The reason why we connected with the earlier stories is because we were engaged with the characters, we felt for them, the characters acted and spoke like real people with real emotions and believable motivations that generated reader empathy. I’ve long said Wells is keeping the reader at arm’s length and therefore unable to engage with the characters because he is prioritizing his precious mystery boxes over the reader’s experience and the reader’s ability to engage - and it looks like the reveal of the mystery will be just another remix, this time of the Death of Gwen Stacy. It’s just…tedium.

I don’t think they will kill MJ off the same way they killed Gwen, she’s too valuable as an image that sells and supposedly MJ and Black Cat is to become an ongoing or at least have another arc, unless that is just marketing to throw readers off the scent and make them believe MJ is safe, who knows, I don’t trust anything that comes out of Marvel’s mouth. Burn me once, shame on you. Burn me five times, well, that wasn’t very nice of you to take advantage of my willingness to extend you good will. Burn me ten times and the shame is on me.

People online are speculating MJ already died and Peter brought her back to life and that’s the horrible thing he did, only he brought her back with Paul and the kids (maybe an OMIT situation where MJ pulls them in to the “spell” or whatever it is with her, because gods forbid Zeb Wells has a single original thought on this run). People are also speculating that Norman is the one to die, sacrificing himself to save MJ in the present day in a reverse of the Death of Gwen Stacy, which I suppose would be an (overly) neat bow on the package - and I still believe Norman should have stayed dead - but again points to Well’s lack of creativity and the ability to only riff on the stories of his betters, which when you look at his career on Robot Chicken and Super Mansions: tracks perfectly.

So I’m out, because there’s cynical and then there is blatant, derisive contempt for the reader. And no one needs to be disrespected as a reader in this manner. The world is full of great comics and manga. DC is on fire right now IMO and there are pockets of the Marvel Universe, like Ryan North on FF, who is writing the anti-ASM, leaning into the characters’ love for each other, and it is so satisfying and fun to read, or Zdarsky on Daredevil, that are worth exploring and feature far more satisfying and heroic depictions of Peter than he gets in his own half-cooked spaghetti thrown at the wall to see if will stick writing exercise cash grab of a book.

[jebsib]

Betcha somehow Peter brought Gwen back from the dead.
The glowing guy at the end of vol. 5, Sin-less Norman and Peter did something.

It horrified and alienated MJ and must have gone horribly wrong.

This is why Gwen's ghost keeps reappearing (yeah I know, Celestials), it has something to do with guilty Norman and it ties in with Gwen's 50th anniversary.