Batman & Robin by Joshua Williamson and Simone Di Meo

[Morgoth]

Isn't fourteen years old high school age?

[Fergus]

Ugh, high school. What do you mean back to high school.

Show me his middle school graduation. What was so wrong with West-Reeve Academy?

I'm starting to like Williamson less and less cuz I don't even want to call it revisionist history, but he's straight up fabricating text that literally did not exist. Like when did Alfred ever act as this so-called "buffer" for Bruce and Damian? I don't know what books Josh read, but nothing like that was in B&R by Tomasi and Gleason.

I've personally compared this era of Damian wearing the gray costume to when Tim started wearing his black and red costume and I think I'm starting to feel how some Tim fans must have felt at that time about how their favorite character is going through some radical and unnecessary changes.

EDIT: Like seriously, I used to be one of Williamson's biggest defenders when he was announced to be writing Robin, saying "C'mon guys, give him a chance!" But now every word out of his mouth just makes me want to turn into the Joker and become one of those anti-Williamson fans. They might be onto something.

People were complaining when Williamson was put on Robin? Why? At the point readers only experience with the guy writing Damian was Batman/Superman where he did a great job.

Alfred has been a buffer between Bruce and Damian in lots of titles and stories. Tomasi's Batman and Robin is just a fraction of Damian's library this isn't Dixon on Robin where one can argue that it defined the character or is the bulk of his characterisation to date.

Alfred was often shady and a very good argument can be made that he doesn't give a **** about any of the bats aside from Master bruce but DC has always pretended otherwise. Treating him like some sacred cow.

Revisionist history and double standards is per for the course when it comes to Bruce and Alfred.

Blaming Damian for Bruce's bad call in City of Bane
Demonising Damian for having an illegal secret jail when he's simply following Batman's MO. Bruce has 2 illegal secret jails.
Alfred sending Damian away when Bruce lost his memory during Snyder's run
Alfred getting one of the WAR kids killed
Alfred encouraging a reluctant Bruce to replace Jason with inexperienced teen Tim
the list goes on.

This has been happening longer than Williamson was at DC and it's not like Tomasi never engaged in a bit of revisionism when it comes to Damian, tomasi ignored Damian's love of animals having him needlessly kill a bat, eat meat and having Jon chastise Damian for his unwillingness to stop and rescue a cat.
Tomasi also ignored Colin and Damian's experiences with him to make his friendship with Jon seem like the first time the character has ever experienced that kind of social dynamic.

Damian is older than he was in Super Sons so he's now in High school. Maybe if we get another SuperSons series we might see him graduate Middle School but Batman and Robin is set in the present. Jon's already in college and Damian graduated.

By Back to High School i suppose Williamson means that even though Damian had already completed high school before arriving in Gotham, he's being made to go back like how in Tomasi's Super Sins Bruce made Damian go back to middle school because he needed social interactions with people his own age.

[Fergus]

I can't wait for this series. Every reveal just gets better.

I trust Williamson when it comes to Damian. Robin 2021 was a lot of fun.

I get the love for Tomasi and Gleason however I feel that fans tend to hold every other piece of work with Damian up to their run's forgetting That B&R by Tomasi was a very specific type of work. Exploring a very specific aspect of the character.

Similar to how those fans who claim that Bruce and Damian don't work as Batman and Robin always cite it as an example when the book had nothing to do with their dynamic as a duo on the field. It was about about an estranged son getting to know a father who was not just a stranger but a disapproving one at that.

The fact that they clashed as they worked out their existing baggage, got to know and understand each other was seen as evidence that they couldn't work in the field together.

Honestly Tomasi's book should never have been called Batman and Robin.

My point is that a lot of decent work is dismissed simply because they don't hit like Tomasi's or aren't going for the same tone as Tomasi's.

I don't have an issue with Williamson's handling of Damian so far and I don't get the double standards when he gets called out for things that readers accept with other writers

[Astralabius]

Williamson's Damian feels too generic.

[Astralabius]

And ideas like Respawn simply deserve to be ignored and forgotten.

[Fergus]

And ideas like Respawn simply deserve to be ignored and forgotten.

It's an unpopular opinion but I didn't mind Respawn. I was curious to see where Williamson was going with the concept but the whole thing in the end was wasted.

[Frontier]

Ugh, high school. What do you mean back to high school.

Show me his middle school graduation. What was so wrong with West-Reeve Academy?

I'm starting to like Williamson less and less cuz I don't even want to call it revisionist history, but he's straight up fabricating text that literally did not exist. Like when did Alfred ever act as this so-called "buffer" for Bruce and Damian? I don't know what books Josh read, but nothing like that was in B&R by Tomasi and Gleason.

I've personally compared this era of Damian wearing the gray costume to when Tim started wearing his black and red costume and I think I'm starting to feel how some Tim fans must have felt at that time about how their favorite character is going through some radical and unnecessary changes.

EDIT: Like seriously, I used to be one of Williamson's biggest defenders when he was announced to be writing Robin, saying "C'mon guys, give him a chance!" But now every word out of his mouth just makes me want to turn into the Joker and become one of those anti-Williamson fans. They might be onto something.

