Wrestling WWE

[SUPERECWFAN1]

Speaking of weird shoot interviews , Greg "The Hammer" Valentine did one years ago and discussed his quitting WCW back in the early 1990's.


- Valentine brings up that WCW had a lot of young folks he liked working with then. That they had Marcus Bagwell who was a nice young kid learning as well as Brian Pillman before the injury screwed him up (his ankle which was fused) . They also had Big Josh then too and those guys were good to work with.


- Bill Watts came in and told him all kinds of BS stuff and he was like ok. So at a Saturday Night's main event deal when they did that , he was told he was gonna lose to Sting at the end. That he was gonna put Sting over. Which he decided to walk out on.


- Valentine then discusses how , well what do I get in exchange to keep my heel heat ? Do I get to beat up Sting post match or do I get to beat up a Sting friend ? Or do I get a contract for $100,000+ a year ? I mean if I'm doing a favor for someone , do me a favor in exchange. Watts and company would just say , well we want you to put him over and nothing in exchange.


Now I like Valentine in the WWF in the 1980's and he was a classic heel , but by the end of his run in WWF he wasn't no where near a main event caliber guy. He also was in a jobber tag team by this end period. Yet he's mad because they asked him to put over Sting after this in WCW.

[steve2275]

[BigLbo]

He got a push as part of a group sure... but he didn't get a single push. If anything initially Seth and Roman were the tag team while Dean was the singles guy. But Roman stood out.

not sure if you've got a selective or just bad memory but it was pretty obvious roman was THE guy in the shield, his standing out was definitely by design. **** he was forced into the group for that role, and once the shield broke up he was in title contention a few weeks later.

And yes... Roman isn't the top merchandise seller. He's just the top seller of the full timers. I don't think any full timer on the roster is going to outsell Cena in terms of merch, because Cena is one of the few people who has transcended the wrestling business. And he's also been on top longer than anyone in the modern era in the WWE. If the biggest knock against Roman as the top guy is that he can't outsell Cena in merch, then he's in pretty good shape.

he's neck and neck with AJ who isn't even on RAW and gets kicked in the balls every week on smackdown. considering it's been a 4year main event push for roman he should be closer to cena than he is.

Some people are gettin' really salty on Twitter if you bring up that scalpers probably bought a lot of the All In tickets. Also seems like the press conference was a bit of a mess. One would think acting like ultra-defensive gate-keepers for "true pro-wrestling fans" would be a rather unwise tactic if you wanted to get eyes on this show that aren't jaded Bullet Club Davidians, but hey, I'm just a stupid mark who doesn't have a podcast, so... /shrug

you seem to clearly have a dog in this fight and might not be looking at things objectively.

roman was pushed far too early in his career to be "the guy". he had no character, his in-ring work was below average at best, and his promos were...........well, we know the memes.

he has gotten better in a lot of areas. it's just a shame there are a lot of other guys who are better than him that people want to see in in the main event.

also, another point about roman and why his push is failing: forced moments. moments where a crowd can connect with a wrestler on a very emotional level. not only has roman not had this moment but they keep trying to create this moments so the crowd can get behind him. his whole "anti-establishment" thing just doesn't fit with roman as opposed to guys like austin, punk, DB and dean. mostly because the company has been pushing him so damn hard, it's hard to believe that the company is against him, which i found so funny when he called brock "vince's boy".

damnit. now i really wanna do a vid on this topic.

roman is a good talent imo, but for whatever reason things are not going as well as they should for a guy who's gotten this kind of push for this long, for a guy who's been endorsed by cena, the rock, brianson. some people believe merch sales=connection to the crowd and the right to a never ending main event spot. i'm not one of those people, i think WWE is just being stubborn about it and should give somebody else a chance while roman can continue to sell merch and they can work on developing his character.

I'd agree Roman was pushed too early... I think the problem is they're probably making the same mistake with Braun as he's greener than Roman is (IMO at least).

I do however think calling Brock "Vinces" boy is legit given Brock shows up to work like 6 times a year for lord only knows how many millions of dollars a year. Any wrestler in the lockeroom has valid reason to call Brock out on that.

you and roman got this backwards. it's far more accurate to say vince is brocks bitch.

the Universal Title is so dead, someone started a GoFundMe for its family to cover funeral expenses

you mean the universal title is so "special". remember the less we see it the more special it becomes. it's so damn special at this point you almost forget it's even a thing.

I still don't know what people expected ROman to do? Turn the other cheek? Slap him with a white glove and challenge him to a duel?

