When do you expect One More Day will be undone?

[Daibhidh]

It was very clear that as of Last Remains the story was simply that Harry Osborn was Kindred.
- Harry's statement to Peter "YOU CAUSED THIS" with a flashback to the toast from OMD, and his constant grievances about Peter's big sin that made him Kindred.
- We had the pages from ASM #545 at the end of OMD was the dream sequence that Harry showed Peter.
- We had Hell Demons in #545.LR who represented the main players in OMD.
- We even had a hell demon MJ repeating her words from OMD.... "The answer is YES!" over and over.... which is a reference to her making the deal with Mephisto.

Add in that Kindred's monologues in the first half of the run just make more sense coming from Harry. (For example, he's angry at what he calls Peter dragging Felicia back into his life, he talks about waiting for MJ so they can be together when she dies; neither of which fit the Stacy twins as previously established.)

[Alex_Of_X]

Continuing on from my first post, we can break it down chronologically.

Monthly averages
Mackie run: 59,704
Across All Spider-series: ?
Issue Cost: 1.99$

JMS run: Between 95,145 and 96,686
Across All Spider-series: 201,255
Issue Cost: 2.25$-2.50$

BND run: (~66,586x3)=199,758
Across All Spider-series: 199,758
Issue Cost: 2.99$

Slott's first run~57000x2)=114,390
Across All Spider-series: ?
Issue Cost: 2.99$

Superior Spider-Man: 83,159x2=~166300
Across All Spider-series: ?
Issue Cost: 3.99$

ASM Vol. 3: 94,359x2=~188700
Across All Spider-series: ?
Issue Cost: 3.99$

Slott's Post Secret Wars run: 69,671x2=~139300
Across All Spider-series: ?
Issue Cost: 3.99$

Spencer's run before COVID: 73,595x2=147100
Across All Spider-series: ?
Issue Cost: 3.99$

I've taken the liberty to apply pricing to the issues, because hey, it matters. Let's look over our findings.

1) Mackie's run was truly the sales doldrums. JMS was a godsend.
2) BND kept the sales steady despite the OMD backlash. And seemingly BND increased the revenue due to the price increase.
3) When looking at sales data for Slott's solo run and beyond, we must remember not to compare then directly to BND on a month to month scale. Slott's run had one issue fewer a month, which was supplanted by side-books (Avenging Spider-Man, for example). Same holds true for Spencer and Wells.
4) Slott's first run undersold BND by around 10000 copies. Every subsequent run of Slott's will eclipse BND on and issue-by-issue basis.
5) Superior was no only a hit in numbers sold, but it also bumped up the price and still sold like hot cakes
6) We don't know anything about production cost or how they offset the revenue.
7) Huge 4.99$-9.99$ are not considered in the numbers\pricing, but they're obviously huge earners

[Spider-Tiger]

The thing about accounting for price hikes into the equation is that you'd have to adjust the increased price for inflation. Comic prices might be increasing, but the cost of producing a comic might also be increasing which decreases revenue. We don't really have access to that kind of data to make that determination.

I think if you were to plot the sales data on a line graph, you'd probably see there was an increase post Mackie that peaked in the status quo prior to BND. Fell a bit with BND and then downtrended. It then uptrended after Slott took over through Superior and peaked at the beginning of Vol. 3 only to downtrend again through Vol. 4. But that's a lot of work and I'm not doing that lol.

[exile001]

Continuing on from my first post, we can break it down chronologically...

The problem with this is the data is incredibly narrow and kinda out of context.

Digital sales (unknown), Marvel Unlimited, Marvel releasing everything as TPBs (waiting), regional reprints, closing of comic shops (and the high street in general), even the decade+ of economic downturn are all factors. It makes these numbers pretty much useless.

[Spider-Tiger]

The problem with this is the data is incredibly narrow and kinda out of context.

Digital sales (unknown), Marvel Unlimited, Marvel releasing everything as TPBs (waiting), regional reprints, closing of comic shops (and the high street in general), even the decade+ of economic downturn are all factors. It makes these numbers pretty much useless.

I think the only way to control for these external factors is to compare to long term trends in other historically top selling titles. Again too much work and I'm not doing it. But if someone or OP wants to, be my guest

[Alex_Of_X]

Tiger and Exile, you're both correct in that until the Big Two are forthcoming with all their date (ie never), we'll never truly grasp the full context of what's successful and what's not.

Still, when I look at the latest 20-25 years of Spidey numerically, I see a fairly healthy, thriving franchise. The tales of its demise have been greatly exaggerated.

[Mercwmouth12]

Tiger and Exile, you're both correct in that until the Big Two are forthcoming with all their date (ie never), we'll never truly grasp the full context of what's successful and what's not.

Still, when I look at the latest 20-25 years of Spidey numerically, I see a fairly healthy, thriving franchise. The tales of its demise have been greatly exaggerated.