Was Gotham Academy middle or high school?

I liked Tim in black and red, for the record.

[skyvolt2000]

Ugh, high school. What do you mean back to high school.

Show me his middle school graduation. What was so wrong with West-Reeve Academy?

Nobody graduates from middle school.

Since when was Damian high school age?

Depending on the birthday and when he started school a kid can be 14 in the 9thy grade.

A kid can start school at age 3 depending on what school district they are in.

[Rac7d*]

Nobody graduates from middle school.



Depending on the birthday and when he started school a kid can be 14 in the 9thy grade.

A kid can start school at age 3 depending on what school district they are in.

He was in high school in Monkey Prince comics

[Vordan]

Since when was Damian high school age?

They’re aging Damian up, soon he’s going to be around the same age as Jon (who I don’t expect to age any further).

[garazza]

People were complaining when Williamson was put on Robin? Why? At the point readers only experience with the guy writing Damian was Batman/Superman where he did a great job.

Alfred has been a buffer between Bruce and Damian in lots of titles and stories. Tomasi's Batman and Robin is just a fraction of Damian's library this isn't Dixon on Robin where one can argue that it defined the character or is the bulk of his characterisation to date.

Alfred was often shady and a very good argument can be made that he doesn't give a **** about any of the bats aside from Master bruce but DC has always pretended otherwise. Treating him like some sacred cow.

Revisionist history and double standards is per for the course when it comes to Bruce and Alfred.

Blaming Damian for Bruce's bad call in City of Bane
Demonising Damian for having an illegal secret jail when he's simply following Batman's MO. Bruce has 2 illegal secret jails.
Alfred sending Damian away when Bruce lost his memory during Snyder's run
Alfred getting one of the WAR kids killed
Alfred encouraging a reluctant Bruce to replace Jason with inexperienced teen Tim
the list goes on.

This has been happening longer than Williamson was at DC and it's not like Tomasi never engaged in a bit of revisionism when it comes to Damian, tomasi ignored Damian's love of animals having him needlessly kill a bat, eat meat and having Jon chastise Damian for his unwillingness to stop and rescue a cat.
Tomasi also ignored Colin and Damian's experiences with him to make his friendship with Jon seem like the first time the character has ever experienced that kind of social dynamic.

Damian is older than he was in Super Sons so he's now in High school. Maybe if we get another SuperSons series we might see him graduate Middle School but Batman and Robin is set in the present. Jon's already in college and Damian graduated.

By Back to High School i suppose Williamson means that even though Damian had already completed high school before arriving in Gotham, he's being made to go back like how in Tomasi's Super Sins Bruce made Damian go back to middle school because he needed social interactions with people his own age.

I can't wait for this series. Every reveal just gets better.

I trust Williamson when it comes to Damian. Robin 2021 was a lot of fun.

I get the love for Tomasi and Gleason however I feel that fans tend to hold every other piece of work with Damian up to their run's forgetting That B&R by Tomasi was a very specific type of work. Exploring a very specific aspect of the character.

Similar to how those fans who claim that Bruce and Damian don't work as Batman and Robin always cite it as an example when the book had nothing to do with their dynamic as a duo on the field. It was about about an estranged son getting to know a father who was not just a stranger but a disapproving one at that.

The fact that they clashed as they worked out their existing baggage, got to know and understand each other was seen as evidence that they couldn't work in the field together.

Honestly Tomasi's book should never have been called Batman and Robin.

My point is that a lot of decent work is dismissed simply because they don't hit like Tomasi's or aren't going for the same tone as Tomasi's.

I don't have an issue with Williamson's handling of Damian so far and I don't get the double standards when he gets called out for things that readers accept with other writers

There is a lot I disagree with you here, and while I'm usually the guy who argues and goes over line by line people's posts, I'm not gonna do it here. We're not on the same page and probably won't be and that's fine.

[Frontier]

They’re aging Damian up, soon he’s going to be around the same age as Jon (who I don’t expect to age any further).

And to think he was just 13 in Rebirth...

[garazza]

Was Gotham Academy middle or high school?

I liked Tim in black and red, for the record.

I never read Gotham Academy so I can't speak to the years of school it covers.

I like black and red Tim too. But I often try to imagine what it was like to read these comics as they were coming out instead of the complete wholes I read them as. I don't think how I feel about comics today is all that unique in comparison to how readers might have felt when what we refer to as comic history was the active status quo.

[garazza]

Nobody graduates from middle school.

In the US, they do. I graduated from middle school.

Depending on the birthday and when he started school a kid can be 14 in the 9thy grade.

A kid can start school at age 3 depending on what school district they are in.

A kid can be 14 and could either be in 8th grade in middle school or 9th grade in high school and still be the same age.

[garazza]

He was in high school in Monkey Prince comics

He was undercover and the book was set during Rebirth.

They’re aging Damian up, soon he’s going to be around the same age as Jon (who I don’t expect to age any further).

You know me, them's fightin' words right there.