Jinder attacked Roman last week, so Roman attacked Jinger this week. And Jinger will probably attack Roman next week. At least from wrestling logic, it makes sense.

maybe, or just attack him head on, face to face.

They've invested a lot into him. He gets to work with a lot of the top tier guys, Taker, Strowman, etc. Even though he's always getting his butt kicked, he's totally selling his gimmick. I think that helps hooks the crowd too. He believes his gimmick.

He's got a great look and seems to be decent in the ring so far. Worthy of getting behind and a push. Didn't blink an eyelash when he was on NXT but he's won me over here.

elias is proof you don't have to be a smaller former indy guy to gain favor with the fans, just be interesting and entertaining. i didn't see him much in NXT but he grew on me quickly once he got to RAW and became my favorite part of the show within weeks(though RAW was pretty shitty at the time).

Sami would probably be doing better if he wasn't attached to the Canadian albatross known as KO.

his association with kevin has done nothing but hold him back his entire career.

I hear that Lana is slowly rolling her accent back

which is fine, CJ actually has a very nice voice

si she changing her voice or accent??

never said that he was terrible in the ring. just not worth the money, unless he wants to improve.

as a mouth piece, he would do alright. just don't ask him to wrestle, especially in the x-division, because we all know what happens then.

he is terrible in the ring.

[Username taken]

not sure if you've got a selective or just bad memory but it was pretty obvious roman was THE guy in the shield, his standing out was definitely by design. **** he was forced into the group for that role, and once the shield broke up he was in title contention a few weeks later.



he's neck and neck with AJ who isn't even on RAW and gets kicked in the balls every week on smackdown. considering it's been a 4year main event push for roman he should be closer to cena than he is.



you seem to clearly have a dog in this fight and might not be looking at things objectively.



roman is a good talent imo, but for whatever reason things are not going as well as they should for a guy who's gotten this kind of push for this long, for a guy who's been endorsed by cena, the rock, brianson. some people believe merch sales=connection to the crowd and the right to a never ending main event spot. i'm not one of those people, i think WWE is just being stubborn about it and should give somebody else a chance while roman can continue to sell merch and they can work on developing his character.



you and roman got this backwards. it's far more accurate to say vince is brocks bitch.



you mean the universal title is so "special". remember the less we see it the more special it becomes. it's so damn special at this point you almost forget it's even a thing.



maybe, or just attack him head on, face to face.



elias is proof you don't have to be a smaller former indy guy to gain favor with the fans, just be interesting and entertaining. i didn't see him much in NXT but he grew on me quickly once he got to RAW and became my favorite part of the show within weeks(though RAW was pretty shitty at the time).



his association with kevin has done nothing but hold him back his entire career.



si she changing her voice or accent??



he is terrible in the ring.

I actually like Roman and I 100% agree with the bolded part. Beyond a certain point, WWE must simply re-consider the entire Roman thing. WWE should push people that have gotten over organically instead of tearing them down. Roman should be a superstar but not the main attraction until they can book him sensibly.

It's obvious that someone in WWE is taking into account the negative reaction that Roman gets from live audiences (which is a major part of the ridiculousness with him and Brock Lesnar). According to some reports, parts of the audience walked out on the Joe/Reigns match at Backlash, if that doesn't scream apathy then I don't know what does.

Regarding Roman and Jinder, he didn't have to brutalize Jinder, he could have just interfered in his match too or something. Stone Cold Steve Austin and a host of faces used to do it all he time.

[BigLbo]

I actually like Roman and I 100% agree with the bolded part. Beyond a certain point, WWE must simply re-consider the entire Roman thing. WWE should push people that have gotten over organically instead of tearing them down. Roman should be a superstar but not the main attraction until they can book him sensibly.

It's obvious that someone in WWE is taking into account the negative reaction that Roman gets from live audiences (which is a major part of the ridiculousness with him and Brock Lesnar). According to some reports, parts of the audience walked out on the Joe/Reigns match at Backlash, if that doesn't scream apathy then I don't know what does.

Regarding Roman and Jinder, he didn't have to brutalize Jinder, he could have just interfered in his match too or something. Stone Cold Steve Austin and a host of faces used to do it all he time.