That's.. that's not what we're saying. We're saying that currently the current run isn't doing anywhere near it should be and hasn't loved up or made as much as the book did in the last run

[Vortex85]

I’ve looked at the numbers before and I’ll just say this - removing the marriage did nothing to increase sales on the book. I don’t think it attracted new readers. What does attract new readers is a volume relaunch, killing/replacing the character (Superior) then bringing him back (vol 3) etc. Making Spider-Man single had no long term benefit and not even really a short term one either.

I think it was more for the writers than the fans because writers put a self imposed expectation that the need to shake up the status quo or turn Spider-Man’s world upside down…. And while that can still be done with a married Spider-Man in most ways, there is one way it can’t - changing his romantic partner. So at the end of the day, it was a “gift” Marvel gave the writers, not the fans/consumers.

[Spider-Tiger]

That's.. that's not what we're saying. We're saying that currently the current run isn't doing anywhere near it should be and hasn't loved up or made as much as the book did in the last run

Technically we don't know how the current run is performing sales wise. The last time there was access to those figures was 3 years ago. So how the book is currently performing is just speculation.

[Spider-Tiger]

I’ve looked at the numbers before and I’ll just say this - removing the marriage did nothing to increase sales on the book. I don’t think it attracted new readers. What does attract new readers is a volume relaunch, killing/replacing the character (Superior) then bringing him back (vol 3) etc. Making Spider-Man single had no long term benefit and not even really a short term one either.

Assuming that these trends remain true even if you control for external factors (and that's a big assumption) I think one of the big takeaways here is that you need a great "hook" every so often to attract readers and solid writing to keep them coming back for more.

Love or hate Superior, "Hero is killed and replaced by villain" is a smart hook from a marketing perspective. And there are at least 3 "milestone" issues within that concept that are sure to sell very well: the hero's death, the villain's takeover, and the hero's return. It's truly the type of big bold stuff that Stan "mock wedding at Shea Stadium" Lee might cook up. (And if you notice, there was also a sales uptick around a hook like "Hero is unmasked to the world.")

"What did Peter do 6 months ago to piss off the world?" seems far less likely to be a hook that attracts people, and the current online community just seems turned off by the writing and direction in general. Whether that translates to sales is unknown at this point, but it's reminiscent of the "MJ dies" "Peter is a clone", and "Peter is unmarried again" eras. Not enough to get non-readers to care about the "controversy", but enough to turn off some readers.

[Mercwmouth12]

Assuming that these trends remain true even if you control for external factors (and that's a big assumption) I think one of the big takeaways here is that you need a great "hook" every so often to attract readers and solid writing to keep them coming back for more.

Love or hate Superior, "Hero is killed and replaced by villain" is a smart hook from a marketing perspective. And there are at least 3 "milestone" issues within that concept that are sure to sell very well: the hero's death, the villain's takeover, and the hero's return. It's truly the type of big bold stuff that Stan "mock wedding at Shea Stadium" Lee might cook up. (And if you notice, there was also a sales uptick around a hook like "Hero is unmasked to the world.")

"What did Peter do 6 months ago to piss off the world?" seems far less likely to be a hook that attracts people, and the current online community just seems turned off by the writing and direction in general. Whether that translates to sales is unknown at this point, but it's reminiscent of the "MJ dies" "Peter is a clone", and "Peter is unmarried again" eras. Not enough to get non-readers to care about the "controversy", but enough to turn off some readers.

Plus after the reveal there's nothing left to keep people interested in the run any further. Unless it's something like hey after all this we're teasing them getting back together to keep some fans or just do a black cat romance. That's not enough to keep people interested. I've seen a few people okay with the idea of them together for now, but with the current setup and how it looks to be played out it seems more to be in the end will hurt Felicia's character than anything. Not only does it move away from how she was done in a wonderful craft from Jed. Unless you remove her being a thief entirely it wont work. This isn't Batman and Catwoman. It's a different dynamic entirely. If they're gonna do an Archie dynamic I can see some people respond to that, but the next half of this doesn't look like it will be keeping many people engaged or cared to keep buying unless there's a setup for a nice payoff down the line

[IamnotJudasTraveller]

I mean, all the AI is saying is "It's not impossible, maybe it can happen" lol.

Yeah, but it's definitely funny to hear it put in those dry, "objective" terms. For what's worth in the same convo I asked it about how it would undo OMD and then things got wild.


If you're basically not only making a deal with the devil, but you're DOUBLE-dealing it, you might as well get a double wife in the proccess. Now I wonder if I either endorse ChatGPT for Spider-office, or urge anyone not to take devil-dealing advice from AI, or both.

[Daibhidh]

I haven't signed up with ChatGPT but I do find myself wondering what you'd get if you asked it to write a script for a story in which Ben Reilly turns evil and teams up with Madeleine Pryor to unleash a horde of demons from Limbo on Manhattan.

[Obeythemoderators]

Honestly I take Mackie over the mid-00's any day.

[CaptainUniverse]

I haven't signed up with ChatGPT but I do find myself wondering what you'd get if you asked it to write a script for a story in which Ben Reilly turns evil and teams up with Madeleine Pryor to unleash a horde of demons from Limbo on Manhattan.

Come on, like that would ever happen...



...Oh, wait...