BINGO, and that's not even to say give them roman's spot, but like you said DON'T tear them down.

also pete dunne beware, the torpedo moscow is coming

[XPac]

not sure if you've got a selective or just bad memory but it was pretty obvious roman was THE guy in the shield, his standing out was definitely by design. **** he was forced into the group for that role, and once the shield broke up he was in title contention a few weeks later.



he's neck and neck with AJ who isn't even on RAW and gets kicked in the balls every week on smackdown. considering it's been a 4year main event push for roman he should be closer to cena than he is.



you seem to clearly have a dog in this fight and might not be looking at things objectively.



roman is a good talent imo, but for whatever reason things are not going as well as they should for a guy who's gotten this kind of push for this long, for a guy who's been endorsed by cena, the rock, brianson. some people believe merch sales=connection to the crowd and the right to a never ending main event spot. i'm not one of those people, i think WWE is just being stubborn about it and should give somebody else a chance while roman can continue to sell merch and they can work on developing his character.



you and roman got this backwards. it's far more accurate to say vince is brocks bitch.



you mean the universal title is so "special". remember the less we see it the more special it becomes. it's so damn special at this point you almost forget it's even a thing.



maybe, or just attack him head on, face to face.



elias is proof you don't have to be a smaller former indy guy to gain favor with the fans, just be interesting and entertaining. i didn't see him much in NXT but he grew on me quickly once he got to RAW and became my favorite part of the show within weeks(though RAW was pretty shitty at the time).



his association with kevin has done nothing but hold him back his entire career.



si she changing her voice or accent??



he is terrible in the ring.

My recollection of the SHIELD was that Seth and Rollins were the tag guys, while Dean was the singles guy as Dean won singles gold while the other two won the tag straps. In most stable formulas the guy who wins the singles gold is the MAIN guy while the tag team in the group is support. But I think Roman stood out an shifted to the forefront.

As far as him attacking Jinder dead on face to face... he initially DID do that. He first tried calling Jinder out in the ring, then went to find him backstage. Which isnt' to say he didn't also cheap shot him by surprise to take him out of the match... but that's hardly uncommon even for faces in wrestling. Orton has made he "oughta nowhere" thing practically a gimmick. It's probably not something Cena would do... but not every wrestler, even the faces, are Cena.

As far as WWE giving someone else a chance... that's basically what they are doing with Braun Strauman. He's being built up for that top spot. Seth lately has been looking pretty good too...

[BigLbo]

My recollection of the SHIELD was that Seth and Rollins were the tag guys, while Dean was the singles guy as Dean won singles gold while the other two won the tag straps. In most stable formulas the guy who wins the singles gold is the MAIN guy while the tag team in the group is support. But I think Roman stood out an shifted to the forefront.

this wasn't most stable formulas, and your memory is failing you. roman was the most protected member(remember "make roman look strong!!"), usually got the big wins and moments(survivor series, royal rumble). the writing was on the wall and most people made the read back then.

As far as him attacking Jinder dead on face to face... he initially DID do that. He first tried calling Jinder out in the ring, then went to find him backstage. Which isnt' to say he didn't also cheap shot him by surprise to take him out of the match... but that's hardly uncommon even for faces in wrestling. Orton has made he "oughta nowhere" thing practically a gimmick. It's probably not something Cena would do... but not every wrestler, even the faces, are Cena.

i don't see the jinder thing as a big deal, i was just answering the question "what did people xpect him to do".

As far as WWE giving someone else a chance... that's basically what they are doing with Braun Strauman. He's being built up for that top spot. Seth lately has been looking pretty good too...

kind of, but roman beat braun clean too. and honestly strowman is another guy they forced, fortunately he happened to catch on. possibly even because people were just tired of roman. i think most people calling for the title to be put on strowman is not because everyone is a big fan but because the way he's been booked he almost needs the title, plus the crowds are into him and it's a choice of braun, roman, or brock.

[XPac]

this wasn't most stable formulas, and your memory is failing you. roman was the most protected member(remember "make roman look strong!!"), usually got the big wins and moments(survivor series, royal rumble). the writing was on the wall and most people made the read back then.



i don't see the jinder thing as a big deal, i was just answering the question "what did people xpect him to do".



kind of, but roman beat braun clean too. and honestly strowman is another guy they forced, fortunately he happened to catch on. possibly even because people were just tired of roman. i think most people calling for the title to be put on strowman is not because everyone is a big fan but because the way he's been booked he almost needs the title, plus the crowds are into him and it's a choice of braun, roman, or brock.

And he did in fact do exactly what you expected him to do ... called Jinder out, and when he didn't come out fought him face to face backstage. It's the first thing he did at least.

[Kal-El Summers]

he's neck and neck with AJ who isn't even on RAW and gets kicked in the balls every week on smackdown. considering it's been a 4year main event push for roman he should be closer to cena than he is.

AJ has literally been the focus of SDL ever since he went there along with having two long title reigns and never losing a single feud. Him getting popped in the balls doesn't even come close to diminishing how heavy his push on SDL has been. :/

you seem to clearly have a dog in this fight and might not be looking at things objectively.

Never claimed to be "objective" there, champ.

I actually like Roman and I 100% agree with the bolded part. Beyond a certain point, WWE must simply re-consider the entire Roman thing. WWE should push people that have gotten over organically instead of tearing them down. Roman should be a superstar but not the main attraction until they can book him sensibly.

It's obvious that someone in WWE is taking into account the negative reaction that Roman gets from live audiences (which is a major part of the ridiculousness with him and Brock Lesnar). According to some reports, parts of the audience walked out on the Joe/Reigns match at Backlash, if that doesn't scream apathy then I don't know what does.

They walked out right after the match ended because the show ran long.

Regarding Roman and Jinder, he didn't have to brutalize Jinder, he could have just interfered in his match too or something. Stone Cold Steve Austin and a host of faces used to do it all he time.

Say what now? Do you have some sort of selective memory about Austin?

[XPac]

AJ has literally been the focus of SDL ever since he went there along with having two long title reigns and never losing a single feud. Him getting popped in the balls doesn't even come close to diminishing how heavy his push on SDL has been. :/



Never claimed to be "objective" there, champ.




They walked out right after the match ended because the show ran long.



Say what now? Do you have some sort of selective memory about Austin?

Yeah, I don't get the notion that AJ being Romans peer as far as selling merch is somehow a knock against Roman. AJ is the top face on Smackdown, so if there's one guy on the full time roster that should be a peer to Roman, the top selling face on RAW, it should be him. Ideally I think that's how it's supposed to work. If you're Vince and you're seeing the top faces of both your brands being the top full time merch sellers, then you're probably good with that.

[Username taken]

AJ has literally been the focus of SDL ever since he went there along with having two long title reigns and never losing a single feud. Him getting popped in the balls doesn't even come close to diminishing how heavy his push on SDL has been. :/



Never claimed to be "objective" there, champ.




They walked out right after the match ended because the show ran long.



Say what now? Do you have some sort of selective memory about Austin?

Not really.

Stone Cold interfered in matches all the time particularly in the early part of his push.

That's not to say he didn't brutalize people but that wasn't all he did. What they're doing with Roman is trying a little too hard.

[XPac]

Not really.

Stone Cold interfered in matches all the time particularly in the early part of his push.

That's not to say he didn't brutalize people but that wasn't all he did. What they're doing with Roman is trying a little too hard.

Basically Roman is in the same face mold as say an Austin or an Undertaker. He's a face yes... but he's not necessarily a particularly nice human being. Not every face is a John Cena... I'll even go so far as to say that mold of face at the top at least is starting to become extince.

Roman even as a face is doing some things that back in the 80's might have been reserved more for heels. But that's less about Roman as a character and more where wrestling has evolved too. The difference between a heel and a face is often a very thin line. Faces can be dicks too... more than anything I think the ONLY difference is that faces aren't cowardly and don't insult the crowd. That's basically it.

BUt ultimately that's why I just don't buy the criticism of Roman for his treatment of Jinder. Again, to me what we saw is fairly common place at this point in wrestling. I think it's basically people just looking for reasons to jump on Roman. A gurantee you if Styles did the EXACT same thing with Nakamura on Smackdown no one would say a thing about it.

[titanfan]

AJ has literally been the focus of SDL ever since he went there along with having two long title reigns and never losing a single feud. Him getting popped in the balls doesn't even come close to diminishing how heavy his push on SDL has been. :/

He has a pretty big losing streak at one point at least in PPV's/big matches in between his pushes.

And he did put over James Ellsworth like 3 times!

[TheInvisibleMan]

half the field for the UK tourney announced today

new faces with the exception of Jack Gallagher and 1 guy from last year (cant recall his name)

[Malvolio]

AJ has literally been the focus of SDL ever since he went there along with having two long title reigns and never losing a single feud. Him getting popped in the balls doesn't even come close to diminishing how heavy his push on SDL has been. :/



Never claimed to be "objective" there, champ.




They walked out right after the match ended because the show ran long.



Say what now? Do you have some sort of selective memory about Austin?

Exactly. Stone Cold went beyond backstage. He attacked Booker T in a supermarket and he attacked Vince in his hospital room!